Author Topic: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage  (Read 15685 times)

Offline Triton28

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K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« on: April 22, 2013, 10:27:38 AM »
Continued from this thread:  http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,345669.165.html

My $1.05:

New players will find the K4 a retarded conglomeration of parts that don't seem to work well together.   :bhead

Vets who spend some time to learn the torque and 30mm will find a pure killing machine that ends fights with insane quickness.   :joystick: :banana:

I'd say the ENY is about right.   :)
Fighting spirit one must have. Even if a man lacks some of the other qualifications, he can often make up for it in fighting spirit. -Robin Olds
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Offline Karnak

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #1 on: April 22, 2013, 10:40:10 AM »
Don't be daft Karnak if K4s were are so much 'pure easymode' why is it that the arena is full of P51s and not K4s?
Mud moving and it is the MUSTANG, it WON THE WAR!!!!

Seriously, the Bf109K-4 is about an 8 on the scale of ease of use.  A Spitfire Mk XVI would be a 10.  P-51D is probably about an 8 as well.

Hard things would be the Bf109G-6, P-40E and so on.
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Offline ink

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #2 on: April 22, 2013, 10:49:02 AM »
Mud moving and it is the MUSTANG, it WON THE WAR!!!!

Seriously, the Bf109K-4 is about an 8 on the scale of ease of use.  A Spitfire Mk XVI would be a 10.  P-51D is probably about an 8 as well.

Hard things would be the Bf109G-6, P-40E and so on.

I disagree.....none of them are "difficult" to fly...

some are very difficult to hit with...... IE the K4

some are poorly powered/armed so that makes it difficult to get kills.....

some are very responsive do all things well(or most)....are easy to hit with...IE spit 16...LA7....KI84

some have such over powering attributes it makes them easy mode even for noobs ...IE responsiveness of 16...speed of 51.....

thats my take on it


 

Offline Karnak

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #3 on: April 22, 2013, 10:51:44 AM »
I disagree.....none of them are "difficult" to fly...
They aren't difficult to to fly.  They are difficult to win fights in against typical LWMA opponent aircraft given equal pilots.  When speaking of difficulty nobody is really talking about flying, otherwise the Typhoon probably wins the "hardest" prize simply due to torque.
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Offline Debrody

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #4 on: April 22, 2013, 10:55:48 AM »
After the Mossie, the K4 is super easy mode, for sure!

But look, SA is really easy in a K4, while it makes you thinking a lot in a G6. In the other hand, close combat is very easy in a Merlin-Spitfire, medicore in a G6 or K4 and extremely difficult in a 190 or P47.
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Offline Karnak

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #5 on: April 22, 2013, 11:14:02 AM »
The thing about the K-4 is that it gives you a lot of powerful tools to win fights with.  It doesn't really have the tool that ultra-noobs rely on, sheer turn rate, but with only a little development beyond that it opens up all sorts of things most enemy fighters can't match.

The P-51D also doesn't have sheer turn rate going for it.
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Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #6 on: April 22, 2013, 12:00:18 PM »
There is nothing easy about the 109K-4, except that it gets a player where they want to go in one of the quickest ways possible in AH.  It is one of the better interceptors in the game.  It is not, however, a air superiority fighter, or even a dog fighters per say.  It is an interceptor.  Sure, there are some players who know the torque and acceleration abilities and how to harness it, but in general it is NOT an easy mode plane.

The best examples of "easy mode" planes are as follows: Spitfire Mk XVI (Spit16), La7, and NiK2.  The P51D can also be considered as such for the most part, but the learning curve is very short almost to the point of not worth mentioning.  The Spit16, La7, and George are truly "get in and fly and dominate" planes, and shame on any "vet" who takes them in to the virtual skies.   ;)
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Offline danny76

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #7 on: April 22, 2013, 12:03:47 PM »
They aren't difficult to to fly.  They are difficult to win fights in against typical LWMA opponent aircraft given equal pilots.  When speaking of difficulty nobody is really talking about flying, otherwise the Typhoon probably wins the "hardest" prize simply due to torque.

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Offline Triton28

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #8 on: April 22, 2013, 12:14:43 PM »
I should add that while I don't think the K4 is easy mode, it does lend itself to pilots becoming one trick ponies.  When I first started flying AH, probably 90% of K4's killed me by simply going vertical at the merge, chopping throttle, kicking rudder, suddenly ending up nose down WAY before I can get around... boom boom boom... I'm in the tower.  That one move was repeated on me over and over until I finally got smart enough to try and not give them that move.  Eureka!  I suddenly had a bit more success against them. 

