I don't want to play in a 60 player arena

[Simaril]

People, you're missing the point.

Server capacity has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the changes.

The changes are all about community. It simply isnt possible to get the same cameraderie with a rotating population of over 5000 taking turns in a 750 man arena. That meant that (judging from the excellent statistical analysis post HERE ) AH simply stopped growing....the guys quitting matched the guys joining for a couple years. HTC was spending money to advertise just in order to avoid shrinking.


I'm betting THAT'S what HT was talking about with the "sick" MA comment.


With smaller arenas, I'm finding that I've been seeing more of the same faces. That means I have a chance to GET TO KNOW THEM. All of them, not just the ones in my squad. I'm having CONVERSATIONS with opponents, chatting about fights instead of seeing dysfunctional types filling 200 with flames. I'm spontaneously trying a sneak when I hear we have a flak in a town behind enemy lines, where before the larger numbers about guaranteed that would be useless because SOMEBODY on the enemy side would kill the guy off.



Soooo.....dont hold your breath waiting for higher caps. The arenas work differently when smaller, but that absolutely does NOT mean that "strategy is useless." Remember that Mindinao with 250 online WAS what happened in the old MA, every day, during non-peak times. Use your strategic interests to come up with new ways of fighting or base taking, with fewer people and more skill.


And if you cannot adapt to the new situations, then this may not be the game for you.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by KaK3
Filth, choose not to pay for a game that keeps getting major tweeks when it isnt even broke. this is my last month, and I'm not sad one bit  because I know what the product is and I dont like it. If I was to have quit the game before this new setup, I would've been major bumbed.

Can I have your stuff?


ack-ack

[KTM520guy]

I used to log on every day before the changes. Not once did I ever see any shrinkage. The average number of people I saw on just kept getting bigger and bigger. The main problem was the small maps. They were at there best with 300-400 people. Any more than was to high of a population density. The bigger maps could absorb more people before feelling crowded.

[Ghosth]

Simaril has nailed it IMO.

With the smaller numbers in Early & mid war I'm seeing a return to the days of old. Less jaw jacking & whining, more 's & conversations about good fights.

Reminds me of the old days of the AH main when 125 was a big night with lots of people on. You pretty much either knew or had some idea of all those who flew regularly. The community policed itself much easier. Whats possible with 100 is impossible with 500.

And I'll even give credit to Laz & the BK's for helping to set the new standard.
WTG Guys!

Remind guys that interupting a 1 on 1 fight is a no no.
That the fight is more important than the land grab.
Don't beat em to death with it, just let them know the way the wind blows, then
give them a chance to adjust to it.

[SkyRock]

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Quit your whining and come to early-war to play the real furball game.

This game is finally showing its potential.

I upped in the early war arena a few nights ago and this was the result for the 3 sorties:

1.  in a 109f  got HO'd at at least 6 times by 2 110's, 2 hurri2c's and a spit!  Eventually ended in me fighting 1 vs 4 and running out of fuel.  (HO'd at means they were trying really hard but failed)
2.  in a spitV huge furball got bnz'd by at least 4 hovering cons all to run as they missed on their passes and 2 of them made at least 3 passes a piece.  finally 1/2 sector away from furball in a fight with a (pass and extend faster plane) until 2 cons showed up to help him.  ended in a 1vs 3 hurri2c blazing away got me vert stabs.
3.  in a spitV  HO/vulched by a f4f on take-off got one aileron and one elevator  but flew the sortie anyway.  Got out over the water and got bnz'd by a p-40 then HO'd again by 2 hurri2c's and the second one towered me!  

I see that the change has brought out the desire in many to learn how to fight........................ ....NOT!  
So when you say "play the real furball game" it just means come learn to dodge HO's and avoid vulches, and avoid getting cherried n an early model plane!  

[baine1]

Originally posted by MrRiplEy[H]
Thats the beauty of early war arena, no base porking hordes run amuck there.

It's just AH at it's purest form, furballing with dexterous planes. And no LA7 dweeb sneaking and running.

