Seaplanes/Floatplanes/Flying Boats

[TGG93]

I am aware threads have been made in the past in regards to the addition of these aircraft and the possible roles they would fill in Aces High. I would like to share some of my thoughts on this.

I think that seaplanes, although slow and cumbersome, can have a viable place in Aces High. They could be used as a recon platform and could receive an icon range bonus for aircraft similar to what the Storch gets for vehicles, they could be used as a quick aircraft to put in the air to defend a port, they could be catapulted from a ship to give it an eye in the sky, they could be used as a strike aircraft carrying a bomb load or if submarines were added in future they could be equipped with depth charges and go sub hunting.

I think seaplanes should be launched in one of three ways, depending on the size of the seaplane. I would split the seaplanes into two groups, small and large. Small seaplanes are what they say they are – small, single engined aircraft with 3 or less crew members. Large seaplanes are also what they say they are – 2 or 4 engined aircraft with a larger crew.

All seaplanes would be able to be launched from an airfield and take off and land in a conventional manner with wheeled landing gear (presuming the aircraft has them, which I believe most did) and could be equipped with bombs, torpedos or depth charges (again, if subs are implemented) depending on whether or not they could carry them. A new hangar could be added for seaplanes or they could be linked to the existing bomber/fighter hangars.

A seaplane hangar would be added to the port, sitting in the water. Again, all types of seaplane could launch from here and would be able to "land" their sorties by landing within the vicinity of the hangar. If the hangar is destroyed then no seaplanes can be deployed.

Lastly, small seaplanes would be able to be catapulted from the decks of cruisers. This would act much like aircraft do with carriers, if the cruiser is destroyed then no more seaplanes for that fleet. Again, landing in the vicinity of a friendly cruiser would allow you to land your sortie.

I have put together a list of aircraft I think would work with this system, if there are any others you think would work then please go ahead and share. I have avoided biplanes simply because there are no other ones in the arenas. Some of the info counts entire production of all models (entered service, number produced) and other info is specific to the model given. Further research into models is definitely required, I've only included rough specifications of certain models, not necessarily the models that would be added.

Please share your thoughts.

(aircraft posted in separate replies due to character limit)

[TGG93]

Small Seaplanes (airfields, ports & cruisers):

Japan

Aichi E13A "Jake"

Manufacturer: Aichi
Model: E13A1
Crew: 3
Entered Service: 1940
Number Produced: 1418
Engine: 1x Mitsubishi Kinsei-43, 750kW
Weights: 4000 kg / 8819 lb (take off), 2642 kg / 5825 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 14.5 m / 48 ft 7 in (wingspan), 11.3 m / 37 ft 1 in (length), 7.4 m / 24 ft 3 in (height), 36.0 m² / 387.50 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 375 km/h / 233 mph (max speed), 220 km/h / 137 mph (cruise speed), 8730 m / 28650 ft (ceiling), 2100 km / 1300 miles (range)
Armament: 1x 20 mm cannon, 1x 7.7 mm machine gun, 1x 250 kg bomb





http://www.aviastar.org/air/japan/aichi_e13a.php

Aichi E16A "Paul"

Manufacturer: Aichi
Model: E16A2
Crew: 2
Entered Service: 1943
Number Produced: 256
Engine: 1x Mitsubishi MK8D Kensei-54, 975kW
Weights: 4553 kg / 10038 lb (take off), 2945 kg / 6493 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 12.81 m / 42 ft 0 in (wingspan), 10.83 m / 36 ft 6 in (length), 4.79 m / 16 ft 9 in (height), 28.0 m² / 301.39 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 435 km/h / 270 mph (max speed), 330 km/h / 205 mph (cruise speed), 10000 m / 32800 ft (ceiling), 2420 km / 1510 miles (range)
Armament: 2x 20 mm cannons, 1x 13 mm machine gun, 1x 250 kg bomb





http://www.aviastar.org/air/japan/aichi_e16a.php

Nakajima A6M2-N "Rufe"

Manufacturer: Nakajima
Model: A6M2-N
Crew: 1
Entered Service: 1942
Number Produced: 327
Engine: 1x Nakajima NK1C Sakae-12, 705kW
Weights: 2460 kg / 5423 lb (take off), 1912 kg / 4235 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 12.0 m / 39 ft 4 in (wingspan), 10.1 m / 33 ft 2 in (length), 4.3 m / 14 ft 1 in (height), 22.44 m² / 241.54 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 435 km/h / 270 mph (max speed), 300 km/h / 186 mph (cruise speed), 10000 m / 32800 ft (ceiling), 1780 km / 1106 miles (range)
Armament: 2x 20 mm cannons, 2x 7.7 mm machine guns, 2x 60kg bombs





http://www.aviastar.org/air/japan/nakajima_a6m-n.php

Kawanishi N1K Kyofu "Rex"

