Author Topic: Hello McFly! ... Anyone home...  (Read 478 times)

Offline Eagler

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Hello McFly! ... Anyone home...
« on: April 09, 2001, 01:34:00 PM »
You guys realizing how serious this is getting or are you trying to figure out if you've already seen tonight's rerun Ally McBeal ....

The Coming War With China  
John L. Perry
April 4, 2001

President Roosevelt's imperative six decades ago has returned to seize President Bush: He must prepare a distracted nation for a war it could well lose.
George W. Bush may not have the luxury of the time allotted Franklin D. Roosevelt.

The revolting spectacle of the incarceration of two dozen young American service men and women like common criminals on Chinese soil is not what the United States and Communist China will go to war over.

Neither how, nor how soon nor whether this latest incident in downward-spiraling relations between the two nations is resolved is of critical importance in the larger picture of peace or war.

Its historic significance is that the United States and China are already in the Never-Never Land of undeclared war.

Beijing well understands this. The Hainan Island insult is the message Washington may finally get.

There was no way the United States could have avoided being drawn into World War II. There is some possibility it may yet avoid all-out military conflict this time.

But the United States cannot now possibly be spared all-out economic warfare with the mainland of China.

And there is no guarantee the United States will be able to emerge victorious from either, or both, of those conflicts with the People's Republic of China.

If the United States were to set out this very day to prepare itself only for economic war with China, there is no logical assurance it might not end up as an economic vassal of China for generations to come.

If it fails to prepare at once for military war with China it would with absolute certainty lay itself open to military subjugation as well.

The only option open for the United States that offers any possibility of escaping a losing economic and/or military war with China is to prepare to engage China in mortal military conflict.

It may sound contradictory, but there is only one way to prevent ultimate war with China. That is to be prepared and willing to wage such a war – even if the odds going in are against the United States' emerging victorious.

FDR took the difficult decisions to press on, even at times when it seemed the only hope was hope, itself.

That required magnificent steel.

It is the same kind of steel that President Bush is now called upon by history to reach within himself and find.

Economic warfare with China can no longer be prevented, averted, avoided or ignored.

Military war, possibly – but only if the United States is prepared and willing to wage it.

There is no guarantee the United States could defeat China in either of those wars, let alone both.

The only surety is that this country will lose both if it fails to prepare to fight either.

Unlike in World War II, this time the United States must be willing to go it alone, even when old allies array against it – as they surely will. The economic forces, in all Western countries, that covet China as a market to exploit are awesome and relentless.

Bush will find his own country, even his own Republican Party as well as the Democratic Party, shearing into two irreconcilable camps:

• Those who put doing business with the communists above all else, including loyalty to the United States.

• Those who put patriotism ahead of profits.

The conditions Roosevelt faced and Bush now faces are not identical.

Roosevelt had an economy still on its backside.

Bush enjoys an economy still fundamentally sound.

Roosevelt had a people distracted but also imbued with an historic American patriotism that in the end carried the day.

Bush has a people distracted but also reluctant to accept responsibility.

Here lies the greatest peril Bush faces: This country is in even less condition to go into battle of any kind than it was in FDR's time.

America today is frenetically self-absorbed and self-indulgent.

Barbarians have sensed this un-sated market and captured the national culture.

With remarkable exceptions, the free press has opted for entertainment, escapism, coping, notoriety, freak shows, outrage, exhibitionism and screaming conflict.

More Americans are less well-informed, less able to render educated opinions than at any previous time in the nation's history.

There is across the land a subculture in thrall to narcotics and the crime required to underwrite addictions, only too willing to destroy the larger fabric of society in time of national crisis.

How, then, to educate and lead a people who cannot locate China in an atlas and who think war is something someone named Spielberg creates on screens with computers for their titillation?

No, the prospects don't look too good.

But this is not altogether Hollywood. This is still America.

And most Americans do yet have a marvelous way of waking up and, yes, even growing up when their nation's imperative is laid out for them honestly.

That is George W. Bush's challenge – to get this message across to the American people and to act on that imperative.

It is part education, part character – the irreducible elements of leadership.

The world will now see just how much steel there is in this president's character.

A bright light burns in the White House; he is married to an educator.

(and this)

The China Syndrome II
Christopher Ruddy
Monday, April 9, 2001
"The China Syndrome" was the name of the controversial anti-nuclear power movie that starred Jane Fonda and was based on the idea that the meltdown of a nuclear reactor would carve its way right through the planet earth, all the way to China.
So far that hasn't happened, but the sequel "China Syndrome II" should star friends of Jane Fonda, Bill and Hillary Clinton.

This movie could reveal how they engineered a meltdown of America's national security that burned a hole right through our country.

During the past eight years that I have been covering the national scene, I have consistently been amazed by the daze people seem to be in as the most dramatic developments have taken place.

Sometimes I wondered if anyone was paying attention. Did anyone care?

Much of my reporting directly covered the official corruption of the Clintons and their administration.

It was arguably the most corrupt administration in history, but that's not how the media played the story of the Clinton years.

Even the pardongate scandal – clear-cut evidence of the Clintons' treachery – seems to be fading by the day.

Still, I know that if we hide from truth, reality eventually does catch up with all of us.

With the Chinese hostage situation we are now witnessing this reality, a reality created by the Clintons and shaped by the major media.

China – our one-time "ally" – has been holding 24 American servicemen and servicewomen prisoner for over a week.

The current crisis is nothing more than a classic hostage situation.

Webster's defines a hostage as "a person held by one party in a conflict as a pledge that promises will be kept or terms met by the other party."

China has made public its terms: It will release the hostages if the United States issues an apology for the loss of the Chinese pilot and plane.

This demand may just be a negotiating chip, as the Chinese may really be seeking a private pledge from the U.S. not to sell Taiwan high-tech military equipment, including jets and destroyers.

