Question to Finns

[spitfiremkv]

wow this thread still going....



commies suck

[Siaf__csf]

Fighting the Nazi Germany and her allies was a good deed, and crushing Nazi Germany and her allies was the feat still admired by good people around the globe. And it really was the Great Patriotic War for the Soviet People.

After your cowardly attack which forced Finland to seek alliance with Germany and the end of the war your country has achieved little to none other than loathe and disgust from the rest of the planet.

Enjoy your stay.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Suave
Estel I don't think you know what non-profit means.

And there is something else you're not understanding in the translation.

Alpha group, beta group, kaskad, vympel, delfin, omon, grom, these are all known as osnaz here, if they were military units then they would be called spetsnaz here.

Those guys who gassed and beat and killed protesters in the 80s and 90s, or who liquidated TV stations in Lituanian and assaulted the TV tower didn't belong to any army electronic interception unit I'm sure.

Although they were sometimes disguised as paratroopers when they were assassinating people like journalists and police officers in the baltics 89-91.

Clarification of the terms and the words behind them :
OSNAZ = osobogo naznacheniya ('of particular purpose');
SPETSNAZ = special'nogo naznacheniya ('of special purpose');
OMON = otryad militsyiy osobogo naznacheniya ('police squad of particular purpose').

As the Russian military terms, OSNAZ today is chiefly used to denote electronic reconnaissance units, and SPETSNAZ - elite field recon units.
The police borrowing of the military term OSNAZ (see above "OMON") led to the confusion of original terms. Every cop considers himself to be a member of the elite forces.
 

[genozaur]

Originally posted by spitfiremkv
wow this thread still going....



commies suck

Anticommies suck it hard.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Siaf__csf
After your cowardly attack which forced Finland to seek alliance with Germany and the end of the war your country has achieved little to none other than loathe and disgust from the rest of the planet.

Enjoy your stay.

Honey, stop battling against the wind mills.
The Soviet Union disintegrated in the previous century. It's about time for you to wake up from the icy slumbers of the Cold War.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Raven_2
to MiloMorai (BTW, your nickname means "to soil/besmear the soap" in russian)

>>Come now commie, name one Russian from 1000 years ago, 2000 years ago, 3000 years ago.

Poor boy, your total ignorance is awesome. As always. Kulikovskaya battle with khan Mamay (1380 AC) was in 6886 year by slavic calendar. So, slavic people exist from 5506 BC. Less then chinese, but much more then greece.

Names? Get any good book on slavic history and read, cause I`m not a history teacher to educate you here. Good sources are ancient historians: Eliy Spartian and Capitoliy "Biography of Piy", Flaviy Vopisk "Biography of Aureliy", Pliniy, Ptolemey, Strabon, Raphael Volateranian, Procop Cesarian and ma-a-any others.

One name for you, so you can`t say that I just bla-bla insted of direct answer. Need name? OK. Attila. Huns had slavic origins, you know.

Another name is knyaz Tovazov, ally of the Great Pompey in war with pontic king Mitridat.

I`m glad for you that you don`t ashamed to show your ignorance in public, though 8-)

[to genazaur]
About origins "slavic". It comes from sarmatian word "slouo" (means "word"). And "slave" was just gena etymological guess.

Гена, блин. Фигли людей в заюлуждение вводишь?
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По мнению Иоанна Дубравия, славяне или словины получили свое имя от «slouo», что у сарматов означало «слово», так как все сарматские народы, рассеянные по земному пространству, говорят на одном языке. Из-за единообразия в произношении их и стали называть словины. Это согласуется с утверждением Мартина Кромера о том, что словины получили свое имя от слова, поскольку отличались правдивостью, были тверды и верны данному ими слову. И сегодня у поляков и богемцев весьма порицаются те, кто не держат данного обещания, по их выражению, «добрым словом», при этом люди благородного происхождения готовы пойти на любые лишения и принять саму смерть, нежели изменить своему слову. Тем же, кто все-таки не хранит верность данному обещанию, мстят не только пощечиной, но и оружием.
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Мавро Орбини, "Историография народа славянского" ( 1606 год )

Про руссов
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Сейчас же их принято называть русскими, т. е. рассеянными, так как по-русски или по-славянски Россея означает не что иное, как рассеяние. И не без основания прозвали их руссами или рассеянными, ведь после того, как славяне заняли всю Европейскую и часть Азиатской Сарматии, их колонии рассеяны от Ледовитого океана до Средиземного моря и Адриатического залива, от Большого моря до Балтийского Океана. Более того, славяне руссы, по свидетельству Иоахима Мейера(1), высылали колонистов и во Фландрию, где их теперь называют рутенами. По этой же причине и греческие писатели, как сообщает Прокопий Кесарийский, называли их споры, т. е. рассеянный народ.
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[/to genazaur]

>>Tell me Raven, when did the Soviets finally pay off their LL debt to the USA?

