Thomas MacGuire

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Originally posted by Crumpp
I've read that between Richard Bong and Thomas McGuire,  McGuire was the true leader and Bong was the greedy one.

I got stuck at an AFB for several hours during a business trip.  The Terminal was named after Thomas McGuire and had a museum inside.  It was pretty interesting but that was one of things that struck me.  They had a letter from one of the guys that flew with both of them.  Said basically that Bong was more out for himself and was not big into teaching the other guys and McGuire was all about taking care of other folks.

Crumpp

Bong was a very selfless individual, and a very reserved person. Until he climbed into a P-38. He actually came back for what amounted to a second tour just to teach tactics and gunnery. He felt a duty to the men of his unit as well. That assessment of Bong is not really valid.

The writings of one or two should not be used to judge a person. For example Thropp was extremely bitter and angry, and was very critical of Weaver. He claimed at one point he thought that Fukuda got McGuire, but it turned out he was not even close enough to see what actually happened. Besides, Fukuda was behind Weaver shooting at him, and McGuire was trying to turn inside Fukuda and get him. It would be very difficult for Fukuda to have shot at McGuire if you think about it.

[straffo]

Originally posted by Kweassa
Maybe his flaps retracted.

rotlf

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Why does the above post not surprise me. Must be the source.

[straffo]

Take it easy man !

Have you an idea of the number of threads about autoretract  ? (and some threads are not indexed anymore in the BBS)


Tthe crusade on autoretract was killed by HT himself some 2 year ago see yourself :

Originally posted by hitech
No GUNERZER it is not true. 2 Questions are being mixed with 1 answere.

On the auto retract flaps question, it seems to me that everone who wants to get rid of auto retract flaps wan'ts flaps at faster speeds. If we were to get rid of the auto retract flaps the only difference would be ,instead of retracting the flap it would be damaged and unsible at the same speed they auto retract now.

The other questions is on a specific planes flap speed, they are set on a per plane basis with the data we have availble.


HiTech

And btw I didn't forget how open minded you are when you're not preaching for your how church.

[Citabria]

well its a shame neither one survived.

and it seems somthing less than coincidental that both top aces died in aircraft with engine problems occuring at the worst possible time.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Straffo, I've been here for well over 3 years, I know all about the auto retract issue. I lurked before I even registered for several months.

It does not excuse the stupidity and arrogance required to make a joke about the death of one of the greatest fighter pilots who ever flew.

Auto retract is a joke.

The death of Major Thomas B. McGuire is not.

I remember your childish arrogance in the discussion you speak of. Yes, those screaming little temper tantrums you threw about fuel. People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw rocks.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Originally posted by Citabria
well its a shame neither one survived.

and it seems somthing less than coincidental that both top aces died in aircraft with engine problems occuring at the worst possible time.

Yes, it is.

And no it isn't. Pure coincidence.

The engine explosion that killed Bong would have killed him where ever he was so long as he was in the plane. I read a report from a guy who was there. He heard the jet engine come apart, had heard it before, and knew what was going to happen. The explosion killed Bong, he was dead instantly.

[straffo]

If he have been so great he wouldn't have broke his own rule and perhaps survived.

Bong is certainly a better example of what an ace is.

[Crumpp]

Maybe his flaps retracted

Crumpp

[Slash27]

Bong is certainly a better example of what an ace is.

What would the French know about "aces" ?

[straffo]

What is your point here ?

Check Marin la Meslée for exemple

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/frenchaces/

[Slash27]

I felt like you were being as bellybutton just to be an bellybutton so I was doing the same.

to your French aces.

[Crumpp]

He's French, they come across that way whether they mean it or not!



Crumpp

[straffo]

Nope , it's just because I'm still imature even being 34 and I love nononsense jokes.

I didn't want to bash McGuire , I can imagine easily his death was not a good news for his familly.

I thought it was a silly funny joke.

I think Bong is a better example of what an ace is.

[Guppy35]

Originally posted by Captain Virgil Hilts
Dan,
Much of it comes from the project I was involved with that I spoke of. Also, some did come from "The Last Great Ace", the biography. As well as some stuff from the various sites on the Internet that had info we could verify. There was some stuff we got indirectly from Hal Gray as well. Mason actually interviewed Thropp just a few years ago, and talked to Fukuda in Japan. He spoke with the man who recovered McGuire from the wreckage and hid his body from the Japanese, at great risk to himself. Also, Mac spoke with Mason before his death a couple of years ago. There would be more there, but Mac was not well, and was not happy with the fact that McGuire was so much the focus of research on the group.

Thanks Savage.  Some interesting stuff to be sure.

My impression of McGuire from the stuff I've read was he was one of those love em or hate em guys.  Quick to anger with little tolerance for mistakes as well as being driven to be the best of the best.

Clearly he could lead, but it also seems clear his style grated on a lot of people.

Dan/Slack