Hezbollah was using UN post as 'shield'

[Sparks]

Ooops - you added to your post.

For sure the UN is a waste of time which is why I suggested it should be a NATO job - like Bosnia.  the "training camp" statement was more of an descriptive tool - I was  trying to say that we should have the opportunity to feild as many people as we can and for as long as necessary to do the job.  

As far as Lebanon being a threat to Europe - none - but we are not fighting Lebanon (there is that automatic association again). Lebanon has been actively trying to attract European tourists prior to the Israeli attacks. As far as Hezbollah being a threat to Europe - most certainly. Unlike the US many European countries have sizeable Muslim populations - ripe recruiting grounds for dis-affected Muslim youth.  And the Middle East is in out back yard.  I think NATO most definitely has a role - this is a war right ?

[Sparks]

I was done but you keep posting .... again.  

Like any terrorist organisation embedded in a civilian population I think this will be won by covert ops and special forces.... and lots of time.

IMHO ordinary people align themselves to these nutjobs when they feel the nutjobs provide their best hope. When they have even minority support within the poplation they are able to hide and operate.  So we have to convince these ordinary people that all they can expect by being alligned with and supporting these people is violence and death and that peace and security come from allignment with us. It becomes an accelerating process - more terrorists are informed on to remove them from communities and safe houses reduce - people see the benefits and so on.

But we have to have in place the tools to gather the information - act on it with full force and provide the ordinary person the security we say is the reward. That means large forces on the ground in the towns and villages.
This is what we are doing in Afghanistan - ramping up our forces in the provinces - and I applaud it and give my utmost respect and gratitude to the men and women out there.

 Saying we offer peace and security by removing Hezbollah and then shelling their house is hardly a convincing arguement.

[Maverick]

I seem to recall there was some discussion about "special ops" and the Isreali's. If I recall they got a lot of flack for going after and removing terrorists. I would think that given time, something the hezbollah is not allowing by their rocket attacks, the Isreali's could do a number on their heirarchy and have been doing it on Hamas in the past. Then there's this bit about armed conflict across national borders not in a time of war problem. It somewhat limits operations when your operations are condemned internationally for doing it in just the manner you suggest and that trhey have in fact done in the past.

It's a bit of a dillema but for now since hamas and hezbollah decided to kick off hostilities against the Isreali's by crossing the border and using armed warfare tactics, it's a rather moot point. They lit the match and seem to be getting rather burned about it.

IIRC there was no war per se, before hamas and hezbollah started shooting at and into Isreal.

[Suave]

Hezbollah was using UN post as 'shield'

At least somebody found some use for them.

[wulfie]

Originally posted by deSelys
Oh, and nice job about the 'risk my life to protect people' thing... Like beating up the countryside in a F15 and wearing cool sunglasses was a chore, get a grip.
I'd accept it from you if you were a grunt in Afghanistan like a former squadmate of mine... a canuck, mind you. He's already been shot at a lot and he has lost more than a couple of buddies. He's seen the real deal, I don't think that you have...yet (I'm not saying that you've avoided dangerous assignments, don't put those words into my mouth).

Sorry about the delayed response here, 'ressurecting an old thread' and so on. It was just brought to my attention.

Do me a favor deSelys. Tell your accqaintance that spent time on the ground in Afghanistan that you just slagged a Strike Eagle driver.

Not to rain on your moral indignation based on someone else's sacrifices, but I've been on the ground in Afghanistan as well and anyone that flies something that carries bombs gets free beers from me for life.

And as for your cool sunglasses comment, unless you've flown in the military I'd shut your trap before you look more like a fool. Or maybe we could ask Eagl if he's ever lost any buddies...even tho he never walked around on the ground in Afghanistan.

You're an idiot.

Love,

wulfie

p.s. Hey everyone who I know. Sorry I haven't called. I've been busy as all hades. Rest assured when I get a desktop comp. and time to play AH again I'll be right there, in the thick of it, getting flamed by lazs in his damn F4U.

[wulfie]

Originally posted by deSelys
Oh, and nice job about the 'risk my life to protect people' thing...

I'll add one more comment here. After all, Eagl may be busy 'taking it easy' up in the skies.

My first job in the military was Rescue Swimmer. During peacetime, I saw plenty of Pilot and Aircrew bodies, all while there was not a single good guy walking the ground in Afghanistan or Iraq. It happens somewhere, probably every couple of months.

You may not be aware of this, because most media outlets don't consider it front-page news. If a couple of guys die in a training accident, the local paper and tv news show (local to where the guys are based) will run the story of course.

Military aviation is a dangerous job. And there are no 'limb injuries' (from a grenade fragment or a skipping AK round) when something goes wrong with an aircraft. If it goes bad, it goes bad 'all the way'. And ejection seats and parachutes are no automatic 'you are safe' button. One of the most heinously injured Pilots I have ever heard of bought it attempting to eject safely. Come to think if it, if memory serves, he was flying an F-15 at the time. I bet he was really grateful he wasn't in real danger...right up until everthing went wrong.

Military Pilots and Aircrew risk life and limb every time they take off.

[~Caligula~]

say again - Israel's cause is just and the goal shared by all - the execution is wrong.  We should be turning Southern Lebanon into the NATO special forces training area.   I would vote today for tax increases to raise our special forces numbers to whatever we needed to fight and win this war in all the theatres but conventional warfare is NOT the answer.