USA never missed the chance to make money on others blood. "Help" from "allies"... While this bastards get their tan in Africa, our people destroy main army of nazi.

BTW, in 1941-1943 USSR recive only 7% of whoole 11 mlrd shipment, other 93% was recived in 1944-1945. So, nazi were driven back by russia arms. Debt was 1.300.000.000$ (only 11.1% of whoole shipment), other 88.9% were returned unused. Now debt is about 100.000.000$ (and 30.000.000.000$ for Britain, but USA "forgive" it), by agreement with Reigan, it would be payed off up to 2030. Now we have much more in our stabilization fund - but there is no reason to pay off whole sum now, cause we have more then enough time for that.

Rave, I said that there were so many slavic people captured that in the Western Europe all captive foreign servants got the name "Slav" (modern English word 'slave'). That's what I said.
And I'm  perfectly aware of the difference between 'Slovene' and 'Nemtsy'.
So, "ne oochi otsa yebat'sya".
(English rendering : Go teach your farther how to procreate).

[genozaur]

Originally posted by MiloMorai
Holy crap Holden McGroin were did those 2 bozos come from?

I have never seen any better examples of brainwashing come out of the now defunct CCCP before.

Better to let them live in their fantasy world reading Pravda.


Should I mention the untold number of lives lost transporting Lend-Lease supplies to the Soviet Union prier to June 6 1944 so the could fight their GPW?

It is good that the Allies were fighting the Germans in the MTO for those German troops would have helped in their fight against the Commies. It was good that the Allies were fighting in the air in the ETO since that tied more troops (ground and air) that could have been tranferred to the EF. Never mind the manpower tied up in defending German and rebuilding the factories. Yes, those weapons lost would have been of much help for the Germans on the EF.

MiloMor, please note that the English word 'Bozo' which you have used, is the 1600-years' old tricky tool of anti-Slavic propaganda.
Boz (vocative declination 'Bozo'), the king of the Slavic tribe of Antes was defeated by the Vinitharius of the Amali, the king of Ostrogoths.
King Boz was crucified together with his sons and 70 nobles.
As it was usual at those times the king of Antes was both the religious and the military leader of his people. The very name 'Boz' (in Slavic transcription 'Bozh') is translated as 'God' (compare to the modern Slavic name Bogdan=God-given).
Probably the crucifixion of the Slavic 'God' was too much a hindrance for the church propaganda effort, so up untill now the name Bozo is exclusively reserved to the clowns.

So, thank you MiloMor for the active participation in this circus show.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by bikekil
Genozaur, the way you are avoiding to answer my questions or any "salt" of what i'm posting to you is just brilliant, instead of that you are serving the "border conflict" theory and refering to your version of being wise, thet is to do not declare a war to the Soviets who already attacked Poland, but then you someway can't see that when armies of two countries are fighting, you have a war and a side who stike on the other is an attacker, finally that if one country grab half of other country's land, it's not a border conflict - that you can't see

Then, what is the point in declaring war to  a country who already attacked your land? The declaration is pointless in fact, as you are already in a state of war

Other than that, Sikorski, made a right decision to declare war to Russia afterwards. Surely it change nothing from a military point of view, as Poland wa sconquered, but if you know a bit about a political side of things, you have to admit that it was a political decision (in my opinion a wise decision) and Sikorski made it as a hear of 4th military power during the WW2... 4th biggest military power, who had no country itself, but got the opportunities and equipment from the western Alles.
Declaring a war to the Soviets was a demonstration and declaration of something - of a fact that we will not remember who attacked us on 17.09.1939 and we won't let it be.

