Author Topic: Spit9 vs Zeros & 109s (Read 1040 times)

Happy1 · « **on:** February 19, 2005, 10:56:27 PM »

Greetings pple need ur assistance pls in solving my continuous dilemma in fighting & LOOSING to Zeros & fast flying 109s. To begin I generally have wep on in merges, do throttle control &
watch my speed plus keeping my Gs under 4.5.

I can handle the Greying out well enuff but it's the blkouts that get me shot, I wish I knew HOW to scale my stick so that my Gs
would NEVER be in excess of 4.5. Is there anyway to successfully
scale it to a set setting?

There u go, pls advise me on the best ways to fight the following:

Spit9 vs A6Ms

Spit9 vs 109s

Thx every1 for ur assistance.

Cheers,

Happy1

pellik · « **Reply #1 on:** February 20, 2005, 03:00:23 AM »

If your having problems with blackouts the problem isn't so much that your stick scaling is wrong as that you're yanking the stick too fast. Slower more deliberate movements will help you get in the habbit of thinking about what turn your going to make. If you pull into it slowly you should be able to find the partial blackout tunnel vision pretty easily.

The spit9 v a6m matchup isn't always going to be easy for a new pilot. The a6m is the best turning fighter in the game, so any turnfight that takes longer then ten seconds is going to go to the zeke pilot. The spit9s primary advantage in this situation is that it retains E well in a turn, whereas the zeke burns it fast to get a better turn radius. If you have E going into the fight just try for BnZ, and hope your gunnery is decent. If the zeke jumps you you'll need to turn it just until he starts pulling high G, then extend out as soon as you're faster. It's not an easy game as most zeke pilots are going to expect people to avoid turning them.

The spit9 v 109 fight depends on the variant of 109. The 109F is a good turner with decent accelleration, winning or losing here is dependent mostly on pilot skill. A 109G10 will treat you like you need to treat a zeke, so try to stay light on the stick and use lead turns to get in close on the merge to discourage him extending.

I'd like to give you some more specific tips, but the spitfires are pretty different from the things I fly.

-pellik

SuperDud · « **Reply #2 on:** February 20, 2005, 11:55:06 AM »

Exactly what pellik said. Blacking out is an error on your part not your stick. I had a big problem with that when I first started. Over time you'll get use to pulling back slower and gentler, yet still be able to maintain a tight turn. Just comes with practice.

RTR · « **Reply #3 on:** February 20, 2005, 07:03:34 PM »

Hiya Happy1, been a while sir!

I agree with Pellick to a certain extent. I never B&Z with a spit IX though, however, I will use it's ability to fly in the verticals against A/C like the Zeke. The Zeke will turn itself inside out to get on your six, but.....and its a big but, it does not have the power to sustain a fight in the verticals with a SpitIX.

(which to be fair to Pellik is, I think, what he was trying to get across).

The biggest mistake most people make when against a Zeke (or any other pure turnfighter) is getting slow and trying to slug it out on the opponents terms. The Zeke turns on a dime below 200 mph. Keep the fight fast and he loses advantages very rapidly. Get him in the verticals, use a bit of "geometry" and it will seem to him that you are outurning him. In fact you aren't really turning "with" him, you are turning "against" him.

What I do is, put him in front of my wingspan. Once there I will do whatever I need to do to keep him there. I will try to keep him fast, I have a better turning radius at 250mph than he does.

Happy, Its really all "E" and recognizing what "E" the opponent has, what he/she is flying and how that potential relates to what you are flying.

ME109's: The only 109 you should really have a problem with is the Franz. This one can ruin your day as a Spit driver. It will turn pretty close to a SpitV in the right hands. (Eagler is deadly in the Franz). It has the power to follow you in the verticals, and it should be respected. The other ME109's...well feel them out (actually I recommend flying them a bit). They all have an amazing ability to fly in the verticals, but the only one I worry about is the Franz, because it will turn.

109's are notorious for being higher than you. Don'y worry about it. Just don't climb to them (they want u to do this). Make them come to you. Keep them in front of your wingspan, keep your speed up and they will come. Guaranteed.

Once you get them on your terms......Enjoy the Buffet!

In short, the easiest way to get a 109 on yer plate is to get him slowed down and turning. MAKE HIM FIGHT YOUR FIGHT.

Cheers, Hope this helped a bit
AND......<<>>> Happy!

RTR

RTR · « **Reply #4 on:** February 20, 2005, 07:14:46 PM »

One last thing reference blacking out.

