StSanta---

[J_A_B]

I noticed that in one of your threads you mentioned that the USA has separation of church of state, and that your country doesn't.  I found that comment interesting. Would you care to explain how this makes life different for you than for those of us in the USA?

I was under the impression that your government didn't take a very active role in religion.  Your comment implies that I am mistaken.  Are you required to be of a specific faith by law?   Do your tax dollars go to support a church you don't believe in?  I really am interested.

I didn't want to hijack your thread, so I created a new one.  Any reply would be appreciated.

J_A_B

[RAM]

As far as Spain is concerned (and I know this was for Stsanta  ) the separation of church and state is almost complete. In the tax papers you have the option to put a X in the cell for the Catholic Church, if you sign it, part of the taxes go to the church (but they dont charge you more for it).

There is no official religion in Spain, but catholicism, of course, is very well established.

[StSanta]

J_A_B:

that's right. This country is an Evangelical Lutheran one. We have a state church - which prefers to call itself "the people's church" in order to avoid the connotations.

No, there's no law requiring one to follow a specific faith - we have freedom of religion here, it's just that one is supported by the state, the rest aren't. I was probably born into the church because my parents were members already.

I was born into this church, and had no way of getting out of it before I was 18.

Denmark is a very secular state here, Christians are considered a little bit weird, not the other way around   . The state claims to have no influence over the church but we do have a church minister. there's an odd arrangement following the pople's church thing. Unfortunately, all our politicians are soo afraid to deal with the people's church. Recently, they've spent millions building unneeded conference rooms, new churces with very low attendances and whatnot.

And the damned church bells wake me up every Sunday. Wonder how they'd react if I started sounding horns in honour of Nirfur, god Of All Things Yellow And Furry?

A little more than one per cent of my income went to the church, back when I was a member. Now, since this is a very secular county, most don't mind. And you need to be a member of the church if you want to use it for marriage, I believe, so it's unusual for people to choose to step away from it.

But there are principles as state here; it's no good to force a child into a religion; well, to force a young adult into a religion. State sponsored religions also mean that you can get student money from the state IF you study to become a Lutheran priest, but NOT if you study to become a Catholic one.

It irritates me to no avail when I have a discussion with some priest and he, smugly and arrogantly, comments, "well, after all, Denmark IS a Christian nation". It's quite far from the truth; very few danes are True Christians or seem to care one way or the other, except when it comes to wedding and funerals, at which time churches seem to be quite good to have around.

So for me, I was born into the church. When I asked my mother wether I could get out of it, I was told that it could be done if I had my parents consent and was over 15. My mother, thinking that it was just me rebelling against her and my father, decided to wait it out.

Unfortunately, I know very little about the actual laws or practicalities. I know that I was born into the church without having something to say about it, and I was told by my mother I had to wait to get out. This might be wrong data; I'll check on it.

So cherish what you got yanks   . Got us beaten there, fair and square.

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Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"
 
"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch

[This message has been edited by StSanta (edited 01-29-2001).]

[Kieren]

I don't think so; people think you are weird here, too, if you go to a Christian church. Some stuff about "mind control" and "corrupting the values of our youth" and other heinous crimes of the church.  

[StSanta]

Right Kieren.  .

Personally, knowing ow impressionable kids are and how authoritarian they are when it comes to knowledge from their parents, I feel that one should wait with the introduction until they're old enough to rationally decide for themselves.

Of course, theists would protest - it'd mean eternal damnation for the kids should they die before this age. Not easy to solve :/

95% of the world theists have the same religion as their parents. It's hardly a coincidence  .

Dawkins described it as a "mind meme". Interesting definition.

Hehehe  

------------------
Baron Claus "StSanta" Von Ribbentroppen
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

"I don't necessarily agree with everything I think." - A. Eldritch

[J_A_B]

Thanks for the replies StSanta and RAM

StSanta--your situation in Denmark doesn't seem too much different from what we have in the USA.  It's different on paper, but overall the situation is almost the same.

Most people are born into some church or another in the USA.   Since children have very little freedom of their own (understandably) they do what their parents want them to.  I, for example, was born a Catholic and technically still am a Catholic--although I haven't gone inside a church in more than 10 years and never willingly participated in anything the Church did.   The difference is here it isn't state-supported.

Like you, we must be a member of a religion to marry whithin it.  Otherwise we are stuck with getting married by a judge in some courthouse.  That or "common law" marriage, which isn't even available in every state (I don't know if Denmark or Spain has anything like common law marriage, where you legally become married after living with your mate for a given period of time).

Available government funding for Lutheran study would annoy the crap out of me though, as would the apparent waste of government money on churches and such.  The one major difference between our countries seems to be that in the USA, it is illegal for the government to support a religion (although certain poloticians don't want to believe that).

RAM:  You can mark on your taxes whether you want a small amount to go to the Catholic Church?   That is amusing to me because in the USA we have the option to check a box which diverts a small amount of our taxes to supporting political campaigns.  Maybe our politicians think their gods?    hehehe


I do appreciate the fact that my tax money doesn't go to support some "faith based group" (the new catchphrase).  Still, in my day-to-day life, it matters little.  That is probably why most Americans don't appreciate their "separation of church and state"--it has hardly any effect on their daily lives.


J_A_B