Author Topic: Sanity Break out yet?  (Read 385 times)

Offline midnight Target

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Sanity Break out yet?
« on: September 28, 2004, 05:30:37 PM »
Just checkin.

Offline Sandman

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2004, 05:40:35 PM »
Sort of.
sand

Offline RTSigma

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2004, 06:00:55 PM »
It left when I got a girlfriend.

Sigma of VF-17 JOLLY ROGERS

Offline Nash

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #3 on: September 28, 2004, 06:44:52 PM »
You mean on Skuzzy's end? Seems okay now. We, on the other hand.... :)

Offline FUNKED1

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #4 on: September 28, 2004, 06:48:48 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Nash
You mean on Skuzzy's end? Seems okay now. We, on the other hand.... :)


Quote
Recommendations

When it comes to raw track count per dollar, the clear advantage is IDE, which can offer very high track counts at rates that are actually cheaper than their analog alternatives. For example an under-$200 20 GB IDE disk can offer over 24 tracks of 24 bit / 96 KHz audio sufficient to record multitrack audio for a full-length CD project. By comparison, 24-track analog tape typically costs roughly $100 per 15 minutes of recording time, or $400 to record enough tracks for a full length CD. Although IDE allows for 4 devices, this limitation should not pose a constraint for dedicated DAW systems, allowing a system (OS) disk, two audio disks, and a UDMA-compatible CDRW.

When it comes to flexibility, the clear advantage is SCSI. With its 15-device limit and ability to work with all kinds of devices besides hard disks, SCSI is the hands-down winner in terms of flexibility. If you have a need for lots of devices on your dedicated DAW, or need to use your computer for tasks beyond audio, SCSI may be your only alternative.

Note, however, that to achieve real performance benefits from SCSI, you need to invest in fairly expensive disks. If you use your computer for tasks beyond audio, some DAW enthustiasts would suggest spending the additional money on a dedicated IDE-based DAW rather than a SCSI interface and expensive SCSI disks - a solution that also offers the benefits of having a minimal amount of software and hardware on your audio computer. Only you can decide what solution best meets your needs.

Summary

All of the analysis of this article comes down to two major points.

First of all, don't be swayed by myth or biased opinions based on factors that do not apply to your situation. In the world of the DAW, there is enough evidence to say that either SCSI or IDE can offer the full level of drive performance necessary to take your system to its full potential. Although there are places for SCSI where IDE dare not go, one of them is NOT the digital audio workstation. Here, IDE can outperform SCSI just as often as SCSI can outperform IDE, in both cases usually not significantly and not even consistently. The format is not the issue. The drive is the issue. You're looking for high sustained throughput as made possible by fast rotation speed, quick average seek times and high areal density. Where the choice of interface comes in is the way you intend to use the system when in non-streaming mode.

The specifications regarding the interface data transfer speeds are, for all intents and purposes, irrelevant in DAW operations. This isn't to say that it isn't a good idea to have a fast interface, just a reality that the specification of concern is the sustained throughput of the drive, not the burst speed of the interface. IDE drives that use a UDMA66 interface (66 MB/sec) or even the new UDMA100 interface (100 MB/sec) being offered by Maxtor and Seagate cannot hope to sustain that rate. SCSI drives and host adapters designed to burst at 160 MB/sec or even higher are likewise limited by the drive's sustained throughput.

With very few exceptions, any drive, IDE or SCSI can't begin to saturate the interface it's connected to during media streaming regardless of the advantages of these high interface speeds for "normal" desktop and server application demands. Even the new IBM packetized SCSI interface, although a minor wonder in server applications, can't help much in streaming media because the advancement was made in the device-to-device transfer setup protocols, not in the way the data itself is moved. The simple fact is, all other factors being equal, the type of interface the drive uses is not a very important factor in a DAW based strictly on the drive's ability to stream data.

A DAW system with two or maybe three disk drives and a UDMA compliant CD ROM will likely lead to the IDE choice. These drives, well chosen, will offer all of the performance necessary to satisfy the software accessing them and the CPU running them. In fact, it is almost ridiculous to even consider the idea of ever using all of the tracks these drives can make available, especially in the face of the limitation placed on that track count by mixing overhead and real time effects. On the other hand, if you want to use more total drives than four, are running additional hardware that needs the extra IRQ that the second IDE channel eats up, or plan on using the system for server-level activities when not acting as a DAW, then you must expend the extra cash and go SCSI. However, this is not because the interface is better for operating a DAW, but because the demands you are placing on your system go beyond that required of a DAW.