If you are blacking out with only a slight pull on your stick, you have some scaling problems. Try dampening the pitch axis abit in the settings set up. Other than that get used to flying "in the tunnel".

I have a couple of flight exercises I have my Sqn do, that really does help with tunnel vision, and SA. Feel free to email me if you want them, my email addy listed here as a contact always works.

Cheers Happy, and once again...good to see you sir!

RTR
CO 421 Sqn RCAF

Happy1 · « **Reply #5 on:** February 23, 2005, 11:18:15 AM »

Gentlemen

thx much for ur sound advice, it's really appreciated, it seems to me that I hit a LOW for a few days where nothing that I did turned out

Taking a couple of days off, perusing films & adjusting my scaling helped a lot! The problems became minor nuances due to foolish moves on my part.

RTR, it's always a pleasure hearing from u sir, u've always been a
great help to me past & present, damping my pitch helped steady
my nose weave & tunnel flying w/stall horn blaring is something to
get used to (wish there was a gentler stall buzz).

Your kind offer to send me a couple of "Flight exercises " that u have your Sqn do to help w/tunnel vision & SA is gratefully accepted, pls mail same to me at ur earliest convenience, TY

<> RTR :aok

Happy1

mechanic · « **Reply #6 on:** February 24, 2005, 01:57:57 PM »

i turned my stall horn sound off a very long time ago

go into setup/preferances/game sounds on the ingame clipboard and browse the sound options to your hearts content

pellik · « **Reply #7 on:** February 27, 2005, 02:56:10 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by mechanic
i turned my stall horn sound off a very long time ago

go into setup/preferances/game sounds on the ingame clipboard and browse the sound options to your hearts content

Why did you turn your stall buzzer off? The only downside to it I've ever noticed is that it's not the most pleasant sound. As long as your not intimidated to keep pulling past the onset of the buzzer it shouldn't hinder you in any way. You'll still learn to feel the stall (you should usually try to fly at the loudest volume for your buzzer), and you'll also get some useful information on where the edge of the envelope is as the speed of your fight changes.

-pellik

Estes · « **Reply #8 on:** February 27, 2005, 06:53:51 PM »

i just renamed the wind sound in my folder to stall.

humble · « **Reply #9 on:** February 28, 2005, 02:07:42 PM »

The key (IMO) is pretty simple....the key to beating a zeke in a spit 9 is to get him behind you (I have a -1 hog vs zeke clip I think). Your going to beat the zeke in the vertical as mentioned above...any other way you die...the key is to take the fight up...the zeke is a great diving plane so you want to deny him a chance to force angles on you.....

It's not an easy kill however...

As for the 109 the goal is the opposite....you need to get behind him. Make it an angles fight...one thing alot of the good "duelers" do is slow a bit on the merge and then pull to blackout and release...you can time it so you blackout just a bit and "recover" quickly...the combination of lower merge speed and hi G gives them the angular advantage they want...from there they just "hang on".

I dont fly the spitty but I have Ki-61 vs 109/zeke and -1 (hog) vs 109/zeke. I dont B&Z so these are angles/E fights...I can normally out turn a zeke in a -1 hog pretty easily if I keep the fight fast and in oblique vertical...once he gets under 250 I'm gone however...

WDOT4W · « **Reply #10 on:** March 01, 2005, 08:13:52 PM »

I thought about this thread last night as our field was being capped & I took off in a A6M with 25% fuel to repel them ... got a few kills ... but I noticed real quick I couldn't catch them if they ran... in some cases, they'd also just climb away from me, I couldn't get my nose up on them for a shot...

I had to pounce on them as they got slow turning with someone else & were out of E... it was fun & showed me a thing or 2 about the zeke ...

The night before, we were capping an airfield from our CV and I took one in as a kind of "what the hell" thang and scored several kills in it, tho I didnt land any.. i didn't shoot any on the runway, but caught them slow & vulnerable... Wow! I was amazed at how quick it could saddle up & stay there no matter what the NME did to shake me...

I'd forgotten how much fun the thing can be to fly!!

Makes me dizzy cuz the damn thing turns so quick!!

Someone with a straw & a spitwad can knock ya outa the sky!!

Just thought I'd share my experience in the zeke as it related to this thread...

Ohio43 · « **Reply #11 on:** March 03, 2005, 12:23:30 PM »

WD, if the zeke is going to be your plane, just be careful about getting your speed up high. Zeke loses its great turning ability very quickly at high speeds. Keep her under 250, dodge the BnZ'ers and be patient over an airfield. Someone always ends up getting low and slow, and thats where you pounce. Your right, you wont catch planes in a chase. Be patient, they will come to you