Author Topic: Gunnery help  (Read 1545 times)

Offline Schatzi

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Gunnery help
« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2006, 04:33:40 AM »
bkbandit, you CANT give "average bullets needed", it very much depends on the range, convergence, speed, point your hitting, spreading out of the bullets.

Ive hosed my ENTIRE ammo load (=2600 bullets) into a 110 and he didnt even start smoking. The next day it took me 150 bullets to make a same 110 blow up.



Check your private messages bk (on bottom of the forum page, under the Squadron forum).
21 is only half the truth.

Offline DamnedRen

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Gunnery help
« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2006, 10:42:57 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by bkbandit
some improvements but i noe the coverages will make life easier. I set them all to 300 and i got nothin but problems, every fight i got in he was really close, and snap shots didnt work. If i put all my guns at one point in situation when the target is close im screwed, and it all depends on the situation, ill be chasein a enemy in a straight line and at 600 i can get hits but when im twistin and turnin and im 200 yards behind those 300 yard 50s r real hard tp put on the target.  But then set to close its the opposite.  I tryed a more spread out coverage and one thats kinda in the middle of the two. I tryed 325 275 225 and 325 300 250.  Some times i rip apart some guys and other times i hav to put alot of lead on him.  How many hit should it take for ur average 109 spitfire la etc?


I think you're beginning to understand what the weight of impact really means. If you set your guns to 600 yds and the enemy is flying straight away you will get some hits. Not much damage but some hits. This is telling you gun convergence really works. When I suggested you close it up to 300 yards I also stated you need to shoot at that range. The .50's are very flat shooting so closer means the rounds go little higher.
Consistancy is the name of the game. Learn to park at 300 yds on the guys 6. If you can't there 70% of the time then figure out what distance you can saddle up consistantly.  Whatever that distance is that's where you set your convergence. You need to understand that 600 yards is a bit of a stretch for .50's now. The guns have been weakened to the point that 500 is about max effective range. Also, as you get better at flying you'll find the distance you can saddle up gets closer.

Ok, there's one more piece of the shooting puzzle. Turn on your tracers. Now get up and roll into a hard right hard turn and start firing. Watch your tracers. If you notice the rounds get real spread out. And the distance between where each one hits get bigger and bigger.  This is going to happen every single time you  touch the stick. It's called firing under G load. So this is a real secret of effective gunnery. If you want all the bullets to hit at the convergence point then the best shot is what's called an "unloaded shot".  Unload means remove all pressure from the stick. Get your nose pointed directly where you want the bullets to go while having no stick pressure. Loosen your grip then "gently" pull the trigger. All the rounds will converge at the convergence setting you set and the weight of impact will knock him out of the air.

My suggestion for easy kills...
1) figure out how close you can "normally" get for a shot. Set convergence at that point.  
2) work on getting close for the shot. Don't fire until you know your in the saddle.
3) fly his 6 until you can take an unloaded shot then ease your grip and gently pull the trigger. You'll find the  shot while he's moving around in front of you. He'll wiggle but will evenuatlly give you the unloaded shot. Pop him then and move on to your next target.
4) the last thing is continue to practice your dogfighting skills until you can work you way into 200 yards consistantly. Always reset convergence to where you get consistantly saddle up to.

Lastly, if you can only get to 700 yds in a fight. You have a choice to make. Either sign up and get some real lessons from the AH2 training staff. Or,

take up golf and let me say a round of golf is $40. That 2.5 months of flying in AH2.... Get my drift? :)

Hope this helps.

Offline stantond

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Gunnery help
« Reply #17 on: April 10, 2006, 12:15:28 PM »
One thing to consider, which is a bit abstract, is the effect of gravity and pulling g's.  Using the .target xxx command allows you to see the effect of gravity, dispersion, and convergence on a fixed target.  However, unless you are diving or climbing when firing at the target the effect of pulling g's is not seen.   At the other extreme, deflection shooting is a situation where almost all the effect on gunnery is from pulling g's and not from gravity.

Since planes can fly in all three dimensions both gravity and g's will change the bullets flight path in AH.  Learning to hit targets from weird plane orientations just takes practice.  Fortunately, using the LCG in the TA, offline, or H2H will allow you to practice all the sight pictures you will typically encounter against other fighters and get a 'feel' for when to shoot.  In my opinion, gunnery is one of the most difficult aspects of the game.

One note that I have not seen mentioned:

Keep zoom fixed so the same sight picture is always used when firing.  Zoom helps when figuring out a planes orientation, but not when firing.  



Good luck, and have fun!

Regards,

Malta

Offline bkbandit

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Gunnery help
« Reply #18 on: April 10, 2006, 01:22:40 PM »
My shot is getting alot better.  I just smacked up more then a hand full of fighters ranging from zeros to il2s.  The only problem ill have is just being consistant but that takes time.  I just cant let it fustrate me cause then i cant shoot nothin.  The hardest shots to make are those level behind there 6 shots.  I got to pour some shells on him but i eventually get him.  I have been mesin around wit the m16 and i think its helpin me on those 6 shots.  It just sucks cause sometimes i dont get the chance to sit down and play but i make time.  Hopefully wit time i can just take out reds witt the first burst.

Any more little tips.

Offline bkbandit

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Gunnery help
« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2006, 10:40:47 PM »
Well i guess i learned ill ima learn. Now its time to just basically put the time in.  Alot of improvements and it feels good, just come up on a zero or spit and make him pay with a .50 calibre shower.  You guys helped me out alot and i just wanted to make sure you know im greetful, thanks.  You guys are what make the aces high community a great thing to be a part of.