Manufacturer: Kawanishi
Model: N1K1
Crew: 1
Entered Service: 1943
Number Produced: 97
Engine: 1x Mitsubishi MK4E Kasei-15, 1150kW
Weights: 3712 kg / 8184 lb (take off), 2752 kg / 6067 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 12.0 m / 39 ft 4 in (wingspan), 10.59 m / 35 ft 9 in (length), 4.75 m / 16 ft 7 in (height), 23.5 m² / 252.95 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 480 km/h / 298 mph (max speed), 365 km/h / 227 mph (cruise speed), 10560 m / 34650 ft (ceiling), 1650 km / 1025 miles (range)
Armament: 2x 20 mm cannons, 2x 7.7 mm machine guns, 2x 30kg bombs





http://www.aviastar.org/air/japan/kawanishi_n1k.php

United States of America

Vought OS2U Kingfisher

Manufacturer: Vought
Model: OS2U-3
Crew: 2
Entered Service: 1940
Number Produced: 1925
Engine: 1x Pratt & Whitney R-985-AN-2, 336kW
Weights: 2722 kg / 6001 lb (take off), 1870 kg / 4123 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 10.95 m / 36 ft 11 in (wingspan), 10.31 m / 34 ft 10 in (length), 4.61 m / 15 ft 1 in (height), 24.0 m² / 262 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 264 km/h / 164 mph (max speed), 3960 m / 13000 ft (ceiling), 1296 km / 805 miles (range)
Armament: 2x .50 cal machine guns, 2x 45 kg bombs





http://www.aviastar.org/air/usa/vought-sik_vs-210.php

Curtiss SO3C Seamew

Manufacturer: Curtiss
Model: SO3C-2C
Crew: 2
Entered Service: 1942
Number Produced: 795
Engine: 1x Ranger SGV-770-8, 447kW
Weights: 2599 kg / 5730 lb (take off), 1943 kg / 4284 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 11.58 m / 38 ft 0 in (wingspan), 11.23 m / 37 ft 10 in (length), 4.57 m / 15 ft 0 in (height), 26.94 m² / 289.98 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 277 km/h / 172 mph (max speed), 201 km/h / 125 mph (cruise speed), 4815 m / 15800 ft (ceiling), 1851 km / 1150 miles (range)
Armament: 1x .30 cal machine gun, 1x .50 cal machine gun, 2x 45 kg bombs





http://www.aviastar.org/air/usa/curtiss_model82.php

Curtiss SC Seahawk

Manufacturer: Curtiss
Model: SC-1
Crew: 1
Entered Service: 1944
Number Produced: 577
Engine: 1x Wright R-1820-62, 1007kW
Weights: 4082 kg / 8999 lb (take off), 2867 kg / 6321 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 12.50 m / 41 ft 0 in (wingspan), 11.09 m / 36 ft 5 in (length), 3.89 m / 13 ft 9 in (height), 26.01 m² / 279.97 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 504 km/h / 313 mph (max speed), 201 km/h / 125 mph (cruise speed), 11370 m / 37300 ft (ceiling), 1006 km / 625 miles (range)
Armament: 2x .50 cal machine guns, 2x 150 kg bombs





http://www.aviastar.org/air/usa/curtiss_model97.php

Germany

Arado Ar 196

Manufacturer: Arado
Model: 196-A3
Crew: 2
Entered Service: 1939
Number Produced: 541
Engine: 1x BMW 132K, 705kW
Weights: 3730 kg / 8223 lb (take off), 2990 kg / 6593 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 12.4 m / 40 ft 8 in (wingspan), 11 m / 36 ft 1 in (length), 4.45 m / 14 ft 7 in (height), 28.4 m² / 306 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 310 km/h / 193 mph (max speed), 255 km/h / 158 mph (cruise speed), 7000 m / 22960 ft (ceiling), 1070 km / 670 miles (range)
Armament: 2x 20 mm cannons, 2x 7.92 mm machine guns, 2x 50 kg bombs





http://www.aviastar.org/air/germany/arado_ar-196.php

[TGG93]

Large Seaplanes (airfields & ports):

United Kingdom

Short S.25 Sunderland

Manufacturer: Short
Model: S.25 Sunderland Mk V
Crew: 9 - 11
Entered Service: 1938
Number Produced: 777
Engine: 4x Pratt & Whitney R-1830-90-B Twin Wasps, 895kW
Weights: 29480 kg / 64993 lb (take off), 16740 kg / 36906 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 34.38 m / 113 ft 10 in (wingspan), 26 m / 85 ft 4 in (length), 10.52 m / 35 ft 6 in (height), 156.72 m² / 1686.92 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 343 km/h / 213 mph (max speed), 285 km/h / 178 mph (cruise speed), 5455 m / 17900 ft (ceiling), 4300 km / 2672 miles (range)
Armament: 2x .50 cal machine guns, 10x .30 cal machine guns, 2250 kg of bombs





http://www.aviastar.org/air/england/short_sunderland.php

Japan

Kawanishi H6K "Mavis"