So I guess if that's all a particular K4 pilot knows how to do, it could be considered easy mode since no other plane that I've seen can dump E that quickly and trade nose to tail that fast.
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Offline Wiley

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #9 on: April 22, 2013, 12:17:46 PM »
There is nothing easy about the 109K-4, except that it gets a player where they want to go in one of the quickest ways possible in AH.  It is one of the better interceptors in the game.  It is not, however, a air superiority fighter, or even a dog fighters per say.  It is an interceptor.  Sure, there are some players who know the torque and acceleration abilities and how to harness it, but in general it is NOT an easy mode plane.

The best examples of "easy mode" planes are as follows: Spitfire Mk XVI (Spit16), La7, and NiK2.  The P51D can also be considered as such for the most part, but the learning curve is very short almost to the point of not worth mentioning.  The Spit16, La7, and George are truly "get in and fly and dominate" planes, and shame on any "vet" who takes them in to the virtual skies.   ;)

It can escape from the vast majority of the planeset simply by going up, and has excellent acceleration over most of the set.  I can't disagree with you on your 'true easy mode' planes, but the K4 simply isn't that far behind them in terms of ease of use other than gunnery, which IMO is huge.

I think there's an additional category that's worth mentioning when it comes to planes like the K4.  To me, they're the ones that take some getting used to, but if you put the time in they have a lot to offer either in their limited type of fight, or in general once you become familiar with them.

A two weeker's not going to jump into them and be a killer, but once you've got your head wrapped around them, they're possible and fairly easy to do well in.

I'm thinking planes like the 109K4, 190D9, the P47D-11/M/N.  Put a two weeker in any of them, they're not going to do much.  Put in an average dweeb who's been around for 6 months to a year, and if he puts in the time to get comfortable with them, he can use them effectively against pilots of equal or lesser skill.

Then there's the stuff that is actually somewhat difficult to prevail with in the MA's like the P40s, early 109s, etc...

Wiley.
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Offline HighTone

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #10 on: April 22, 2013, 12:20:12 PM »
I have to laugh at this thread...

The plane is just a tool. A good pilot will get the most/best out of his tools. Everything else is just preference or chest thumping.  :ahead

And the whole "pilots with equal skill argument".....lol....which is about what 10% of sorties you will run into a pilot that is of comparable skill.

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Offline Triton28

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #11 on: April 22, 2013, 12:59:16 PM »
I have to laugh at this thread...

The plane is just a tool. A good pilot will get the most/best out of his tools. Everything else is just preference or chest thumping.  :ahead

And the whole "pilots with equal skill argument".....lol....which is about what 10% of sorties you will run into a pilot that is of comparable skill.

The thread was created to keep Snailman's Megastats thread clean.  It sprang up from comments regarding the ENY of the 109's.  ENY discussions will almost inevitably come down to how "uber" a given plane is... and if we consider Uber = Easy mode, well...

By the way, why would you rail against chest thumping and then lolz at 90% of pilots being below your skill level?  I musta missed something..     
Fighting spirit one must have. Even if a man lacks some of the other qualifications, he can often make up for it in fighting spirit. -Robin Olds
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Offline pervert

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2013, 01:03:05 PM »
K4 is average in terms of difficulty to fly, there are many easier rides, anything in LW with top line engine performance is always going to have a big advantage as you can't shoot what you can't reach. Of the Late war it would be a toss up between the 38s and the 190s in terms of difficulty in fighting in, easiest plane would be the KI-84 or spitfires to dogfight in, with the KI shaving it with the bigger engine. Oh and hardest plane to fly in game is the Camel F1  :joystick:



Offline Wiley

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #13 on: April 22, 2013, 01:05:20 PM »
By the way, why would you rail against chest thumping and then lolz at 90% of pilots being below your skill level?  I musta missed something..     

I actually have to agree with that point.  90% of the time, I find one of two things-  I either am noticeably better/in a much better situation than my current opponent, or I am noticeably worse/in a much worse situation than my current opponent.

Very rarely do you wind up in a fair fight, co-E, with a roughly equivalent opponent.  90% is probably a low estimate.

Wiley.
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Offline BaldEagl

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Re: K4 is easy mode vs. K4 is a symbol of courage
« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2013, 01:18:10 PM »
The K4's not that hard to fly althought it has it's quirks.  It's actually not that had to hit with either.  I was flying an La-5 the other night and that plane is hard to hit with; harder than the K-4.

The K-4 is a best of all worlds fighter.  It can turn with the jacks of all trades well enough to score a killer hit and is as fast or faster than the P-51 depending on alt/WEP.  It will outclimb most planes and once you learn to use the torque it can do things others can't.

20 ENY seems high to me.  It should be more like 10-15.
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