Author Topic: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?  (Read 1528 times)

Offline Sloehand

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I'm hearing that there are no longer any really well-organized squadrons in AH like we had a few years back.  Squadrons that had a regular squad night each week, had a clear leadership structure, ran organized and disciplined missions, held serious ACM and mission profile training sessions, and were dedicated to being accomplished in all types of missions: fighter sweeps & dogfighting, bomber escort & interception, ground and base attack/fighters (Jabo), GV's, and heavy bombers.  Often these squadrons might also be involved in other areas of AH besides the MA such as FSO, Extreme Air Racing, King-Of-The-Hill, Tank Klub, and Scenarios, etc.

Can this be true?  Are they all gone?  Are there really no well-organized, involved, enthusiastic squadrons out there anymore?  I'm really curious to know.   :confused:

P.S.>   HBNNR {Haters and Baiters Need Not Reply} 
Jagdgeschwader 77

"You sleep safe in your beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do you harm."  - George Orwell
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Benjamin Franklin

Offline waystin2

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #1 on: November 19, 2014, 05:55:29 AM »
Are we organized?  Loosely.  Do we do it all?  Yes.  OINK
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Offline artik

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #2 on: November 19, 2014, 06:22:03 AM »
My squadron (101 Red Squad, Israel) used to be like that.

However during squadron nights we spend most of the time on two types of missions:

- Training & Debriefing at DA, practicing various tactics 1vs1, 1vs2, 2vs2, etc. Close to special events we did specific plane training like once for Guadalcanal scenario we trained in F4F vs Zero or for Nieman practices CAS with IL-2+Yak-9 vs 109s.
- We actually played in scenarios or other SE which had very strong structure.

We rarely took an action as a squadron at MA.

My squadron is far from it used to be (it is barely alive).

However for the last scenario (Pacific War) I took a lead of a Charlie flight of around 8 pilots and actually created a squadron. We practiced a lot before the scenario, did various setups. It was a blast. I can proudly say that during the scenario itself we were one of the most organized squadrons. I had a great XO Loki that allowed to control the state of the squadron very efficiently, split merge, take control of flanks and finally cooperate efficiently as squadron as squadron subdivisions and as elements covering each other.

On the other hand during the last 4th frame when Charlie was disbanded and in the squadron I flew for the C&C wasn't in its best.

So it really depends on the squadron CO and the group leadership. There are some guys at MA flying in a small groups that "you shouldn't get near them". If you see 2 or 4 ponies, 109s or 190s flying at nice line abreast formation at MA... be sure that these guys are good, part of a squadron and know what they doing.

But this AFAIK mostly rare scenario at MA. Best squadron action can be found only at SEA.
Artik, 101 "Red" Squadron, Israel

Offline Scca

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #3 on: November 19, 2014, 07:12:23 AM »
The Arabian Knights....

Our squad night garners 10-15.  We do missions, fighter sweeps, and base defense. I remember an entire squad night spent killing ords effectively stopping a horde that was rolling bases.

We focus on flying wing pairs when ever possible and (IMHO) are one of the best at it in the MA.  We have been a regular in FSO, with one of our members a former CM.  Feel free to check out the FSO logs. you will see almost every frame we are listed as a top performing squad.  We are currently leading in allied overall squad kills, (and overall kills both sides) in Combat Challenge with one frame to go.  Finally, while the AH scoring system doesn't really "mean" a lot, according to it, we are usually in the top 10-20, this tour we are currently 5th.  I think that speaks to your "do it all" question.  Most of our pilots have been in the game for almost a decade.  We don't do a lot of training, but on occasion we do get together and respond to a training request if someone has it.  We are beholden to no chess piece.  We rotate countries each month so we get to meet the entire player base, enjoying their company no matter if they are red or green.

That being said, things aren't run like a military operation really.  We are mostly older fellows (I guess average age mid 40's), and we believe that you can have fun and perform well at the same time.  The on channel banter can get a little rough at time's so thin skinned people who don't get sarcasm may find it a bit overwhelming.  While some have said we are tightly organized, on squad channel however, we sound more like the keystone cops at times :)    It's a game, not real life... let's have fun...

Our mission statement is "Win with Pride, Lose with Dignity, Fight with Honor."    I feel we hold well to that, the whole time having a blast and killing red guys...
Flying as AkMeathd - CO Arabian Knights
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http://www.arabian-knights.org

Offline WWhiskey

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #4 on: November 19, 2014, 07:33:58 AM »
G3-MF
Flying since tour 71.

Offline BFOOT1

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Member of G3MF
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Offline RSLQK186

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #6 on: November 19, 2014, 05:26:19 PM »
I remember when my squad darkened the sky and could run two base captures and defend newly acquired territory at the same time. We still have fun but we don't do as we please anymore. There have been a lot of game changes that make a small coordinated effort difficult and that is all we are able to mount at this time.
Our original training core had real life experience and were military trained. Got tons of respect for our current team, but apples and oranges.

