Oh MY, the "George" and the "Veltro"

[Brick]

gatt - no problem.    

Hey - what was the 3-engine bombers that the Italian AF flew?  I think I remember seeing some pictures of one, described as a medium bomber or something.  Wonder if those will ever make an apperance...

Andy

[gatt]

Oh well,
I think you all understand how much we are sensible to criticism to our beloved aircraft    

Brick,
I think your talking about the Savoia-Marchetti SIAI-79 Sparviero (Sparrowhawk). "The S.79s scored heavily, and a huge tonnage of ships were sunk, at the cost of many crews. Names of pilots like Buscaglia, Graziani, Erasi, Cimicchi and studmuffingioni became almost legendary. The last two big sea battles to be fought against the Royal Navy trying to supply Malta took place in June and August 1942. Good results were obtained, but the price in terms of men and machines was too high and the surviving ships reaching the island were enough to accomplish their task. With the Allied landings in French North Africa on November 1942, the S.79s were again compelled to attack ships moored in harbours, but meanwhile the aerial situation had changed completely and losses were very high. The 1941-42 average of eight torpedo hits for every aircraft lost fell to one hit for 2.5 aircraft lost in 1943!"

I dont think we'll ever see one of them in AH or WB.

Regards,
gatt
4th Stormo Caccia

 

[v-twin]

To Vermillion:


Hi Vermillion!
I'm an engineer too (in Mechanic), and even if my knowledge of aircraft design is really poor, I know that a lot of parameters are affecting the performances of an AC.
You may compare 2 cars wich have same hp, they may have similar top speed and acceleration, but on the street they can behave very different, because suspension, gear, weight distributions, brakes, etc, are different.
In the same way, the 205 and the 109 may have similar performances in speed, climb, etc, but a lot of other things are different: the shape and the contour of the wing, shape and area of the control surfaces, position of CG, weight distribution, and so on.
Thus, the behavior in the air can be very different.
Ciao!


v-twin
4°Stormo Caccia

[Vermillion]

v-twin:
I would agree with you arguement, if we were debating the design parameters of the aircraft, for instance, size, weight, or even horsepower.

They can be the same weight and fly differently. They can have the same horsepower and fly differently. They can have the same wing area, and fly quite differently.

But we are discussing direct measurements of its performance.

Therefore if its climbrate is the same, they are gonna climb at the same rate. If the max speeds are the same, well.... they will have the same speed. Get It?

To go back to your analogy of cars, we are not comparing horsepower, cubic inches, size of brakes. We are discussing, 0-60 times, top speed, 60-0 braking distances, cornering G tests.

True the factors you mentioned such as CG, wing desing, control surfaces, and all the others may be vastly different, but together they all determine performance.

And that is what I am comparing, performance, not the design parameters.

I had this exact same arguement with some guys in WB's when they announced that the Ki-61 Tony was to be modeled. I made the statement that it would perform  very similar to the Me109F (again same engine and similar airframe), and we debated it endlessly. Well, go fly the Ki-61 and the Me109F in WBs, they are very similar.

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Vermillion
WB's: (verm--), *MOL*, Men of Leisure, Goldlandia
AW's: (verm) ACCS, Aerial Crowd Control Services, Cland