Author Topic: Another Buff Whine (with cheese...and FILM) (Read 1615 times)

Am0n · « **Reply #15 on:** December 13, 2001, 09:03:00 AM »

1 vrs 1 buffs vrs anything you should expect to die or be horribly damged. Thinking anything else leads to post like this. Ecpecialy vrs a B17 which at any given time can have 6-8 50s pointed at you.. thinking 8x50s shouldnt rip you apart is just silly in my opinion.

For the most part buff attacks are very ill planned from what ive seen in the MA. You gotta take your time and play with them, not just dive in shooting. Its best to fly close to them and gain alt, get infront of them and make hi angled HO slashing attacks. but that takes patients. The least ammount of time you stay in any gun solution, the more times they have to switch positions, the more likely you can hit and skip un harmed.. Sounds good anyway, until you run into that guy that switched to mouse controls in his buff

K West · « **Reply #16 on:** December 13, 2001, 09:06:00 AM »

"Theres only a Problem w short range weapons."

No there isn't. I flew both Yak 9's predominately for the past year and this last month I was strictly in 190-A8 (or 99% of the time anyway). In all three you must be close (less than 300 in range) to score lethal hits due to the ballistic drop in the 190 and due to the very small ammo load in the Yaks.
Course I learned every time I got shot down and I improved to the point that I drool when I see a bomber (course I drool a lot anyway but that's beside the point). Not once did I ever blurt out on the ubb or channel one about any uber-laser fifties and invincible buffs when I got shot down.

IMO take you (people in general. notHumble or Wulfmen specifically) your lumps, learn to shoot them down or leave them alone. I wish people would stop asking (asking, demanding, whining etc etc whatever) for changes which are in reality calls to make things easier which compensate for a lack of learned skill or patience to achieve it.

If I have to come in co-alt, I'm in trouble

Just fly parralell 1.2 off thier port or starboard and when you get to thier front quarter roll upside down, pull into them and roll inverted again. This places you justa wee bit lower than thier wing level. Aim at the cockpit as you come in. Lanc and B26 have no belly guns and thier upper turret can't traverse down well. The B17 has a belly turret but it turns too slow and has awful visibility

Westy

[ 12-13-2001: Message edited by: O'Westy ]

loser · « **Reply #17 on:** December 13, 2001, 10:50:00 AM »

humble if i remember correctly that was me in the B17.

It didnt look like you were going that fast to me. but hey, you have the film.

If you can remember if it was me (or check in the film.) ill post my point of view of the engagement.

Wulfmen · « **Reply #18 on:** December 13, 2001, 10:53:00 AM »

Westy full argreed
i have a Film, i take near 20min to Kill 2 B17 w my D9. it was a hard job and a get no Hits. Iam not the stupid six attacker.
I get Lancs from HO zoom from lower possition. B26 only from lower possition. But this B17 is a very bad think

Normal i get in from the side w full speed from higher possition. Its very hart to hit the Buff but its hart for the gunner to. I need 4 or 6 Attacks to bring a B17 down, from HO possition only one Attack.
But its all the time a Question "Who is Gunner" theres a few Person in the MA they shot me down from all angles.
W a little training u can kill anythink outa attacker range w a Buff. I get w B26 6 Niki Kills in one flight and get NO damage. I shot the brothers from 1.2-0.9K range in pieces

The only effective way to attack a Buff is teamwork, One attack and break and the other finish the Buff.

ede

Ripsnort · « **Reply #19 on:** December 13, 2001, 10:58:00 AM »

One of my training films for buff attack I use the Dora..in the film I use patience, and after 3 passes, the buff goes down, unfortunately, the films cannot be viewed in V1.09..I will get busy over the holiday break and see if I can get those remade again, pending some volunteers to help me making them from my squaddies...no promises though.

