Author Topic: bin laden asks for truce (Read 1973 times)

Gunslinger · « **Reply #30 on:** January 19, 2006, 06:31:51 PM »

Yea ask Spain what a truce with Muslim Extremest Fascists is worth:

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"The train bombings in Madrid on March 11, 2004, killed 191. Three days later, Spaniards voted out the pro-war government and voted in the anti-war Socialists. The incoming prime minister vowed to promptly pull out Spanish troops from Iraq. Spain's reward? On April 2, 2004, Spanish authorities found a 22-pound bomb on a railway track between Madrid and Seville. And, later that year, in October, Spanish authorities foiled a plot to blow up their National Court, Spain's center for prosecuting terrorists. So much for Osama bin Laden's "offer," made a month after the Madrid train bombings, for a "truce" to any European country that stops "attacking Muslims" before a three-month deadline."

Rino · « **Reply #31 on:** January 19, 2006, 06:47:03 PM »

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Originally posted by superpug1
I have an idea. y not do what they did in the robot movie, u know where each country has a giant robot and to settle disputes they just fight in this HUGE colosium. Or like what happened in that show where america and China where at war. Each country sent one of its best soldiers to this island, there they had to kill each other. Whoever won settled the war.

I'm having to wonder just how high tech a robot Bin Laden could
build. Maybe a giant car filled with explosives?

Ack-Ack · « **Reply #32 on:** January 19, 2006, 07:04:27 PM »

ack-ack

Pooh21 · « **Reply #33 on:** January 19, 2006, 07:10:24 PM »

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Originally posted by Ack-Ack

ack-ack

While a Draconis Atlas, or even better a Robotech Veritech would represent the US in a battle of giant robots.

This is what those homicidal sandmonkeys would comeup with

AWMac · « **Reply #34 on:** January 19, 2006, 07:41:23 PM »

Let's invite him and all his henchmen to a wonderful discussion at the UN Building in NYC... and fly a few remote 747's into it during the main course. Make sure Kofi and Family are there and Kim, Jung Il.....

Dammm I should be the Prez!!!

Prez Mac..

~New Taxes? There are NO Taxes!!!

You work hard enough, that's taxing enough!

WelFare? Well you better learn how to Fare for yourself!
You and your 7 children can help to keep American Freeways clean. Minumum wage. Your subsidized home... will dedesized, those that can't work Highways will be moving in with your tired asre. Until we assist you in working at the landfill.

Borders? Closed and Guarded. NAFTA is outta here, you both took enough advantage. Bye! Same with NATO... cya ~Bye~ Sponge off Belguim or someone..you have a 30 day notice.

You long time Politicians? Cya, gone.. ohhh no serverance either. You ripped us off long enough. We now repocess the stuff that made you thrive off of "We The People..." It will be actioned and money given to those working the Highways.

Nurses, Teachers, Firemen and Police will have a double hike in pay. You are what saves us. Psst short note to the Postal Office. If you don't wanna be riding horses again across the Fine Divide I suggest staying with the 2 cent stamp, email is kicking yer arse any ways.

Europe, Asia, Middle East and all point beyond. Warning notice: We have just successfully closed our Borders. You are not welcomed to come here and trash America. We had enough. Next week we are turning the Statue of Liberty areound a bit to face where the Twin Towers were and her Lamp will shine for all that had perished... not the "Bring us you're tired and Humble Masses..." but "We Shall Never Forget".

You Atheist out there better run, Chistmas is "Christmas!" You have a problem with that then flee... We are a Country based upon Religeon and the freedom of choice to pick and do so. "In God We Trust" Let that burn in your eyes as you run.

Hollywood and you lame Actors/Actresses along with the Music Industry...Bye~! If it takes crap/political BS/Scientology to sell yer asre then sell it in China. Your outta here!

Now for the American People. We need to pick ourselves up, dust ourselves off, there's alotta work to be done.

We will now take care of Ourselves and let the rest of the ungreatful World fend for themselves.

Voting on the "Free America" ticket...

Mac

weaselsan · « **Reply #35 on:** January 19, 2006, 07:46:23 PM »

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Originally posted by Momus--
You're missing the point Seagoon. I don't care if the Bin Laden offer is genuine or not although I suspect that the reports are untrue. The problem is that you are presenting verses as undisputed evidence for your position that people like Bin-Laden represent the underlying mainstream of Islamic doctrine whilst omitting context that doesn't support that view. You've just done it again because you fail to mention that Sura 9 is referring to a real event, the Battle of Tabouk that took place in Arabia in 630AD. By your standards I may as well cite Deuteronomy 7.1 & 2 as allowing for the Jews of 2006 to ethnically cleanse palestine of all non-jews:

Ridiculous no?

As for the Ghazali citations; what do you think they prove?

One is permitted to lie in war time. Well no kidding? Didn't Churchill write that the first casualty of war is the truth?

One is obliged to lie if protecting someone from an oppressor? Sounds like a nice rule to me.