While the hostage story has gotten press play – the major media couldn't very well ignore 24 Americans imprisoned in China – I am amazed how these media are subtly downplaying this incredible and dangerous situation.

CNN's Andrea Koppel, for example, took a feather from Dad's cap Sunday when she said this was clearly not a hostage situation because China was not demanding money.

Perhaps by this new Koppel standard, we haven't seen many hostage situations in the Mideast, since they usually involve terrorists "just" demanding the release of other terrorists or making some other non-monetary demand.

By downplaying the significance of the current situation, what is the game?

I am not so sure.

But one thing I know is that America remains complacent, and the major media are doing little to rouse Americans from their daze.

Reality Check

On Sunday, Tim Russert questioned Dick Cheney about the Chinese defense minister's statement that war with the U.S. is "inevitable."

Kudos to Russert. Except for Russert, this statement, now a year old, has only been reported in the Washington Times.

Why has the press ignored regular statements by Chinese officials and Chinese official news outlets that China is prepared to use nuclear weapons against the U.S. and her naval fleets?

The recent Chinese action should send chills down the spine. It should be a red alarm of the threat now posed by China. It is a threat compounded by the fact that China and Russia have formed a new axis to challenge the United States.

Both nations have talked openly of their new strategic and military partnership that has been strengthened by Bill Clinton's uncalled-for war in the Balkans.

For years we were told – justifiably – that by befriending China we would move them out of the Russian orbit and divide the communist world.

For a while that strategy worked, but policymakers never seemed to consider what would happen if Russia and China buried the hatchet, as they apparently have done. The country with the largest conventional army, China, is now married to the country with the largest nuclear arsenal, Russia.

China can act quite confidently now.

Republicans who think that Bush can easily make counterdemands to the Chinese should think again.

Thanks to Bill Clinton, the U.S. military has been emasculated, and our Navy and Air Force have been cut almost in half over the past eight years.

In fact, the hand Bush has been dealt by Clinton is significantly weaker than the one Jimmy Carter left Ronald Reagan in 1981.

China is also much, much stronger than it was 20 years ago. Reportedly, it has all of the nuclear weapons we have in our arsenal.

Thanks again to Bill Clinton, the Chinese also have our ballistic missile technology, allowing them to hit our cities with pinpoint accuracy.

Is China planning to go to war with the U.S. tomorrow?

I don't think so. Instead, this current hostage situation serves several purposes.

First, it's a dry run for the blackmail strategy China will likely employ when it makes its move on Taiwan in the next year or two. If America backs down now for 24 crew members, it will most undoubtedly do so when China threatens to hit Los Angeles with nuclear weapons as it seeks to secure Taiwan.

Second, the current hostage situation serves to embarrass the U.S. in front of its allies in Asia.

Impotent America will lose face and China knows this will weaken confidence in the U.S.'s security umbrella over Japan, South Korea, the Philippines and other Asian nations. The leaders of these nations will quietly understand that China, not America, dominates the region.

Bush is not in an enviable position.

He made a mistake by not agreeing to emergency funding for the Pentagon earlier this year. The best action he could take to deal with the current crisis is to go back to Congress and ask for more than double the amount in emergency defense funding. This will send the best message to China and our allies.

China knows that after eight years of Bill Clinton, it is in the catbird seat. The next couple of years will offer a window of opportunity to get Taiwan before Cheney and Rumsfeld rebuild American forces.

Surely, other enemies of the U.S. – among them Saddam, the Iranians, the Libyans and North Koreans – will also seek to take advantage of us during this period. We should pray that they don't do so simultaneously.

The current EP-3 incident should not be treated as some bump in the road – as the media are playing the story – but as a precursor of things to come.

Expect even more fireworks from China, perhaps right after monsoon season ends this August.
_____________________________ __

just the beginning I feel....

sorry so long

Eagler
 



[This message has been edited by Eagler (edited 04-09-2001).]
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Offline AKDejaVu

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Hello McFly! ... Anyone home...
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2001, 01:40:00 PM »
I guess we could quote articles where assumptions are made, or we could just sit back and wait to see how things turn out.  Either way, we have no control over the situaion.

The only thing these threads really seem to be is a basis for people to argue about things they really don't have enough information to be accurate on.  Just a bunch of heresay and conjecture proceded with the thumping of chests and the usual name-calling nationalistic diatribe prevelant in any international thread on this bbs.

And I don't watch Ally McBeal.

AKDejaVu

Offline Mighty1

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Hello McFly! ... Anyone home...
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2001, 02:50:00 PM »
AKDejaVu I beleive you are wrong.

Here is the proof: Quote from Some newspaper  
Quote
"AKDejaVu is wrong!"

So go back to what ever worthless nation you came from you Democrat.

How was that?
I have been reborn a new man!

Notice I never said a better man.

Offline miko2d

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Hello McFly! ... Anyone home...
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2001, 04:47:00 PM »
 DejaVu,
 Chinese do not give me enough information for me to demand my government to appologise. That is in itself information for me.
 As for the control, I have as much as any US citizen with an access to a congressman.

 miko

Offline mietla

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« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2001, 06:30:00 PM »
like your proof Mighty1  


Offline mrfish

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« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2001, 07:10:00 PM »
it would sure make strip mall life in the suburbs mnore interesting if we were at war.

Offline AKDejaVu

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Hello McFly! ... Anyone home...
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2001, 07:12:00 PM »
 
Quote
Here is the proof: Quote from Some newspaper

quote:
---------------------------------------------
"AKDejaVu is wrong!"
---------------------------------------------

Ah yes, I remember that time vividly.  I just didn't think the one and only time I was wrong merrited such spectacular news coverage

AKDejaVu