I guess different people have different ideas of what "AH in its purest form" is. I liked AH for the variety of experiences it once offered.

I like furballing, but it gets old. I prefer furballing with a purpose, such as capturing bases.
Furballing leaves nothing for buff pilots. I like flying buffs.
Furballing leaves nothing for GV drivers, (except maybe occasionally slugging it out in slow-loading T-34s.) I love GV action.

In short, unless I arrive early enough to get into the exclusive club that is now the late war, I really can't do the things that I enjoy doing. Reading the numerous posts, I guess there are a lot of people who feel the same as I do.

[gatt]

And you really think that this so called new politeness, 's and knowing some more players in the three arenas ... really will bring new customers?

Were the 400 players during EURO (peak) time and 700 during USA-Pacific (average) so stagnant to make this revolution the way to develop the player base?

IMHO, you can bring new customers:

- with a costant flow of new a/c and variants,
- with regular well managed scenarios at USA and EURO times,
- with (perhaps) a well designed RPS,
- with dedicated arenas like the DA and AvA togheter ....
- with a Main were you can find big numbers and every type of fight you want,
- with new micro tactics-strategic elements in the arenas,
- with what else?

We are a little mid war aircraft squad, we fly mainly C.205, 109 and 190. We are almost all discussing about cancelling our accounts becouse we have no fun entering these new arenas with low numbers and finding these ENY things. With the old MA and all her problems I've never thought about cancelling my account, nor inviting others to do it. Never. I've been supporting this team for 6-7 years no matter how slow was the development in some years and even if the TOD was-is 3 years late.

[999000]

Obviously, the idea behind the early war was to create a fighter town arena.
That is good for those who enjoy and appreciate it. My hat is off to them.
For the rest of us with the eny factor and cap ....the game is losing my interest.
999000

[SlapShot]

And you really think that this so called new politeness, 's and knowing some more players in the three arenas ... really will bring new customers?

That won't necessarily bring them ... marketing and word of mouth does that ... but it sure won't drive them away ... and that is what I beleive HT and Co. is trying to do.

HT said that they look at statistics such as ...

number of downloads of the game
|
V
numbers of 2 week trials
|
V
numbers of 2 week trials that sign up
|
V
number of 2 weel trials that DON'T sign up (very important number)
|
V
numbers of subscribers that un-subscribe (very important number)

So they must look at the reason as to why 2-weekers don't sign up and why are current subscribers leaving. I believe that the changes that were made were made because the "very important numbers" weren't showing any growth, but rather decline.

Were the 400 players during EURO (peak) time and 700 during USA-Pacific (average) so stagnant to make this revolution the way to develop the player base?

I think the obvious answer is YES ... else they would not have made the change.

We are a little mid war aircraft squad, we fly mainly C.205, 109 and 190. We are almost all discussing about cancelling our accounts becouse we have no fun entering these new arenas with low numbers and finding these ENY things. With the old MA and all her problems I've never thought about cancelling my account, nor inviting others to do it. Never. I've been supporting this team for 6-7 years no matter how slow was the development in some years and even if the TOD was-is 3 years late.

If that what you and yours want to do ... then so be it ... I doubt that all those who are threatening to quit will make HT change his mind. He is betting that this change will increase his customer base, and don't think for one second that they haven't considered the fallout and people cancelling their accounts because they are unhappy with the change.

I believe that we will see further changes/tweaks in the near future, for the better, but only once the dust/ripples settle down a little bit.

[Simaril]

Originally posted by gatt
And you really think that this so called new politeness, 's and knowing some more players in the three arenas ... really will bring new customers?

Were the 400 players during EURO (peak) time and 700 during USA-Pacific (average) so stagnant to make this revolution the way to develop the player base?

IMHO, you can bring new customers:

- with a costant flow of new a/c and variants,
- with regular well managed scenarios at USA and EURO times,
- with (perhaps) a well designed RPS,
- with dedicated arenas like the DA and AvA togheter ....
- with a Main were you can find big numbers and every type of fight you want,
- with new micro tactics-strategic elements in the arenas,
- with what else?