Organized squads? I can think of dozens that used to be. Now?
C-Hawks
G3-MF
LCA
The Few
The Damned
AKs
DFA
Jokers Jokers (your current squad. Say hay to Rude for me please)
Off the top of my head, sorry if I over looked any.
All of these squads seem to make their presents known when they have 5 or more on. That may be the best it gets these days.




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Offline kilo2

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #7 on: November 19, 2014, 07:34:53 PM »
I'm hearing that there are no longer any really well-organized squadrons in AH like we had a few years back.  Squadrons that had a regular squad night each week, had a clear leadership structure, ran organized and disciplined missions, held serious ACM and mission profile training sessions, and were dedicated to being accomplished in all types of missions: fighter sweeps & dogfighting, bomber escort & interception, ground and base attack/fighters (Jabo), GV's, and heavy bombers.  Often these squadrons might also be involved in other areas of AH besides the MA such as FSO, Extreme Air Racing, King-Of-The-Hill, Tank Klub, and Scenarios, etc.

Can this be true?  Are they all gone?  Are there really no well-organized, involved, enthusiastic squadrons out there anymore?  I'm really curious to know.   :confused:

P.S.>   HBNNR {Haters and Baiters Need Not Reply}  

To answer your question, probably.

Spelling out the acronym after you use the acronym, defies the point.
X.O. Kommando Nowotny
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"Never abandon the possibility of attack."

Offline Sloehand

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #8 on: November 19, 2014, 07:47:50 PM »
To answer your question, probably.

Spelling out the acronym after you use the acronym, defies the point.

You type your posts your way...  and I'll type mine, my way.    :aok
Jagdgeschwader 77

"You sleep safe in your beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do you harm."  - George Orwell
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Benjamin Franklin

Offline Sloehand

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #9 on: November 19, 2014, 07:49:57 PM »
I remember when my squad darkened the sky and could run two base captures and defend newly acquired territory at the same time. We still have fun but we don't do as we please anymore. There have been a lot of game changes that make a small coordinated effort difficult and that is all we are able to mount at this time.
Our original training core had real life experience and were military trained. Got tons of respect for our current team, but apples and oranges.

Organized squads? I can think of dozens that used to be. Now?
C-Hawks
G3-MF
LCA
The Few
The Damned
AKs
DFA
Jokers Jokers (your current squad. Say hay to Rude for me please)
Off the top of my head, sorry if I over looked any.
All of these squads seem to make their presents known when they have 5 or more on. That may be the best it gets these days.



Offering no offense to the Jokers of course, but they are not an "organized" squad, at least not IMO.  They are a bunch of very skilled pilots and great guys who all know the game really well, and like flying together.  That is, whenever they happen to have enough online to fly missions.  Unfortunately, our C.O. Joker's work/home life does not allow him to be online all that much anymore, except for mornings at sporadic times.  Leadership is seriously lacking in the squadron, as he himself will tell you, because he simply can't be on as much as he used to be, and there is no real subordinate structure of officers in place to support him and lead missions in his absence.  Basically, it's catch-as-catch-can as far as when we fly, and what we do, who leads the mission, and whether it's successful or not. 

On top of that, there is no training what-so-ever, no FSO since Busher left, and so far as I can see no interest on anyone's part in participating in any other AH activities outside of the MA.

The Jokers ARE the best guys going, but to my mind there is no purpose to the squadron other than a place to hang out.  Which is fine for some (it's their $15 after all), but I have way more fun learning how to fly better, figuring out how to take bases quicker, thinking up unique mission profiles, and enjoying all of the AH activities and events available to me with a functioning, organized squad.

Hence, my original question.
Jagdgeschwader 77

"You sleep safe in your beds because rough men stand ready in the night to visit violence on those who would do you harm."  - George Orwell
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety." - Benjamin Franklin

Offline Coalcat1

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #10 on: November 19, 2014, 08:09:50 PM »
Look up the 19th BG

Offline iKo

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #11 on: November 21, 2014, 01:26:42 AM »
Hey us Muppet's are very organized we all talk on the same squad channel now and then, and stuff like that right  :huh

Offline mbailey

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #12 on: November 21, 2014, 05:23:44 AM »
The Arabian Knights are probably what your looking for

Howdy AKMeathd....haven't bumped into you in the MAs in a while. Hope your well  :cheers:
Mbailey
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Offline Scca

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #13 on: November 21, 2014, 05:32:04 AM »
Howdy AKMeathd....haven't bumped into you in the MAs in a while. Hope your well  :cheers:
Howdy back.

Ya, game time is limited these days. Dealing with ailing in laws, wife and parent.  Just when I see the light at the end of the tunnel, I realize it's a train. 

This too shall pass (like a kidney stone I fear)  :salute
Flying as AkMeathd - CO Arabian Knights
Working on my bbs cred one post at a time

http://www.arabian-knights.org

Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: Q. - Are Any 'Disciplined, Do It All" Type Squadrons Still In The Game?
« Reply #14 on: November 21, 2014, 08:19:31 AM »
though "few" in nmumbers, Duxford Wing RAF does it all.   :aok
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.