Perk the Bulldozer!

[VOR]

Hey Lazs,

Nah, I'm with ya about not telling people what they can and can't have. No issue there. This isn't about legality at all, actually. It's about you being off your rocker

I was just yankin' yer chain anyhow. But on a serious note, I got a letter from the NRA asking me to renew my membership. Not gonna do it because the only action I have observed was to solicit more and more funds from me. I think their magazine stinks, I already have enough hats and stickers, and I'm still waiting for them to do something besides try and prove they aren't crazy.

Don't confuse this decision for having taken up a new agenda.

Edit: To expand on my earlier thoughts, this is a fight the pro-gun lobby will eventually lose out on. Although the fear of firearms may be irrational, here's the bottom line: it's easier for them to sway someone to their side of the argument than it is for us to sway someone to our side. Like it or not, it's coming. Consequently, alot weighs on the presentation of the message and the spokesman when it comes to trying to win a heart or mind to our side of the fence...in other words, the more you present yourself in an abrasive, demeaning way, the less likely you are to gain an ally.  Just some food for thought.

[Montezuma]

And people still say that land-use planning is boring.

[VOR]

Hey Lazs, noticed you were online. Gotta get to work, but would like to continue here if u feel inclined.

[storch]

Semiautomatic machineguns.



what moron printed that!  you girlymen are funny.

[lazs2]

vor.. I may well be "abrassive" but I am not defeatest.   Your handwringing does us no good either.

I believe you are wrong.   I see progress everywhere.  More and more states are passing right to carry laws... 37 now from 8 ten years ago... the best part is that it is working and being proven... people like lott are writing comprehensive studies debunking the myths..

shooting sports like cowboy action and IDPA are gaining huge followings these are on the one hand, fun and on the other defensive practice.   More and more concealed carry firearms are being produced.

The NRA... I don't agree with everything either and don't like getting dunned for money but what organization do you belong to that doesn't?  The American Rifleman is a great mag so far as I am concerned and... the NRA promotes childrens gun safety and supports shooting sports and ranges and lobbies for our rights... you sitting on your hands doesn't seem to be much if you will excuse me for saying.

as for you and I?  one "off his rocker and abrasive" and the other a defeatest who does nothing except... except what?   I may flatter myself but I bet a few people here have read what I said about guns and took a closer look at the facts... I do not have any illusions that the people who are neurotic will be swayed by me wether I am "abrasive" or smoothch their sissy butts.

I also take people out shooting whenever I can... especially young people.   I have never seen anyone walk away from a shooting session who didn't have a good time and wonder what all the fuss was about.

What do you do?

lazs

[VOR]

Hey again lazs. I wouldn't call it handwringing..somehow when you say that I envision some sort of worrywart with a receding hairline and ulcers. I think I'm more of a realist actually..hence my middle-of-the-road stance on most political issues. You know the old saying...the truth usually lies somewhere in the middle between your side and my side of the story. Hence, what you term "defeatism" I like to think of as a down to earth perspective. Hoping for the best, preparing for the worst.

As far as sitting on my hands goes...guilty as charged. I haven't written a single letter or made a single phone call since 94 I think. No excuse.

I also like to invite people to the range with me. As for young people, I really don't know any! My son is 9 and I bought his first rifle already..he'll get it next birthday I think (doesn't know about it yet). In the meantime we enjoy backyard plinking with his air rifle. He's a crack shot too, lemme tell ya! Apple doesn't fall far from the tree! Funny thing is, when I mention this to people they tend to gasp in shocked disbelief. Something to the effect of "How on earth could you give a gun to a kid?" For some reason, the immediate assumtion tends to be that I handed it to him and told him to go have fun. This is, of course, not the case, as I'm sure you know.

Take a look at this bulldozer guy. Personally, if I had to, I couldn't possibly turn it into a pro-gun argument. I'm kind of at a loss here. You and I both know there are plenty of armed and unarmed loonies out there...but I chalk this event up as another log on the anti-gun bonfire. It just seems to me they've got alot more firewood stored up than we do these days! I'll leave the lobbying to the experts here.

Ok, well that about sums up my point of view. Hopefully, I'm not *too* bad of an American.

[gofaster]

Heemeyer started down his road to revenge Friday afternoon. He bashed in the cement plant, then rumbled through town to the combination City Hall ... He then smashed the home of a former mayor who had supported the cement plant in the planning case,

Good for him.  Let those politicians pay for their crimes against the environment!

[capt. apathy]

just goes to show, never piss off a welder.  any half decent welder can convert a bulldozer to a tank in one over-night shift.

[Pooh21]

Originally posted by capt. apathy
just goes to show, never piss off a welder.  any half decent welder can convert a bulldozer to a tank in one over-night shift.

the A-Team could do it in 10 min.

[lazs2]

vor.. If you are teaching your children a respect and the enjoyment of firearms you are doing something.

I do believe that you are wrong tho.   I see progress.   I also don't understand what you are talking about on the NRA and their excellent magazine.   If you could point out one of the issues that you feel is nort right I could talk about it with you.   I have sent the magazine to people on this board.  

