Thoughts on the F4U....

[eddiek]

Not a whine, just an observation:

I have always figured it was not the planes that were uber, but the pilots.
Now I am wondering.......
Just got badly outturned by an F4U while in a turning fight with me in am A6M5.  Never saw separation of more than 900 yards to 1.1K, yet he was turned and coming back at me before I completed my turn.  IAS was between 170 and 210 the whole time.
Was more than a little blown away to see this happening, as the Zero was legendary for it's turning prowess, as well as the ability to loop at almost any speed.
Anyone else seen anything similiar?  I did not film it, as I was not expecting anything like it to happen.  
Was the F4U THAT good in a turn fight with the Zero?

[AKDejaVu]

I have never been able to turn inside of a Zeke with an F4u-1C.  I think there's more to what happened than meets the eye.

[By-Tor]

 Perhaps the F4U driver was wily enough to keep the fight very fast by using alot of nose down manuevers.That will keep the Zeke turning at its worst and the Hog at its best.
 Also the use of oblique turns against an opponent that is turning 'flatter',can give the 'illusion' of being out-turned.
 Just had a go with Ripsnort in a Zeke,me in an F4U and I was NOT able to turn inside him, but could at least hold him out of firing parameters until ground zero took away my ability to keep the fight fast.
 Just my thoughts,
 By-Tor

[Fishu]

I think that F4u was very good turner in high speeds, but should lose that ability soon as speed drops rapidly.

imho, F4u is too good as it is... at least C hog. (C is better than D in AH, no doubt)

[eddiek]

I appreciate all the feedback here......
The fight had only one vertical maneuver in it, the rest was totally horizontal.
Did not get too fast in the Zero, as I knew the high speed would adversely affect the maneuvering ability.  As a matter of fact, I have seen the Zero lose speed in a dive if the throttle is cut back very much, which defies explanation.  I purposely kept the speed low so that I could keep the plane where it would turn well.
Oh well, maybe I am just a crappy pilot......

[BotaBing]

For this entire tour, I have not flown anything but the f4u.

It's not the uber plane everyone cracks it up to be. I find it to be good at taking damage, good at dealing punishment with its 20mm cannons, and average to below-average at maneuvering and turning.

The situation you described doesn't sound at all implausible.

First, you have to know what your E was before the engagement started, and what the E was on the f4u. If he was at the top of his E curve and you at the bottom, that would make a difference.

Second, you have to know your engine temperature. If you had already burned up your WEP, and he had not used his at all but turned it on to fight you, that would make a difference.

Third, you would have to know his configuration and yours. If you were carrying droptanks and full ordinanace and 100% fuel, and he had nothing but a little bit of ammo and 25% fuel, that would make a difference.

Fourth, you would have to know who was using trim, who was not, who was using flaps, who was not, who was using combat-trim, who was not..basically, you would have to know who was a good pilot and who was not, or who was the better pilot.


There are a TON of variables in this game..thats what I am finding out in my month in the f4u. Basically, by flying this plane all month long, I have increased my skill as a f4u pilot tremendously. Last tour, I think I was lucky to get 1 kill per sortie max, and lots of sorties none at all.
This tour, its common for me to get 2 kills per sortie, and up to 4 or 5.

Hope that helps..other than that, don't know what to add.

[-ammo-]

WEP? A6M?

[Mark Luper]

I don't have Botabings time in type, but I did fly both the C and the D today and found them both very maneuverable. I could keep up with a N1K though I couldn't necessarily turn inside it. I couldn't sense any difference in the two planes, the two F4U's, other than the fact I don't care for the low fire rate of the 20mm's compared to the fire rate of the 50's.

I am a poor shot and it seems with the 50's I had better luck. I liked the plane and enjoyed my stay in it and I can't say I ever really enjoyed the Zeke. I prefer a fairly fast plane and normally fly the P-47.

Is the F4U flight model porked? Don't have a clue, never flew the real thing. It is fun to fly though.

------------------
MarkAT

"It is not the critic who counts,
it is the man in the arena..."
Teddy Roosevelt

[Westy]

 I prefer the -1D for the huge ammo load and the hight rate of fire of the .50's over the 20mm guns. Plus it's a muthaluvinbeautiful bird.

 -Westy

[GRUNHERZ]

Hi

Its not the same as against a zero but ive been able to turn the tables on a few spits in chog since 104 came out. The chog can be a real good turner in a sort of downward spiral manouver with flaps down.

thanks GRUNHERZ

[Fishu]

 

Originally posted by Westy:
I prefer the -1D for the huge ammo load and the hight rate of fire of the .50's over the 20mm guns. Plus it's a muthaluvinbeautiful bird.

 -Westy

At least D looks bit better with that yellow stripe  

[Hooligan]

eddiek:

Sounds like you could have seen a latency effect.

Hooligan

[Rocket]

I remember early in the beta I was fighting Cavey and he was in I believe a c205.  We ended up in an angles fight.  I ended up with the kill and Cavey hollared at me"How the hell did you just out turn me?????????".
The key was Hi and Lo yoyos. I cut the corners on the turn and Cavey missed it.  He thought I was flat turning with him.  There are many times a plane can turn with a better turning AC.

S!

Rocket

[Apache]

Grunherz hit on one of the clues, flaps down.   Works wonders.
If your IAS was 170 - 210, I 'll bet the hawg wasn't that slow. High speed, nose down turns and yo-yo's, with appropriate use of flaps makes the Corsair a difficult foe to overcome in the hands of an accomplished pilot.

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Apache
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