Author Topic: Slip Sliding Away...  (Read 600 times)

Offline Gunslinger

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Slip Sliding Away...
« Reply #15 on: May 30, 2006, 09:00:12 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Hangtime
USA Today:

An informed source in the military today confirmed that US Air Force aircraft with ejection seat systems that were known to be installed incorrectly were sent to Iraq...


That's a biased source!;)

Offline AlGorithm

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« Reply #16 on: May 30, 2006, 09:20:11 PM »
From the "Would you like some fried nuts with that?" Department...
http://radio.indymedia.org/news/2006/05/9797.php
When Tennessee law enforcement officials showed up at the home of Lester Siler, who they suspected of drug use, they asked Lester's wife and son to leave. They didn't know that Lester's wife had turned on a tape recorder in the kitchen. When Lester exercised his constitutional right not to sign a consent to search his house, these officers spent the next two hours torturing him. They beat him with bats and guns, held loaded guns to his head, threatened to shoot him, dunked his head in the toilet, burned him with lighters, attached his testicles to a battery charger, threatened to cut off his fingers, and threatened to "go get" his wife and take his child away from him. Then they arrested him for "evading arrest". It wasn't until the wife's recording made it to the FBI that all hell broke loose. And go figure, even though these officers have been convicted in federal court, not one national media outlet gave this story the coverage it deserved.
http://wms.scripps.com/knoxville/siler/siler.mp3

Offline Hangtime

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« Reply #17 on: May 30, 2006, 09:21:54 PM »
HOLY ****!

wheres that ammo can...
The price of Freedom is the willingness to do sudden battle, anywhere, any time and with utter recklessness...

...at home, or abroad.

Offline rpm

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« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2006, 09:24:49 PM »
Skuzzy nailed it.
My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives.
Stay thirsty my friends.

Offline Debonair

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Slip Sliding Away...
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2006, 09:35:17 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by AlGorithm
From the "Would you like some fried nuts with that?" Department...


lol

Offline Nash

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Re: Slip Sliding Away...
« Reply #20 on: May 30, 2006, 10:14:46 PM »
Okay...

Salient quote:

Quote
"Los Angeles County Deputy District Attorney Richard Ceballos had sued his employer for retaliating against him for exercising his free-speech rights when he reported suspected wrongdoing in a memo to senior officials in his department.


So in an official capacity (on the job), he has no First Amendment rights (protections) for following the internal government procedures for airing grievances.

It's kind of ironic....

... because if this man had spoken out publicly as a citizen - a letter to the editor of a paper, talking to a reporter, for example - he would be doing so as a private citizen and his First Amendment rights would be protected. Thus, it makes it an incentive to go public instead of having a sit-down with the boss or going through internal procedures designed to handle the airing of such grievances.

It's a terrible ruling, to be sure, but I think the scope is rather small and that, in and of itself, it isn't all that alarming (certainly not surprising).

What it is, though, is just another small example of the incrementalism that chips away at the liberties of a great democracy and the Constitution that has made it so.

The government spies on its own citizens, the NSA won't grant clearances for the DOJ to look into it, the FCC won't look into whether the telcos turned over data illegally, the SEC waives the rules of accounting and reporting for companies that may be involved - there is simply no oversite to be found anywhere - the government is going after anyone who might have leaked this, and now the courts (5-4) make even internal whistle blowing a risky business.

All against the backdrop of one of, if not the most secretive administrations in history, and the Congress getting all up in arms about an investigation into one of their own, despite a solid warrant and months of investigation.

The message? "You can bet we're going to go to great lengths and make every allowance to look into your private lives, but if you're government? Zip it."

To sum up, this is going to have a chilling effect on government employees who spot something amiss. And I think that when it comes to this administration's actions, "chilling" is more apropos than the more common "frog in boiling water" analogy.

Because, hell... if you were in hot water, I think you'd notice. Instead, a lot of y'all just seem to be numb at this point.

Offline AWMac

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« Reply #21 on: May 30, 2006, 10:20:46 PM »
I feel REALLY ripped off...

Thought this thread was gonna be about Paul Simons song and the thread was going to be about growing old and wishing that we had more time with our children instead of the everyday crude we travel through in life...

  "A good day has no pain, a bad day is when I lie in bed and think of things that might have been..."


mac

Offline Toad

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Re: Re: Slip Sliding Away...
« Reply #22 on: May 30, 2006, 10:23:05 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Nash

... because if this man had spoken out publicly as a citizen - a letter to the editor of a paper, talking to a reporter, for example - he would be doing so as a private citizen and his First Amendment rights would be protected. Thus, it makes it an incentive to go public instead of having a sit-down with the boss or going through internal procedures designed to handle the airing of such grievances...


...To sum up, this is going to have a chilling effect on government employees who spot something amiss. And I think that when it comes to this administration's actions, "chilling" is more apropos than the more common "frog in boiling water" analogy.

 


Maybe it will have the effect on government employees who spot something amiss and make them just go public with the info.

The "bosses" may rue the day this went in their favor. The public may actually end up knowing much, much more about what goes on.

;)
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Toad

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« Reply #23 on: May 30, 2006, 10:24:50 PM »
BTW, this case was a 4-4 tie when it was first heard and didn't reach a resolution before O'Connor left.

Alito made it 5-4 on the rebound hearing.
If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!

Offline Nash

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Re: Re: Re: Slip Sliding Away...
« Reply #24 on: May 30, 2006, 10:40:09 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Toad
Maybe it will have the effect on government employees who spot something amiss and make them just go public with the info.

The "bosses" may rue the day this went in their favor. The public may actually end up knowing much, much more about what goes on.

;)


Ayup. :)

And yeah.... I'm, totally aware of who made what ruling.... and I bet that you're totally aware of how thrilled I must have been when Alito got the nod. :)

Offline Jackal1

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« Reply #25 on: May 31, 2006, 07:22:37 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Hangtime
When hunting gorillias, I'll keep it in mind.  


:rofl  Coffee/monitor/paper towels/windex  moment.
Democracy is two wolves deciding on what to eat. Freedom is a well armed sheep protesting the vote.
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Offline Swoop

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« Reply #26 on: May 31, 2006, 07:27:21 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Hangtime
When hunting gorillias, I'll keep it in mind.  



LOL LOL LOL


Owned.  Someone has no idea what polishing brass means.


Offline Brenjen

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« Reply #27 on: May 31, 2006, 08:11:18 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by john9001
you do not "polish your brass" when preparing for gorilla warfare, you darken your brass so it will not reflect light when you attack at night.

you people know nothing about gorilla warfare.



 I do, if you have any pooh....fling it now.

Offline Gunslinger

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« Reply #28 on: May 31, 2006, 09:07:49 AM »
Quote
"When public employees make statements pursuant to their official duties, the employees are not speaking as citizens for First Amendment purposes," Kennedy wrote. "The Constitution does not insulate their communications from employer discipline."


Isn't Kennedy one of the more liberal judges on the SC?

Quote
official internal memo,

Quote
what he believed were misrepresentations in a search warrant prepared by a sheriff's deputy

Quote
Defense lawyers used the memo to challenge the warrant's validity.

Sounds like Cause and Effect to me......I would say that's free speech at work and not the suppression of.  You are free to say what ever you want to in this country but don't think that for one second that what you say may have consequences.