Another consideration is the case of wanting to process large projects at 24 bit depth and 96KHz sample rates. If you need high track count (>24 tracks), this might warrant a 10K or 15K rpm drive for its higher throughput. This will limit you to SCSI until future IDE drives pick up the technology. That said, keep your eye on the Maxtor multi-processor drives when they come out and on other advances in IDE drive technology like the Fujitsu. It could end up making you want to dump SCSI and go IDE for the fastest drives instead of the other way around. Obviously, if you already have an investment in SCSI, you can stay with SCSI or you can add IDE drives to a SCSI-only system for a lot less money. Providing your system doesn't fall in the categories mentioned above, you will have the same level of additional performance either way.

The second point to be made here is that a lot of a DAW system's performance hinges on the way the user has configured it. A well tweaked system of modest means can outperform a cutting edge system that has been poorly set up. Use bus mastering - period! It doesn't matter what format you select, just make sure your IDE bus mastering is active or your SCSI host adapter is of the bus mastering persuasion. The savings in CPU time will add more "real world" tracks to your DAW than any changes you could make to the the drives themselves.

Buy more RAM! You want to make a big performance difference? Buy more RAM. After 256 MBytes, you can start to relax a bit and think about a faster CPU and/or better motherboard. Remember, the disk drive isn't the only hardware in a DAW that directly affects your performance. By the same token, save up and buy good software. Nothing sends a DAW out a third floor window faster than crummy software.

Use good judgement when selecting the other hardware for your DAW. Don't get dazzled by the top-of-the-line video cards as they can significantly degrade DAW system performance. Also, keep up with the latest drivers for your sound card. It doesn't hurt to cruse the manufacturer's web site once each month or so just to see what might be new.

Make the tweaks to your virtual memory, your "System Type" settings and your system cache as discussed in Part 1. Pay attention to your drive partition set ups and your FAT cluster size, also mentioned in Part 1. Keep your DAW uncluttered with programs or Windows features that cut into your CPU time from the background. These include anti-virus autoscan settings, autoinsert notification for CD ROMS, screen savers, power monitors and so on. If you use the DAW for other computing tasks, check thoroughly for conflicts after each new hardware or software install. When confronted with very demanding projects, decline network connection at boot-up to save a few CPU cycles there too.

Participate or at least monitor news groups that focus on DAW issues. There's a lot of information there from fellow users that have hands-on experience to share. Just be sure to take anything you see with the necessary grain of salt. Much myth, bias and mis-information can be found anywhere "the average user" is allowed to post without peer scrutiny, so select the good news groups if you want advice worth following.

Finely, keep your eye on the ball. Remember what you want to do with this DAW - make music. This is the absolute bottom line and at some point it isn't so much the equipment you have on hand as it is the way you use what you do have. Creativity is a human process, not a function of gigabytes or megahertz. Once you have a level of performance you can be creative with, don't get distracted obsessing over more and better. Allow your system to evolve through use, not because you feel there's no point going on unless you have the best and fastest. Leave such folly for network geeks being paid to obsess.

As the late Frank Zappa said, "Shut up and play your guitar." Good advice to give yourself when your eyes get bigger than your needs.

Offline Ripsnort

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #5 on: September 28, 2004, 06:48:55 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by RTSigma
It left when I got a girlfriend.

Midnights wife has got a short collar on him...

Offline Nash

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #6 on: September 28, 2004, 07:52:49 PM »
Silly, Funked nay, retarded:

Quote
The 896HD contains everything you need to turn your computer into a powerful 24-bit, 192kHz digital audio workstation. The 896HD provides 8 mic preamps, pristine 192kHz analog I/O, 8 channels of ADAT digital I/O and stereo AES/EBU. Expand your system by connecting additional 828 or 896 FireWire audio interfaces. The 896HD is equally well-suited for studio and stage, with or without a computer. As a computer interface, the 896HD provides 18 separate inputs and 22 outputs, including separate main outs and headphone out.

The 896HD provides DSP-driven digital mixing and monitoring for all 18 inputs. You can connect mics, guitars, synths and effects processors, and monitor everything from the 896HD's main outs or headphone jack with no separate mixer needed and no latency.

The 896HD supports up to four separate stereo monitor mixes assigned to any four digital or analog output pairs*. For example, you could set up separate monitor mixes for the main outs and headphone outs, while two additional stereo busses could be used for send/return loops to reverb units or other outboard gear. Each mix can support all 18 inputs (8 combo XLR/TRS analog, 8 ADAT optical digital and stereo AES/EBU digital).