Offline SAS_KID

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Gunnery help
« Reply #20 on: April 11, 2006, 11:42:47 PM »
1 tip don't walk ur tracers and try a Jug man 8 50's at 300 out makes a meen wing killing machine :D  But really 50's are one the best machine guns on a plane around in this game. So if you get a good shot take it for you should have a lot of ammo still. But on snapshots make sure you aim for the pilot oe else unless its a very LONG snapshot which i guess would turn into a deflection shot you won't do critical damage unless you hit the pilot or engine shall i say.




I hit a plane from 1k away with the Hurri1's 303's :lol
Quote from: hitech on Today at 09:27:26 AM
What utter and compete BS, quite frankly I should kick you off this bbs for this post.

The real truth is you do not like the answer.

HiTech

Offline pellik

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Gunnery help
« Reply #21 on: April 12, 2006, 03:55:00 PM »
When you hit your shot try to take a mental picture of what it looked like. Be aware of how fast your opponent is going, and recreate that picture when fighting again at those speeds. Convergence can kill you, but without a good library of target profiles in your head your convergence settings probably won't make too big of a difference.

Offline BluKitty

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Gunnery help
« Reply #22 on: April 12, 2006, 04:36:47 PM »
From advantage.
When BnZing don't follow con's to get a lead shot.....

Instead be where they will be and setup a smooth motion to lead shoot with

High speed passes with a 262 helps to train such shots.....

If your going to saddle up..... saddle up, but make your desicion and stick with it  (unless of course your desicion was wrong, then your in a knife fight).
                      -------------------------------------------
From disadvantage.
Try to get them to slide slowly by, you want con to have just a little more E than you.  Your aim is to get thier nose pointed away from you as they fly-by.  Just barely get out of the way, as a pilot comes parallel merge back towards thier plane.  The extra energy the con has should propel her/him right into your gunsights.  Make a smooth motion as you come to this parallel point.  You Want to estimate thier flight path and setup a smooth lead motion for fireing as they fly by.   Getting a smooth arching motion is key to makeing quick snapshots deadly with 50.'s.
                           -----------------------------------
Precise control of rudder and other adjustments are required.  All smooth motions, if you have a spring in you stick or rudder, don't let it spring back to null, always place it back in the null postion.

Hope some of this helps.

Offline SAS_KID

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Gunnery help
« Reply #23 on: April 12, 2006, 06:47:17 PM »
listen to her man she pwns us newbs a lot :D
tried to fight her in KOTH i died never came back since I got whooped so bad.
Quote from: hitech on Today at 09:27:26 AM
What utter and compete BS, quite frankly I should kick you off this bbs for this post.

The real truth is you do not like the answer.

HiTech

Offline Schatzi

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Gunnery help
« Reply #24 on: April 13, 2006, 03:35:30 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by bkbandit
Well i guess i learned ill ima learn. Now its time to just basically put the time in.  Alot of improvements and it feels good, just come up on a zero or spit and make him pay with a .50 calibre shower.  You guys helped me out alot and i just wanted to make sure you know im greetful, thanks.  You guys are what make the aces high community a great thing to be a part of.



Youre very welcome bandit. Im glad youre making progress and enjoying the game so much!


See you up in the skies! >S<
21 is only half the truth.

Offline TexMurphy

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Gunnery help
« Reply #25 on: April 13, 2006, 05:26:49 AM »
NEVER shoot from more then 400 out, never ever.

DOUBLE your lead in lead turn shots. All new pilots think that they have to see the enemy plane in a lead turn shot... this is a horrible misstake. In most planes a lead turn shot at 200-300d means that your enemy is UNDER YOUR NOSE and not in your view. From what you think is the correct lead x2 lead is much more correct then your initial tought.

So dont shoot shots from 400 out and double your lead.

Tex

Offline Simaril

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Gunnery help
« Reply #26 on: April 13, 2006, 08:41:07 AM »
Not sure if this came up in previous posts, but I noticed you mentioned trouble up close:


Dont forget that convergence is now both HORIZONTAL (the spread you're already thinking about) and VERTICAL. In other words, the bullets leave your plane angled slightly UPWARD to allow for the gravity drop that will happen between firing and reaching your convergence distance. The farther that distance is, the higher the bullets are when they leave the gun.

So, for example, if you have convergence at 275 because thats where you shoot most of the time, but THIS time you've dropped in from alt and are firsing at 150 as they break....put your dot a bit BELOW where you normally would .

I've found this has a big impact on my up close gunnery.
« Last Edit: April 13, 2006, 09:01:36 AM by Simaril »
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Offline Goomba

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Gunnery help
« Reply #27 on: April 13, 2006, 11:49:19 AM »
Just another little detail, which I think has been alluded to, but I'll put it out there again anyway, JIC;

Remember to 'unload' the airframe when shooting.  I mean, try to relase any backpressure (which increases G-load) when you pull the trigger.  If your plane is under a turn load, the impact on the bullet ballistics is significant, and can make a seemingly perfect shot miss completely.

Luck!

Offline Schatzi

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Gunnery help
« Reply #28 on: June 22, 2006, 04:32:44 PM »
Bumped for Grudge.... hope it helps you :)
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Offline Jazz1

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Thanks to all of you who posted this thread...
« Reply #29 on: June 28, 2006, 05:59:28 PM »
...it's been very helpful. I've used up way too much ammo in the past and now it's time to be smarter with convergence and other helpful tips you all have posted here.

Much Aloha...