Author Topic: I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.  (Read 683 times)

Offline LtHans

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The USA most likely will not invade Afganistan, or bomb it.  It would be so conterproductive that it isn't funny.

The problem is that the United States has been hit hard and is realing in pain right now.  We want a target to shoot (and stomp, and kill, and humiliate, and everything else bad you can think of), but there is none.  Just a handful of criminals we can't find.

I don't know what to do.  I need more information first.

Hans.

P.S.  No matter what the United States does I beleave the Muslims won't beleave or help us anyways.  The rift between Middle East and West is probably the widest it has ever been.

Offline storm

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #1 on: September 20, 2001, 04:04:00 AM »
i smell your fear Lthans

  amazing how ya still are daydreaming...i guess you will only wake up once they knock on your door

sorry to be so drastic

  storm

Offline Peer

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #2 on: September 20, 2001, 05:21:00 AM »
Leutnant Hans - I agree with you that this problem could not be solved by military.

Instead we should start to solve the existing political problems, which produces these mad terroists - and one right step would be that the USA stop to ignore the daily israelian terrorism against the palestinians.

Offline Sandman

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #3 on: September 20, 2001, 06:08:00 AM »
I believe Han's concern is not unwarranted. Afghanistan is a tough nut to crack.

No sea access and no strong U.S. allies on the borders.
sand

Offline storm

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #4 on: September 20, 2001, 06:58:00 AM »
i do not agree on that....if it was worthless why stirring up the whole region
..putting pressure on pakistan etc.Why all this beligerant mood in the start if the intelligence knows what Lthans is saying

so now US will say....it is unfit to attack the responsible of the recent tragedies because it is militarly and politically impossible to achieve a victory..we will find diplomatic ways to solve this crisis

what i begin to see here and everywhere is a  crumbling of our unity and focus with lotsa people....once we find out that there are dozens of nations harbouring instigating supporting financing the groups that are responsible we gonna pluck our heads into the sand even deeper and wait a couple hundred years more so that our future generations can fight it out with even heavier losses.Clever way to save ya own ass

the more i see things develloping we playing right into the hands of these guys.We trying hard to avoid a religious confrontation while we happily throw more logs into the fire by correlating our moral maturity from nowadays with the far wild west with dead or alive posters.I wonder if we have enough water standing by to put the fire out

What i dont understand is why islam doesnt deal with it's radical religious people in the same way as we do.We centuries ahead in acceptance!Why do they turn their backs on this problem in their own countries and only make it difficult for intelligence to operate in these countries?
We harbour terrorists like anti abortionist who blow up innocent women,radical cristian guys,unabombers etc....we deal with them and try to minimize the risks and escalation of these problems..they dont fly a jet into mekka...they are few unsponsored,not financed ,not supported by our democratic regimes.

 Why cant the islamic countries contain this problem...my only answer is they can't because the problem has become way bigger than any prowestern islamic leaders might even  admit fueled by many events in the last decades.
 They are all walking a very very very thin line IMHO.We mostly base our facts on news that is layed out in front of us and evidence we see from analysts.We have no clue what is going on in the minds of the biggest percentage of these populations.

Hitler had not much approval and % when he started his carreer and we know how far he made it and how many he convinced of dying for his cause.Btw he convinced many educated and many religious people too.

So i guess like history always teached us...we will not learn from our mistakes unfortunately

guess nature finally got it's way in curbing down the population explosion

sorry for being so negative

storm

Offline Peer

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #5 on: September 20, 2001, 07:43:00 AM »
Religious madness is not copyrighted by Islam.

Look at the mad prople in North Irland who throws bombs on little schoolgirls  or this US christian fanatic who told that the desaster of WTC was a punishment of God, because the USA has become decadent and tolerates abortion or homosexuality.

You will find madness and stupid fanatics in all countries, all races and all religions in this world.

Offline Eagler

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #6 on: September 20, 2001, 07:48:00 AM »
I don't think you are negative storm by any means, I'd call it realistic..

Seems some would rather hold hands and sing "Why can't we be Friends" as if this will rid the world of this ever growing evil force and it's influence over the less educated and/or less enlightened..

for those that don't get it .. it is a battle carried through the ages
.. Good against Evil.

Plain and simple...
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Offline storm

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #7 on: September 20, 2001, 07:56:00 AM »
i agree with you peer

please can you give me your estimates on how many fanatics or whatever you want to call them we have that want to destroy the free economy, the infidels that watch TV ,drink alcohol,and condon pornography against the ones that wasnt to destroy the Islam?

that might help me in my quest

storm

this link is to a recent speech held 8 months ago by our fellow statesmen who still is in power in Iraq..enjoy
 http://www.uruklink.net/iraq/e17j-01.htm

Offline Toad

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #8 on: September 20, 2001, 08:06:00 AM »
You guys.