Happened that we got traded to Stalin after WW2, but still we managed to kicked the commies outta our lands


Now, you can back to the border conflict and "Stupid Sikorski" theories... but still,  why should i care?

Bik, it's not the theory. It's the naked truth.
And your opinion won't change it.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Holden McGroin
Genozaur and Boroda:

I used "shambles" as a descriptor of the Soviet economy as a relative term.

During Stalin's first 5 year plan, which concentrated on agriculture, from 1929 and 1934 the number of cattle in the country dropped from 58 million to 33.5 million. The number of horses dropped from 32.6 million to 17.3 million. Livestock totals did not reach their pre-Five Year Plan levels again until the mid-1950’s.  Steel production dramatically increased, was only 60% of Stalin's goal.

The second five year plan, ending with CCCP almost catching Germany in steel production, but failing to reach the recommended production levels in such crucial areas as coal, oil, and cement production.

While the CCCP's economy grew at 12 to 13% in the 1930's, 2 times nothing is still nothing.

It grew at spectacular rates percentage wise, but when the CCCP fell apart, it's economy was about the same as Holland.  50 years of double digit growth, and no bigger than the economy of the Netherlands.


edit> Vikings, Magyars, and Mongols are Barbaric tribes, and as Russians are decendants of Viking trading culture that stretched from the Baltic to the middle east, Russians are barbarians, or at least decendants of such.

Still Holdin'YourGroin,
The dramatic reduction in the number of cattle is the result of the opposition to the first 5-year plan. Every Soviet Young Pioneer knew it. So says an american source below :

To satisfy the state's need for increased food supplies, the First Five-Year Plan called for the organization of the peasantry into collective units that the authorities could easily control. This collectivization program entailed compounding the peasants' lands and animals into collective farms (kolkhozy; sing., kolkhoz --see Glossary) and state farms (sovkhozy; sing., sovkhoz --see Glossary) and restricting the peasants' movement from these farms. The effect of this restructuring was to reintroduce a kind of serfdom into the countryside. Although the program was designed to affect all peasants, Stalin in particular sought to eliminate the wealthiest peasants, known as kulaks. Generally, kulaks were only marginally better off than other peasants, but the party claimed that the kulaks had ensnared the rest of the peasantry in capitalistic relationships. In any event, collectivization met widespread resistance not only from the kulaks but from poorer peasants as well, and a desperate struggle of the peasantry against the authorities ensued. Peasants slaughtered their cows and pigs rather than turn them over to the collective farms, with the result that livestock resources remained below the 1929 level for years afterward. The state in turn forcibly collectivized reluctant peasants and deported kulaks and active rebels to Siberia. Within the collective farms, the authorities in many instances exacted such high levels of procurement that starvation was widespread.
Russia  Transformation and Terror
http://workmall.com/wfb2001/russia/russia_history_transformation_and_terror.html
Source: The Library of Congress Country Studies
-----------------
The reduction in the number of horses was due to the increasing use of tractors and other machinery in agriculture, and the turn to the motorization of the Red Army.

So, your opinion about Stalin's industrialization is wrong. Have the courage to accept it.
Your protracted verbalizations about the state of the Soviet economy closer to the year of the USSR disintegration are the songs from another opera. I don't have time to discuss it, but rest assured that it's also a piece of Western propaganda, because the drastic imbalance of the USSR economy (war and heavy industries too much prevailing over consumer goods production during 45 years of peace = for two generations) does not mean "nothing". Here your impressions are also wrong.

Holden, besides reading there is also such thing as thinking.
 

[genozaur]

Originally posted by straffo
You asked for the stats , I posted them

But it would be an apple/orange comparaison.


Proove me the Curzon line had no impact on the local population.

1). You posted only half of the undated stats from a biased article.
2). Both are the fruits.
3). I wouldn't waste my time even to prove that the Lord Curson's line followed the existing ethnic devide. Much less can you expect me to even think about the Curson line "impact on the local population.
Your challenge here only shows that you are really challenged in this area.  

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Toad


Read what's there, not what you wish was there. What I said was these people were killed by your system. The Soviet system of government, forced on the East Germans after WW2, killed these people.

What other government system SHOOTS their own citizens in the back if they try to leave the country?




[/b]

Why don't you post the rest of it? Show folks what your political system does to the citizens of paradise when they try to leave?




