Author Topic: So who won the war? (Read 2197 times)

lazs2 · « **Reply #90 on:** July 08, 2005, 11:51:46 AM »

sandie... there are others that are more specific on the way indians used the plains. If you want to blame someone for their inevitable decline (someone other than them that is)....

blame the spanish and the mexicans who gave them horses and iron... if left to themselves... without horses.. they would have an even lower lifespan and smaller tribes.... without iron they would have not been able to make as efficient a weaponry or housing or tools... even higher mortality.

It would appear that every advance in science that was passed on to the indians they used like every other people known to man... they used it to increase their population and to make more effiecient war on each other and anyone else who showed up... the first trade rifles were used for slaughtering game and each other... later they were used in the war against the white devil.

Their way of life could never have been sustained. They themselves would destroy it by taking any technolodgy that was offered. Would they turn down a medicine that would increase the chances for their babies to live for instance? Would they turn down advances in weaponry in order to "protect" themselves from other tribes or foreigners who had different ideas on how the resources of the land should be used?

Take away their horses and modern tools and leave em alone would have only prolonged the inevitable.

lazs

Overlag · « **Reply #91 on:** July 08, 2005, 05:19:02 PM »

to be fair, no one wins in wars.....everyone looses

Torque · « **Reply #92 on:** July 08, 2005, 06:48:47 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Overlag
to be fair, no one wins in wars.....everyone looses

well not according to Harry Truman's Committee.

ravells · « **Reply #93 on:** July 08, 2005, 07:05:00 PM »

This is silly,

The Americans joined the war because of Pearl Harbour (which stifled the isolationists) and we were very happy that they did. American intervention did win or shorten the end of both wars.

...and Lasz is right about the Red Indians, their fate was inevitable, as has happened in cultures before them.

It would be nice to live in a world where there was no change and people were in harmony in their environment (as the red indians were) but as with Africa, for example, we introduced them to advanced weaponry and after an untold number of deaths we are only now just waking up to the cost.

It's very hard to apportion blame in such circumstances.

Ravs

Torque · « **Reply #94 on:** July 08, 2005, 08:12:58 PM »

silly is painting all north american natives as typical plains indians, feeble absolution when it comes to the blame game, but that's not knew around here.

i still think fdr knew what was going to happen at pearl harbour, but it was the only way to leverage corporate america away from aiding hitler, which it had been doing since the early thirties. chamberlain is to blame for that as well i suppose.

lazs2 · « **Reply #95 on:** July 11, 2005, 08:03:35 AM »

torque... we did deal with hitler before the war.. how were we to know which eurobarbarians were gonna be the worst? Heck.. the brits still had colonies and we dealt with them.

The reason I used the plains indians was because that is the group who most consider had a war on them by the U.S. Canadas indians are not living the life of the spiritual nomadic hippie tho now are they?

lazs

Skydancer · « **Reply #96 on:** July 11, 2005, 09:09:29 AM »

Overlag speaks the truth there.

Curval · « **Reply #97 on:** July 11, 2005, 10:22:31 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
well.. we are off subject here but.. Are you saying that british ships did not supply America with slaves?

No...that isn't what I am saying.

British ships did indeed supply America with slaves initially, but so did the Dutch, the Spanish, the Portugese and American ships too.

When it was determined that slavery was an inhuman practice the Brits sent their navy to destroy the trade...much to the chagrin of your southern states, who kept the trade going for quite some time by buying through other sources.

lazs2 · « **Reply #98 on:** July 11, 2005, 02:47:58 PM »

Ahh... sooooo it was just a missunderstanding about the slave thing? soon as you realized you were trading in humans you stopped therefore making you blameless? course.... british owned and crewed ships were supplying slaves till they were no longer a commodity in America but... that is a minor detail.

lazs

weaselsan · « **Reply #99 on:** July 11, 2005, 03:23:29 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
Ahh... sooooo it was just a missunderstanding about the slave thing? soon as you realized you were trading in humans you stopped therefore making you blameless? course.... british owned and crewed ships were supplying slaves till they were no longer a commodity in America but... that is a minor detail.

lazs

Laz you gotta learn your British History...It was the Bureau of inhumane practices in Liverpool that discovered that British ships where suppling slaves where ever they got the best price. It was right after they discovered Democracy.

Pooh21 · « **Reply #100 on:** July 11, 2005, 04:19:21 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2

plains indians... where the resources were more sparce than back east, regularly looted and slaughtered everyone in a rival tribe that they found... torture was considered great sport by these "hippies of the plains" You should read about some of the great ways they had of entertaining themselves.

lazs

Yeah, Lazs got it right. Don't you hippies be done turning my ancestors in noble red hippies too.

weaselsan · « **Reply #101 on:** July 11, 2005, 05:10:47 PM »

So who won the war?....I just did a nexus search. Over 40 million hits on the Allies. Maybe we should update our history books.

Curval · « **Reply #102 on:** July 11, 2005, 07:09:52 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
Ahh... sooooo it was just a missunderstanding about the slave thing? soon as you realized you were trading in humans you stopped therefore making you blameless? course.... british owned and crewed ships were supplying slaves till they were no longer a commodity in America but... that is a minor detail.

lazs

lol...

Amazing.