Why don't you wait and see what "proof" develops.

Why don't you wait and see what "the plan" is.

This isn't just about Bin Laden and Afghanistan. It's going to be much, much bigger than that.

If you don't think so, you haven't been watching the news and reading the papers.

Governments use the media, you know. We are all being prepared to follow the path they intend to follow. The clues are there, are you ignoring them?

This is only the beginning.

We take these guys on now or the next time, maybe real soon, it IS a nuke at the Superbowl.

Sing "cum by yah" all you like. Negotitate all you like. Send them food, send them doctors. They'll smile and accept it all.

Then they'll nuke us.

Face it. Deal with it.

Did you read what the Egyptian father of one of the hijackers said? Atta's father in an interview "laced his conversation with fierce attacks against the United States, a "tyrant nation" which he blasted repeatedly for supporting Israel and for moral contagions like adultery and homosexual marriage." (KC Star, from Wire Reports)

Get it through your heads... they're NOT going to stop. It's a war.

Well, unless I guess we're willing to abandon Israel (probably guaranteeing nuke use in that area... by Israel) and turn over all US adulterers and homosexuals to the mullahs for trial and punishment under Islamic law.   :rolleyes: We could probably negotitate that...........

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: Toad ]
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline storm

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2001, 08:24:00 AM »
that last post had a bad spelling error :(

it should be
"that want to destroy the Islam"

sorry i have no clue how to reedit the post,can someone help me out there..must be real simple but rightnow i have no clue..see no specific place to click

thx

Offline Eagler

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2001, 08:33:00 AM »
Readers Digest this month (Oct 2001)

very good article:

Wired for Death
USA Today
Why dozens of young Palestinians choose to become suicide bombers.

sad when a father & thier friends consider his son a "hero" when his son commits suicide as a bomber taking 21 innocent lives with him..freakin nutcases, all of them.
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Offline Pepe

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2001, 08:34:00 AM »
storm,

63% of Pakistan population backs taliban regime & attacks on U.S.

2/3 of Turkey (a NATO nation  :eek:  ) population is against any form of rataliation against a muslim country.

India/Pakistan conflict is not rich vs. poor people, but a religious one. Still they are fighting. Cachemir region has been India region. Pakistan claims is their because its muslim population.

In normal times, I would give them the benefit of the doubt, and doubt they really want to destroy free economy, or TV watchers, etc. Now, it's time to ask the other way. How many of them are not ready to do it? I think your quest's focus would be right on the spot this way.

Ultimate goal of muslim fanatics is not attacking U.S. It's not only liberation of holy places and fighting crusaders. It's not only throwing Israel people to the Mediterranean sea. It's about Islam prevalence and world domination. As simple as that. They want to either convert the infidels or kill them. Go ask people jailed in Afghanistan, accusation: Christian proselitism. But they need to get muslims united, and thus the killings and hate. Once they get this done, they will carry on. Their goal is more far-reaching.

Islam is a humanistic/tolerant religion. But it's widely interpretative. And it has no single head. No one in particular can say his interpretation is the "right one". You can't count on a moderate interpretation. Too much hate in there for that.

Yes, Afghanistan is a useless, valueless, military target. Islam as a concept (or a religion) is not the target. But there are lots of islam interpreters who are, because we are their own. Stated loud and clear, white over black by themselves. The ones that would kill you for the mere reason you are not muslim. How many of them? Where are they? Are they the only ones? Read the newspapers. See the tv. Read books. Listen to things. It's so evident.

Of course military is not the only solution. But it's an important part of it. The financial side is, at least, as important. Then the borders policy in western countries. Then the suppression of certain organizations/governments/people. In the meantime, you can talk and negotiate. But the baseline is very clear, If you want to see it. You have to deal with people willing to kill you. And ready to do it if you give them the slightest chance. As per Toad's: "Get it through your heads".

If moderate muslims can cope with demagogic fanatic leaders, and we are able to provide some solid ground under their feet, maybe (and I say maybe because it might well be too late) we don't have to face a generalized conflict. My personal feeling is that we are hands and feet at war. Like it or not.

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: Pepe ]

Offline storm

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2001, 08:48:00 AM »
thx for helping in my quest pepe

i'll stop being cynic now

<S>!

Offline Yeager

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2001, 09:49:00 AM »
Very interesting perspective pepe.

Sounds believable enough.......at least its a shade more encouraging than the "blame america for everything wrong in the world" posts...

Y
"If someone flips you the bird and you don't know it, does it still count?" - SLIMpkns

Offline Eagler

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I beleave the general concensus is that attackign Afgansitan is worthless.
« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2001, 09:54:00 AM »
"Masters of the Air" Scenario - JG27


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