Question for Law Enforcement Guys...

[Saurdaukar]

Originally posted by AdmRose
Well we had coed platoons, essentially a 3:1 ratio of male squads to female squads in a platoon. I would say that the biggest problem (that I saw, at least) for the females is attitude, not anything physical or biological.

Ah - USMC training is segregated.

Plenty of the women made better Marines than the men as far as I could see... still wouldnt want them in front line combat roles, though for alot of reasons.

[Leslie]

It's admirable your concern for the officer's safety Seagoon, but they can handle themselves or they wouldn't be there.  

Does no good to speculate on "what ifs", if you know what I mean.





Les

[AdmRose]

Originally posted by Saurdaukar
Ah - USMC training is segregated.

Plenty of the women made better Marines than the men as far as I could see... still wouldnt want them in front line combat roles, though for alot of reasons.

I agree to a point, e.g. Jessica Lynch. She was captured because her weapon jammed and she 'forgot' how to perform SPORTS on it.

[lazs2]

as a citizen and a taxpayer I don't think that 95 lb women should even be on the force except behind a desk or at the jail to search women prisoners.

Cops should be big and retire young.. it is just a fact of life and of nature.   They should be able to pass rigorous physical testing.

The only reason that female cops work as well as they do is that unless the crook is insane or drugged... he fears the badge... no criminal ever fears a woman cop herself.   If they did not think that they would be hunted down by every cop in the country they would simply beat the crap out of every woman cop that bothered them..

The rest of us are not violent criminals so it doesn't matter.

lazs

[beet1e]

Seagoon. Maybe the car had been pulled over for sounding the horn - Are you sure she wasn't just changing the batteries in her taser? Oh wait, it was NC not KS. Never mind.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Originally posted by Leslie
It's admirable your concern for the officer's safety Seagoon, but they can handle themselves or they wouldn't be there.  

Does no good to speculate on "what ifs", if you know what I mean.





Les

His concern was not just the safety of the officer, but the safety of everyone involved.

And if you think that law enforcement is immune to having people get hired who can't do the job, you are sadly mistaken. Worse still is the fact that when someone is hired but cannot do the job, most often that is found out too late, often with tragic results, and not just for the person who could not do the job. It is not just females either.

By the way, in MANY places, officers are hired and sent out on the job BEFORE ever going through the acedemy.

Honestly, law enforcement officers do not get the training they really need in about 90% of all agencies.

Their marksmanship is often tragically poor, and their training in CQB is non existent. Their training in hand to hand non lethal force situations is abysmal.

They are most often required to have a degree in sociology, psychology, or other ICBS, but most of them have almost no training in marksmanship, basic entry level martial arts, use of cover, or any other skill likely to save their lives should the untrhinkable become reality.

While it is true that many officers go through an entire carrer without ever drawing their service weapon, much less discharging it, they should all still be required to have the skills required to survive, and to make sure the criminal is dealt with. That is what they are there for, and what the job is really about. You can NEVER predict WHICH officer will be faced with the horrible situation, therefore they should all be trained and competant to face it.

It is not necessary for all officers to be SWAT/hostage rescue level personnel, it IS necessary that all officers be trained and competent enough to survive until the SWAT/hostage rescue units get there when they are needed. It's really stupid to have to have dead patrol officers laying on the ground when the SWAT/hostage rescue unit arrives. And that is EXACTLY what the poor training, or lack of training, results in.

[Leslie]

Thank you Savage.  



Les

[Chairboy]

I hope y'all aren't suggesting that being female automatically counts as evidence of incompetence, because that seems implicit in Virgil's post.

[GtoRA2]

Odd
 

It is not just females either.

 That seems to imply he was not just talking about females.

[Chairboy]

True, but I said it was implicit, not overt.  

Leslie is saying that she can handle herself, and Virgil's post, while couched in the general, was in essence disagreeing with Leslie's post.  Working backwards from there, following algebraic logic, the implication is that a female officer is less likely to be able to handle a situation then the male counterpart.

I'm no bleeding heart liberal, but I think it's unwise to assume that a physical strength advantage is as significant a force multiplier as some posters would seem to suggest it is.  

Regarding the safety of bystanders, we have Seagoon's description to go on and his implicit assumption that she would have blindly fired through the assailant towards our resident pastor.  I respect his opinion that that may have happened, but I feel that it's an opinion that's coming from a very selective eye for competence.

[lazs2]

physical strength never seems to be much of a factor until you are up against it.

lazs

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

It was NOT implicit, nor was it implied.

I said he was ASSUMING that because she got the job, she was able to do the job. I said that was no more true of law enforcement than any other job. I said it did not just apply to females. I do not know how to make that more clear. I suppose caps and bold type are necessary (Lord, I hope not).

I cannot help what you read into what I wrote, I wrote it as plainly as possible. I tried to avoid a WOT.

Perhaps, and this is directed at NO ONE IN PARTICULAR (note the big disclaimer), it would be better if people stopped reading into things what they think they see or what they want to see.

[Chairboy]

Fair enough.

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Originally posted by Leslie
Thank you Savage.  



Les

I don't think there's any need to thank me for anything.

I guess I have you confused with someone else, maybe from somewhere else, I thought you were in law enforcement, or maybe were.

In any event, I was not singling you out at all, but rather pointing out that it is often assumed, even by people in law enforcement, that you have to be trained and competent, and suited for the job, before you get the badge, the service weapon, and the uniform.

Again, nothing personal was intended, it just happened that you posted the assumption.

[Leslie]

Well, actually I was implying Seagoon was a bit of a coward concerned for himself and all.  But in the big picture it doesn't matter.  

I was not standing up for the cops and Lord knows I certainly don't have the courage Seagoon has.


Les