And Now From Our What Were They Thinking Department

[Nash]

Exactly Toad:

"YMMV"

I think that's great. Everyone's mileage varies.

I don't put my mileage on you, and you sure as hell aint putting your mileage on me.

Freedom is great, huh?

[DREDIOCK]

Originally posted by Nash
Is it just me?

Or does anyone else find it fascinating that a country that fought tooth and nail to break away from the theocracy of Britain, wants to become one?

 

Noooo

Britain had but one legal religion

"The American people knew what would happen if the State established the Church like in England.  Even though it was not recent history to them, they knew that England went so far as forbidding worship in private homes and sponsoring all church activities and keeping people under strict dictates.  They were forced to go to the state established church and do things that were contrary to their conscience.  No other churches were allowed, and mandatory attendance of the established church was compelled under the Conventicle Act of 1665.  Failure to comply would result in imprisonment and torture.  The people did not want freedom From  religion, but freedom OF  religion."

Last time I checked we didnt have one sole legal religion and we arent imprisoning or torturing anyone for not practicing  religion.

[Nash]

Sure bud.

[Toad]

Your concern for our freedom is touching and surely appreciated.

It's simply amazing we made it this past 229 years without your help but we really do appreciate it.

I'm sure the very religious guys that founded this country appreciate it too.

The ones that opened their Declaration with "the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them" and closed it with "And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor."

The ones that hired a Chaplain for the Senate at the very first Senate session.

And the ones that put "In God We Trust" on our coins during the Civil War.

If they had only had you to warn them of the danger. Sigh. Perhaps they could have avoided those "baby steps" that have led us so far down the road to religious tyranny.

Hey, did you ever stop to think that "freedom" works in a lot of different directions?

Imagine this... schoolkids free to pray out loud at the beginning of class if they so choose while others kids might choose to remain silent. Gosh... choice and freedom for both!

Kinda like the way the pledge would be... free to say it or not say it... your choice of freedom.

Just like people are free to say "you ****ing *******" on the subway and others are free to ignore it.

Freedom is a funny thing. You can be free to say something and free to just not say that same thing. Imagine.

Interesting how some folks think they themselves should be able to say anything they like but that some speech should be prohibited in others.

Now there's a "baby step" that would worry me.

[Nash]

Wow... snark meter off the charts.

It comes down to this. I wont make you say nuthin', and you don't make me say nuthin'. We don't make nobody else say nuthin'.

We can say whatever it is our little hearts desire... But nobody is making us say anything.

It is sooooooooo simple.

[Sandman]

Originally posted by Nash
Is it just me?

Or does anyone else find it fascinating that a country that fought tooth and nail to break away from the theocracy of Britain, wants to become one?

What goes around, comes around. To everything, turn, turn turn. Next thing ya know, folks are gonna be walking around with feathered hair and a big-assed comb sticking out of their back pocket.

No, it's not just you.

[Toad]

It's so simple that that is the way it already is.

Even in Newdow's district the pledge is voluntary.

AFIK, there isn't a single public school district in the nation that is forcing little Billy to say the pledge or a prayer.

So, as you can see, Little Billy can say whatever it is his little heart desires... But nobody is making Little Billy say anything at all.

Stand down, valiant warrior; the nation is safe for one more day.

[Nash]

Listen to you.

World's apologist, excuser, look thattawayer.

No matter what the issue. No matter what it is.

In real life? I walk around people like you. Forgive me, but tick tock... I can't be arsed.

[Toad]

In real life I ignore people like you too.

Chicken Little gets so boring so fast.

[Nash]

Works for me.

[Toad]

Always does when your high dudgeon is calmed by the obvious fact.

Nobody is forced to say the pledge or pray in school. So it's all a tempest in a teapot. You finally realized the situation has always been the way you think it should be.

I wont make you say nuthin', and you don't make me say nuthin'. We don't make nobody else say nuthin'.

Dudgeon destroyed. Don Nashiote rides off with Sancho in search of another threatening windmill.

[Sandman]

Originally posted by Toad

Nobody is forced to say the pledge or pray in school.

Bull**** they don't. They never once told us it was optional. We were expected to participate, and like good little children we did just that.

Of course, it's been a long LONG time since I attended elementary school. Maybe things have changed.

[Nash]

Originally posted by Toad
Always does when your high dudgeon is calmed by the obvious fact.

Incredible. You are the don quixote here. Have always been.

Me? I'm telling you that it's a joke, a fraud, and inhumane.

So there.

[Dinger]

Yeah, I was forced to say the pledge every day before I even began to understand it.

If my parents wanted me to do that, they would have made me Baptist...


Seriously, forced oaths are not valid in any case. If they're "voluntary", why expose those who don't say it to ridicule over what is a personal issue?

You can have your gun all you want, but that doesn't mean we're gonna let you shoot unarmed people at random.

[Chairboy]

When I was in school, we were forced to say it as well.  THAT'S part of the problem.