Manufacturer: Kawanishi
Model: H6K5
Crew: 10
Entered Service: 1938
Number Produced: 215
Engine: 4x Mitsubishi Kinsei-51, 975kW
Weights: 17500 kg / 38581 lb (take off), 12380 kg / 27293 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 40.0 m / 131 ft 3 in (wingspan), 25.63 m / 84 ft 1 in (length), 6.27 m / 21 ft 7 in (height), 170 m² / 1829.86 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 380 km/h / 236 mph (max speed), 255 km/h / 158 mph (cruise speed), 9560 m / 31350 ft (ceiling), 4870 km / 3026 miles (range)
Armament: 1x 20 mm cannon, 4x 7.7 mm machine guns, 1000 kg of bombs or 2x 800 kg torpedos





http://www.aviastar.org/air/japan/kawanishi_h6k.php

Kawanishi H8K "Emily"

Manufacturer: Kawanishi
Model: H8K2
Crew: 9
Entered Service: 1942
Number Produced: 167
Engine: 4x Mitsubishi MK4Q Kasei-22, 1380kW
Weights: 24500 kg / 54014 lb (take off), 18380 kg / 40521 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 38.0 m / 125 ft 8 in (wingspan), 28.13 m / 92 ft 3 in (length), 9.15 m / 30 ft 0 in (height), 160 m² / 1722.22 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 460 km/h / 286 mph (max speed), 290 km/h / 180 mph (cruise speed), 8850 m / 29050 ft (ceiling), 7050 km / 4381 miles (range)
Armament: 3x 20 mm cannons, 4x 7.7 mm machine guns, 2000 kg of bombs or 2x 800 kg torpedos





http://www.aviastar.org/air/japan/kawanishi_h8k.php

United States of America

Martin PBM Mariner

Manufacturer: Martin
Model: PBM-1
Crew: 7
Entered Service: 1940
Number Produced: 1285
Engine: 2x Wright R-2600-12, 1300kW
Weights: 25425 kg / 56000 lb (take off), 15048 kg / 33175 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 36.0 m / 118 ft 0 in (wingspan), 23.5 m / 79 ft 10 in (length), 5.33 m / 27 ft 6 in (height), 131 m² / 1408 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 330 km/h / 205 mph (max speed), 240 km/h / 149 mph (cruise speed), 6040 m / 19800 ft (ceiling), 4800 km / 3000 miles (range)
Armament: 8x .50 cal machine guns, 1800 kg of bombs or 2x 1000 kg torpedos





http://www.aviastar.org/air/usa/martin_mariner.php

Consolidated PBY Catalina

Manufacturer: Consolidated
Model: PBY-5A
Crew: 6 - 10
Entered Service: 1936
Number Produced: 3305
Engine: 2x Pratt & Whitney R-1830-92 Twin Wasp, 895kW
Weights: 16066 kg / 35240 lb (take off), 9485 kg / 20910 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 31.70 m / 104 ft 0 in (wingspan), 19.46 m / 63 ft 10 in (length), 6.15 m / 21 ft 1 in (height), 130 m² / 1400 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 314 km/h / 196 mph (max speed), 201 km/h / 125 mph (cruise speed), 4000 m / 15800 ft (ceiling), 4030 km / 2520 miles (range)
Armament: 3x .30 cal machine guns, 2x .50 cal machine guns, 1800 kg of bombs or 2x 1000 kg torpedos





http://www.aviastar.org/air/usa/cons_catalina.php

Germany

Heinkel He 115

Manufacturer: Heinkel
Model: He 115 C-1
Crew: 3
Entered Service: 1939
Number Produced: 138
Engine: 2x BMW 132K, 706kW
Weights: 10400 kg / 22928 lb (take off), 5290 kg / 11670 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 22.28 m / 73 ft 1 in (wingspan), 17.30 m / 56 ft 9 in (length), 6.60 m / 21 ft 7 in (height), 87.5 m² / 942 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 327 km/h / 203 mph (max speed), 5200 m / 17100 ft (ceiling), 2100 km / 1305 miles (range)
Armament: 1x 20 mm cannon, 2x 7.92 mm machine guns, 5x 250 kg bombs or 2x 250 kg bombs and 1x 800kg torpedo