Kieran · « **Reply #20 on:** December 13, 2001, 11:08:00 AM »

It isn't a question of whether or not you can kill a buff- anyone can. What matters is if you can get the buff before he does irreparable harm to the base or HQ. If it takes too long to kill him you might as well let him fly home. He's out of action until he does.

Ripsnort · « **Reply #21 on:** December 13, 2001, 11:10:00 AM »

One other note too, make SURE your V-SYNC is ON, or you may encounter whats known as "rubber bullet syndrome"...this *used* to be a big factor in the hitting ability of weapons in earlier versions of AH, don't know if its much a factor with this newer version or not (Lephturn? feel free to jump in here...)

Voss · « **Reply #22 on:** December 13, 2001, 03:24:00 PM »

I can kill ANY buff in one pass with a high twelve to high six pass. Crossing the 3-9 line on the way down causes the upper turret to lose you. He will be dead by the time he regains guns-on, or switches to the belly as you egress.

The few times this doesn't work is when the buff is just below the shear layer. Passing through shear has this completely unrealistic trait of robbing you of all your energy, as well as bouncing your nose off target. Oh well, compensate the best you can and make multiple passes.

loser · « **Reply #23 on:** December 13, 2001, 04:52:00 PM »

vos id kill you in a second. this is a tard manouver......

the best run on a buff IMHO is a front quarter attack from 6 k above the buff

attack a buff like you would a ostwind and you will kill it every time...

ouch my cat just tore open my hand..he hates the sound of the keyboard

jpeg · « **Reply #24 on:** December 13, 2001, 08:22:00 PM »

You got in way too close.

Anything closer to D600 against a b17 and you WILL get hurt. Make fast sweeping passes from above and you can bring down the paper b17s in one pass.

Happens to me a lot and I've been able to do it also, on monday I downed a b17 in one short pass .. i think I hit 10 at most 20mm shots and the b17 starting going down .. 4 secs later got the kill for it.

Quite sad actually

Get ripsnort's film on how to down a bomber (although he has a very safe approach of doing it but its VERY effective)

jpeg · « **Reply #25 on:** December 13, 2001, 08:27:00 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Ripsnort:
One of my training films for buff attack I use the Dora..in the film I use patience, and after 3 passes, the buff goes down, unfortunately, the films cannot be viewed in V1.09..

1.09?

Damn Rip .. what kind of bribes have you been giving HTC to get that?

jpeg · « **Reply #26 on:** December 13, 2001, 08:56:00 PM »

Ok I just tested Ripsnort's b17attack film and it plays fine for me on 1.08 patch 6

(using directx 8.1, gf2)

humble · « **Reply #27 on:** December 15, 2001, 12:19:00 AM »

Been gone for 2 days shepparding my son's 4th grade class on fieldtrip....bunch of great replies (thanx very much)...I do want to clarify a couple things.

I'd like to post the clip 1st and formost so you can see it. I feel I flew a solid attack profile...not perfect but solid. I counted 11-12 flashes, 3-4 dead center on wing 1 on trailing edge of center wing, 1 on main body at wing root, 1 on vertical stabalizer and 5 on horizontal stabalizer/elvator...all fired from 100 yds in...all 20mm.

I was hit once (possibly twice....but I think that tail departing). At no time to I believe that more than top turret had a shot.
I was flying a curved variable G approach...I dont believe I was tracked well at all.

I'm not arguing the relatively minor damage to the buff...but was a little amazed. These were aweful tough birds...but I'd expect 11 to 33 20mm fired at less than 100 yds to do some serious damage (how many 20mm per flash anyway??).

Unless this is a golden bb type hit I just dont see that it's reasonable to expect the damage I did...pilot wound..yup..coolant or oil leak...yup...loss of a control surface...maybe...but shed enough to lose plane...hardly.

Again i'd very much appreciate the chance to post it for others to review.

Thanks for all the input.

loser · « **Reply #28 on:** December 15, 2001, 11:04:00 AM »

the question remains...was it me?