I admit to be outspoken and to having little patience with the mush heads that parrot anti gun drivel but... I was not defending the welders actions in this story ... re read what I wrote.. I was pointing out that our enemies, the anti gun rights people, are too stupid to even know what guns they are talking about and... I was defending the right of any person to own a .50 caliber semi auto.

How they use it is quite another thing.

Perhaps I am doing more harm than good but I am doing something and supporting those who are defending our rights..  I am willing to discuss it with anyone and, as I have proven I will be glad to take anyone shooting and they can use my guns and ammo... I have sent publications to those who wanted them.    Sorry if you think I am abrasive but...  most of the girly men liberals I offend as so far away from getting it that they are useless for anthing but to have fun ridiculing.

I am also just as bad when it comes to Hot Rods.

lazs

[VOR]

Hey lazs..about the magazine, I just meant that there is a general lack of new material for the writers to add. I've been reading these things for many years and not much seems to have come along in the way of "something different" unless discussing new gear. So, it was not exactly a fair statement for me to say it "stinks". It just doesn't really exite me all that much. Point conceded.

I didn't imply that you were supporting Mr. bulldozer the freedom fighter. A simple miscommunication. I only used his case as a case-in-point to illustrate the fact that you don't hear about many firearm success stories unless you go looking for them. Stories of failure and madmen are plentiful. Bad news just seems to sell more commercial slots than good news, but we already know this. Also, I find it increasingly difficult to present my arguments to the anti-gun types in light of this fact. When all you hear are stories of gang violence, school shootings, and bulldozer McGuyver the mad gunman types, you'll build a barrier that's hard to breach with logic, truth, or good intentions.

As for being off your rocker, no need to apologise to me! I'm not trying to tell you you're wrong, only asking you to consider your audience and tailor your message to them as necessary. As for those who have already closed their minds to the issue, oh well. I don't usually bother with them, but if you wanna poke em with a stick, then who am I to tell you you're wrong? Have fun.

[storch]

Originally posted by VOR
Hey lazs..about the magazine, I just meant that there is a general lack of new material for the writers to add. I've been reading these things for many years and not much seems to have come along in the way of "something different" unless discussing new gear. So, it was not exactly a fair statement for me to say it "stinks". It just doesn't really exite me all that much. Point conceded.

I didn't imply that you were supporting Mr. bulldozer the freedom fighter. A simple miscommunication. I only used his case as a case-in-point to illustrate the fact that you don't hear about many firearm success stories unless you go looking for them. Stories of failure and madmen are plentiful. Bad news just seems to sell more commercial slots than good news, but we already know this. Also, I find it increasingly difficult to present my arguments to the anti-gun types in light of this fact. When all you hear are stories of gang violence, school shootings, and bulldozer McGuyver the mad gunman types, you'll build a barrier that's hard to breach with logic, truth, or good intentions.

As for being off your rocker, no need to apologise to me! I'm not trying to tell you you're wrong, only asking you to consider your audience and tailor your message to them as necessary. As for those who have already closed their minds to the issue, oh well. I don't usually bother with them, but if you wanna poke em with a stick, then who am I to tell you you're wrong? Have fun.

I'm a life member of the NRA.  They are incessantly asking for money.  When I can I send it.  The reason for my financial support is that I believe that they are doing a consistently good job of chipping away at the stone that is the liberal mindset without the NRA we would be just like our european cousins with regard to our second amendment rights.  I would encourage you to send your money in right now.  If you can't afford it I will gladly send it for you.  Seriously.

[VOR]

Thanks for the offer Storch, but it's not a financial issue. I'm looking into some of the other lobby groups right now (didn't realise there were so many!). I may end up renewing with NRA if they end up being the best choice. More to follow.

[lazs2]

thanks vor.. I think.   I am sure we would get along just fine.

Again tho... you are seeing the glass half empty.   On this board you hear lot's of success stories with involving fireams.

I would really suggest that you read Lott's book "The bias against Guns" (why allmost everything you have ever been told about guns is wrong)

Lott would agree with you that there is a bias but he points it out and tells why... Also... buying his book is "doing something" because the more his message get's out the better.  

we used to take our 22 rifles to school to use them at NRA sponsored safety and marksmanship matches at the local gun range.   I look forward to seeing that happen again some time in the future.

the pendulum swung to the left a long way on the gun issue in the last couple of decades because most firearms guys were apathetic.   I believe the left has overextende themselves tho and gotten all tangled up in their lies (as the left is wont to do).   The pendulum is swinging back the other way.

If you havent read the rifleman in a while then you might be interested in the way they track gun rights bills and laws... we are making progress... the boogey men and myths are being expossed by such things as the real world benifiet  of concealled carry laws.

lazs

[storch]

Originally posted by VOR
Thanks for the offer Storch, but it's not a financial issue. I'm looking into some of the other lobby groups right now (didn't realise there were so many!). I may end up renewing with NRA if they end up being the best choice. More to follow.

Do post them if you find others that you consider worthwhile.