I'm not quite sure what you think the significance of al-Ghazali's work is in this context. Whether Bin Laden can use it to legitimize his actions is moot since he represents only himself and a relatively small number of deviants. I'm quite happy for you to asign the worst of motives to his movement, as long as we're clear that it is just his band of extremists that we're referring to.

Osama makes up the rules as he goes along. A simple Quran reading would instantly give him an excuse to ignore any (Treaty).

009.012
YUSUFALI: But if they violate their oaths after their covenant, and taunt you for your Faith,- fight ye the chiefs of Unfaith: for their oaths are nothing to them: that thus they may be restrained.
PICKTHAL: And if they break their pledges after their treaty (hath been made with you) and assail your religion, then fight the heads of disbelief - Lo! they have no binding oaths - in order that they may desist.
SHAKIR: And if they break their oaths after their agreement and (openly) revile your religion, then fight the leaders of unbelief-- surely their oaths are nothing-- so that they may desist.

In other words accept Islam or you violate the treaty.

batdog · « **Reply #36 on:** January 19, 2006, 08:38:28 PM »

Divide and conquer.

Its a simplistic tactic to get people talking and then fighting. People who are willing to blow themself up arent into truces. Osma's prime tactic is to break us economicly thus any expressed concern for the cost of war is absurd.

Gunslinger · « **Reply #37 on:** January 19, 2006, 08:46:39 PM »

4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.

Maverick · « **Reply #38 on:** January 19, 2006, 08:51:58 PM »

"Safeguarding of a Muslim's life is a mandatory obligation that should be observed; and that lying is permissible when the shedding of a Muslim's blood is at stake."

How is this not in contradiction with the bombing of multiple muslims to include a wedding party and more hypocritically, a mosque??

DREDIOCK · « **Reply #39 on:** January 19, 2006, 08:55:37 PM »

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Originally posted by john9001
i doubt that, all bridges in america are falling down and need billions in repair but the govt has no money because bush gave the "rich" people tax cuts.

?? did i just highjack my own thread?

and if you beleive that line of rhetoric I have a perfecly good bridge to sell you.

Besides.It is my understanding that in most cases most of the bridge repairs are the states responcability, Not the federal goverment.

AWMac · « **Reply #40 on:** January 19, 2006, 08:58:14 PM »

Nuke Mecca, just to let them know we care!

Hmmm Irans President is in Syria... it doesn't take a rocket scientist to realize that maybe they are having Dinner at the Syrian Presidential Palace? Hello...? Crash the party with a few Tomahawks...geez, kill two birds with one stone.

Worried about the Worlds Impression of America? Get over it, Maybe if we lop the heads off of a few in Gitmo on live Kezarra, they might understand we mean business! I still say a single grenade in a Tikrit spider hole would have solved a few probs.

Mac

And I still believe the only thing stopping a Kennady Family Reunion is a single bullet. Ted is one Flubbed Duck Senator.

Masherbrum · « **Reply #41 on:** January 19, 2006, 10:25:26 PM »

4- Members should post in a way that is respectful of other users and HTC. Flaming or abusing users is not tolerated.

Seagoon · « **Reply #42 on:** January 19, 2006, 11:31:45 PM »

Hello Momus,

The critical difference in your analogy is that Deuteronomy 7 refers to instructions given to the nation of Israel thousands of years ago in the midst of the Herem. Those specific instructions no longer apply. "The Reliance of the Traveller" however, is an explanation of Quranic law that is still bought and referred to by hundreds of thousands of Sunni Muslims worldwide. The instructions in the Quran and the Hadiths are still being followed. The idea that it is acceptable to lie to infidels in times of war, and to break treaties in order to advance the greater good of the Dar El Islam is a concept that Millions of Muslims subscribe to, not just Osama. We had a long discussion of this on other controversial portions of Sharia during a study group way back in 1989 before OBL was even on the radar screen.

Do you think OBL was raised and educated in a Vaccuum? He and men like Zarqawi actually understand traditional Islam very well, and certainly their actions are in no way at odds with those of the prophet. That's not just my take on it, that's one of the reasons they are so popular with the Ummah internationally.

In any event, Westerners don't understand the "permissible lie", because our society is still based in part on the command "You shall not bear false witness" and the understanding that we shouldn't do what we know to be evil even if our overall objective is good. For us, even if we are liars by nature, we understand lies to be bad. That's why we feel so guilty today for all those treaties made in bad faith with Indians.

I know you desperately want this all to be about one gangly Saudi Arabian, but there's a reason his T-Shirts sell so well in Islamabad and why AQ can easily plant cells in Mosques in London, Paris, Jakarta, Singapore, the Phillipines, the United States, Thailand, etc ad nauseum.

Momus, the truth is Bin Laden is a symptom, not the actual disease.

- SEAGOON

Pooh21 · « **Reply #43 on:** January 19, 2006, 11:44:04 PM »

if its a disease, just like cancer, best way to kill it is with a "little" radiation.

Momus-- · « **Reply #44 on:** January 20, 2006, 04:31:35 AM »

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