So what would YOU have told the US forces to do? Would YOU order them across the Berlin Wall to pick up Fecther? If they had done so, what would be the probable reaction of the East German Border Guards?

Fechter was an East German, shot by East Germans, dying on East German soil.

Had US troops gone to get him, you'd be here now whining that we "invaded the GDR" or other nonsense.

You're so desperate, it's comical.


[/b]

Typical East German Border Guards guarding an artificial border created by the Soviets. Note how these two were not prosecuted until after reunification and the vestiges of a totalitarian system that murders its own citizens for trying to leave "paradise" had been swept away.

>>Once again, you show your total ignorance.

 

As Holden pointed out, the Native Americans are not "kept" there. They, unlike your citizens, were always free to go where they wanted to go without needing governmental permission or ID cards. [/B]

Toad, stop blaming the "evil" USSR for the Berlin Wall jumpers' deaths. Those poor folks were killed by the East German (Deutsche Demokratische Republik) border guards. And those border guards are personally responsible for those killings. Also responsible are the commanders of those border guards, as well as people in higher echelons along the direct chain of command who issued the order to kill people who were trying to escape to West Berlin.

The USSR government was not so deadly cruel towards Soviet citizens who wanted to emigrate abroad. In 1970s and -80s such people could emigrate after paying 5,000 roubles' (less than $10,000) compensation of the state's cost of their higher education, if they had such an education. The rest emigrated without paying this compensation.
Hundreds of thousands (probably more than that, I'm not familiar with the exact stats) of the Soviet citizens, most of them of Jewish origin, emigrated to the Western Europe, the USA, Canada, and Israel. It is a well-known fact.
But you again pick the most rotten apple from the ground and stick it into the faces of poorly informed people proclaiming that the seed of the evil is the apple-tree.
You are wrong again.
But to your credit I can add that were you born in DDR, you would make an exampleary border guard.  
 



 

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Simaril
You know, we had a civil war too. Ours was 50 years or so before yours, and we therefore had more excuse for barbaric behavior.

And our leader's attitude toward the rebels?

"With malice toward none, with charity for all, with firmness in the right as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in, to bind up the nation's wounds, to care for him who shall have borne the battle and for his widow and his orphan, to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace among ourselves and with all nations."

The president of the rebel forces -- our "White Russians" -- was briefly jailed, tehn released and spent the remainder of his days free. He was also free to speak in opposition to the government, which he did often without being punished.  Generals who violated their oath of loyalty to the Union, and fought courageously against the army that trained them, were left free as well. One (Longstreet) became the ambassador to Turkey; others served as US government officials, or returned to the practice of law. Assassinations and executions: none.



USSR solution to threatened rebellion?

Bullet to the head.

Historical note : the USSR was formed AFTER the Russian Civil War.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Siaf__csf
It's your own mafia that's selling the people handsomehunk. Most of europe is already scourged by the spread of russian crime and it's getting continuously worse. It really was a splendid time when they didn't let you guys out of the country.

I never really understood untill now how russians are messed up in a evil, dangerous way. I had only a faint clue and even then I chose to stay away from them. I thought that the liberation from communism would have opened them to normal thinking. How wrong I was.

They are simply enemies of a western society.

Siaf, what mafia are you talking about ?
The "Russian" mafia in the West is not Russian, but the 'Russian-speaking'. And this is not the same, believe me.

[genozaur]

Originally posted by Toad
This post clearly shows that:

1) You have no idea of what a "fact" is.

2) You have no idea of the capabilities/mission of the RC-135.

3) You have no idea of the capabilites of the US satellite recon program.

4) You have your very own tinfoil hat, with embossed nametag.

So, Toad, tell us the things you have not been telling us before in your multinumerous posts here. Or were you hiding something ?
Probably you were because once again you do not answer to my direct question : why does it take an American spy plane and the American spy satellite to make it a flying threesome ?

[genozaur]

My apology to sober-minded people here for extending the after-life of the already dead discussion, but I had to rebuff some stenchy opinions expressed by some staunch defenders of the perfect capitalistic system (the best in the whole world, of course).

This is the end of my participation in this thread.
Toads and Siafki rule !
The rest of the world should snap to attention and
listen to their words of deep wisdom.


We'll talk later.