http://www.aviastar.org/air/germany/he-115.php

Dornier Do 24

Manufacturer: Dornier
Model: Do 24 T-1
Crew: 6
Entered Service: 1937
Number Produced: 279
Engine: 3x Bramo 323R-2 Fafnir, 735kW
Weights: 18400 kg / 40565 lb (take off), 10600 kg / 23369 lb (empty)
Dimensions: 27.0 m / 89 ft 7 in (wingspan), 21.9 m / 72 ft 10 in (length), 5.8 m / 19 ft 0 in (height), 108.0 m² / 1162.50 sq ft (wing area)
Performance: 340 km/h / 211 mph (max speed), 255 km/h / 158 mph (cruise speed), 5900 m / 19350 ft (ceiling), 4800 km / 2983 miles (range)
Armament: 1x 20 mm cannon, 2x 7.92 mm machine guns, 600 kg of bombs





http://www.aviastar.org/air/germany/dorn_do-24.php

[Zacherof]

Yes!!!!



Am I the only one looking at the float planes as a potential defense fighter???

[Arlo]

A seaplane hangar would be added to the port, sitting in the water. Again, all types of seaplane could launch from here and would be able to "land" their sorties by landing within the vicinity of the hangar. If the hangar is destroyed then no seaplanes can be deployed.

Lastly, small seaplanes would be able to be catapulted from the decks of cruisers. This would act much like aircraft do with carriers, if the cruiser is destroyed then no more seaplanes for that fleet. Again, landing in the vicinity of a friendly cruiser would allow you to land your sortie.

Please share your thoughts.

(aircraft posted in separate replies due to character limit)

'Vicinity' landings may be the issue. Currently, if you're not on the runway or deck you ditch. Perhaps
HT can code vicinity landings, I'm not sure. The cruiser landing might be a chore since the ship cannot
stop to take you aboard (as it could in reality). You would have to probably land in front of it and hope
someone doesn't change course on you.

Cat launched 'fleet spotters' would be dead meat in the LWMA but may be cool for events.

Larger seaplanes would merely be waterborne attack/bomber craft (like the 'Black Cats').

I'm not seeing submarines in AH's future, myself - but HT knows more when it comes to
limits.

[Arlo]

Yes!!!!



Am I the only one looking at the float planes as a potential defense fighter???

Perhaps. 

[gyrene81]

They could be used as a recon platform and could receive an icon range bonus for aircraft similar to what the Storch gets for vehicles

that is the one point i personally would have issue with. aircraft already have an icon range of 6000 yards (18,000 feet) why would a float plane get more? are the eyes of the crew in float planes supposed to be better than other planes? as long as the radar on the carrier is intact, there is no need for the float plane to recon for anything except maybe an enemy cv group, even then nearly any of the existing carrier aircraft are better suited to the task of flying around looking for enemy aircraft and ships. anyone that wants to go slow and carry a small bomb can up a d3a.

the pby's could have a supply and troop option as well as bombs. it's been a while but i think the sunderland and h8k could too...have to check into that.

[Zacherof]

Got the specs of the "Duck"??

[gyrene81]

'Vicinity' landings may be the issue. Currently, if you're not on the runway or deck you ditch. Perhaps
HT can code vicinity landings, I'm not sure. The cruiser landing might be a chore since the ship cannot
stop to take you aboard (as it could in reality). You would have to probably land in front of it and hope
someone doesn't change course on you.

vicinity landing at ports would be easy to implement. the docks are perfect for it. if i remember correctly there is one empty dock, just make that spot the "safe landing" zone and the float plane has to pull up into it for a successful landing.

alternatively, lol, when you're in a hurry you could just knock the floats off the plane and belly land on concrete...

[Zacherof]

Are wing floats incorparated into a wing? Or are they merely "bolted" on

[gyrene81]

Are wing floats incorparated into a wing? Or are they merely "bolted" on

if someone told you to look it up...would you?

[Zacherof]

if someone told you to look it up...would you?

having trouble finding exact specs. 

[Bruv119]

I think the issue for most is that they would be deemed useless to gameplay.  

The storch proves this wrong everyday.

I give it a big +1  but believe it should only be enabled at ports.  My favourite would be the PBY Catalina.   Maybe give it the option to mark enemy CV's on the map if within a certain range of the CV.   Just taking off and landing at the ports would be cool  .

With the new wave motion on PT's maybe HT has already thought about this in the next version.  

[TGG93]

vicinity landing at ports would be easy to implement. the docks are perfect for it. if i remember correctly there is one empty dock, just make that spot the "safe landing" zone and the float plane has to pull up into it for a successful landing.

There's more than enough space for them!

[gyrene81]

having trouble finding exact specs. 

you're joking right? sounds like you're google impaired...think carefully, what information are you wanting? does it help to specify a plane? does it help to specify what you're looking at? what happens when you change 1 or 2 words?