A new "CueMix Bounce Back" feature** lets you route one of the four CueMix DSP mixes back to the computer. This allows you to record, for example, your entire mix - including monitored inputs - back into the computer.

High level recording with a superior hardware interface. Empowers your computer with powerful 24-bit, 192kHz audio. Provides 8 mic preamps, pristine 192kHz analog I/O, 8 channels of ADAT digital and stereo AES/EBU. Adapts to studio or stage. With a computer, provides 18 inputs and 22 outputs, including main out and headphone out.

The 896HD includes the new CueMix DSP onboard mixing feature, a flexible DSP-driven 18-input/8-bus mixing and monitoring matrix that eliminates the need for an external mixer or patchbay. CueMix connects all of your studio gear, including mics, guitars, keyboards, drum machines, and effects processors. Everything can be controlled from the included CueMix Console software or directly from the 896HD's front-panel.

If you're hitting the road, just program the 896 in the studio with the CueMix Console software and then take the 896 on the road for portable mixing and monitoring without a computer. In the studio, the 8 channels of ADAT optical I/O.
Demonstrating remarkable flexibility and convenience, the DR-DV5000 records the DV signal from the JVC GY-DV5000 camcorder onto a user removable, standard 2.5" compact FireWire hard disk drive. An 80G hard drive will deliver over 6 hours of digital recording time, which makes it particularly useful for "in-field" applications. The unit can also be used with JVC’s GY-DV500 and GY-DV700 camcorders.
 
One of the DV-DV5000's most "user-friendly" features is its capability of being pre-configured by the user to record in the native file format of most major DV non-linear editor (NLE), including: Avid OMF-DV, QuickTime-DV, RawDV, AVI Type 1-DV, AVI Type 2-DV, Canopus AVI-DV, and Matrox AVI-DV. As a result, once field shooting is complete, the hard disk can be "plugged" via FireWire directly into the NLE making the footage instantly available with no spooling necessary prior to editing. This means that programme makers can save time and money by shooting in an edit-ready format. Typically this will save over 300 hours per year.
 
In addition, when recording to tape, a user can utilize the DR-DV5000E for automatic digital back-up recording, eliminating any chance of losing critical footage.
 
The DR-DV5000 is fully integrated with the GY-5000E camcorder, providing extensive status information and the ability to playback recorded clips through the viewfinder and LCD display.

Offline Skuzzy

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #7 on: September 28, 2004, 09:02:19 PM »
Nope, the O'Club is still open.  No sanity here.
Roy "Skuzzy" Neese
support@hitechcreations.com

Offline midnight Target

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #8 on: September 28, 2004, 09:33:48 PM »
Wow, thanks Nash... I was confused by Funkydrawers but you made it all so clear.

Rip... go find that tumbleweed picture and stare at it.

No offense Skuzzy. The lack of vB code in here just gave me a headache. No other reason for staying away.

Offline -tronski-

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #9 on: September 28, 2004, 10:00:09 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Skuzzy
Nope, the O'Club is still open.  No sanity here.


Ahhh not true...the hamburger thread has been the most civil/intelligent one yet....just goes to show there is one universal love in the world :D

 Tronsky
God created Arrakis to train the faithful

Offline RTSigma

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Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #10 on: September 28, 2004, 10:37:40 PM »
1.   Use bags that have been stored in a cool, dry place. Check the expiration date printed on the package. If the bag looks brittle, sticky or discolored, throw it out.

2.   Open the package gently. You don’t want to puncture thebag in your hurry to liberate it! Don't use scissors or your teeth.

3.   Put a drop or two of extra water-based grease inside the tip of the bag. This aids in the unrolling and increases sensation for the fork.

4.   Before you start unrolling the bag, squeeze the air out of the receptacle tip, since air bubbles can cause bags to break. Bags without a reservoir tip require about one half inch free at the tip to catch the spice.

5.   As you’re holding the tip of the bag over the fork, check to make sure the polyester will be emerging from the inside of the ring as you roll down. A bearded man should pull his forehead back to help prevent the bag from slipping.

6.   Apply generous amounts of water-based grease to the outside of the bag and to your partner’s gerbils before the movie starts.

7.   Withdraw before losing your tree. Remember to hold on to the base of the bag when withdrawing so the bag doesn’t slip off from the fork.

8.   Throw used bags away. They are not reusable. Use a new bag for each act of watching a movie.





If that ain't a loss of sanity I don't know what is

Sigma of VF-17 JOLLY ROGERS

Offline cpxxx

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Re: Sanity Break out yet?
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2004, 11:34:39 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by midnight Target
Just checkin.


What? Are you crazy???????