We are a little mid war aircraft squad, we fly mainly C.205, 109 and 190. We are almost all discussing about cancelling our accounts becouse we have no fun entering these new arenas with low numbers and finding these ENY things. With the old MA and all her problems I've never thought about cancelling my account, nor inviting others to do it. Never. I've been supporting this team for 6-7 years no matter how slow was the development in some years and even if the TOD was-is 3 years late.

Gatt, you're right that the non-US time players have been hurt with this. HT is aware, and wants to do what he can to help. There's been at least one thread on the topic with active HTC participation.

At the same time, look at that stats thread I linked above. That's not impressions, thats hard numbers showing that total kills have been flat for several years. That means that if there's been growth in the places you're looking, there's been a balancing loss in other places. In business, just like in life, if you dont see some kind of growth there's something wrong. And HT's trying to fix what he can.


Admit that this DOES have potential, even if its a pain right now. Look at the arenas, and imagine that growth DOES start again. How about 200 in EW, 200 in MW, and 3 LW arenas...think about more maps, since they're smaller and easier to make....think about some maps particularly tuned to the MW planeset, or to the EW GV's....think about the potential for developing planes that wouldnt leave the hangar in the MA, like the P-39 (with a gas tank that makes the LA look like a long hauler), or like the early French models or the B 339 Brewster.

Give it a chance. It CAN be great.

[E25280]

Originally posted by Simaril
....think about the potential for developing planes that wouldnt leave the hangar in the MA, like the P-39 (with a gas tank that makes the LA look like a long hauler), or like the early French models or the B 339 Brewster.

Give it a chance. It CAN be great.

This is where HTC messed up IMHO.  The changes would have been easier for everyone to accept/digest if it had been introduced as "AH3" with additional planes/GVs to fill in the quite glaring set gaps at the same time.  It then would have been perceived as a true expansion of the game.  

The "promise" or "potential" of new planes/GVs rings fairly hollow considering everyone knows CT is on the way, and knows of its considerable delays in implementation.  So if we get the new rides, it will not be for a long while.  In the meantime, a substantial portion of the community feel limited rather than liberated.

[gatt]

Simaril,

I respect your opinions. However, as the above post underline, AH2 was not ready for such a change. Not enuff aircraft and tanks to fill at least two of the three arenas, no answer to many changes requested by players for years (diving level bombers, weird ack-ack, weird bomber gunners firing under high g's .... etc.etc.).

This "stagnant player base" thing is not convincing me at all. I smell something else: perhaps a lack of resources to develop new aircraft/variants and tactic/strategic issues to solve the old MA issues.

I dont say the old MA had not problems, just the opposite. But they could be solved maybe with a good RPS (if we had the right a/c), maybe with more well managed scenarios, maybe with the TOD, maybe introducing something against kamikaze toolshedders. What about a  "localized" RPS: Battle of France, then Battle of Britain, then North Africa, then Pacific .... think about the marketing power of such solutions ... THERE you could introduce restrictions, caps and ENY, as in good scenarios. Yes, we'd need real maps (not pizzas) and aircraft, and manpower ... those are perhaps the real problems.

[Kev367th]

Originally posted by SlapShot
And you really think that this so called new politeness, 's and knowing some more players in the three arenas ... really will bring new customers?

That won't necessarily bring them ... marketing and word of mouth does that ... but it sure won't drive them away ... and that is what I beleive HT and Co. is trying to do.

HT said that they look at statistics such as ...

number of downloads of the game
|
V
numbers of 2 week trials
|
V
numbers of 2 week trials that sign up
|
V
number of 2 weel trials that DON'T sign up (very important number)
|
V
numbers of subscribers that un-subscribe (very important number)

So they must look at the reason as to why 2-weekers don't sign up and why are current subscribers leaving. I believe that the changes that were made were made because the "very important numbers" weren't showing any growth, but rather decline.

Were the 400 players during EURO (peak) time and 700 during USA-Pacific (average) so stagnant to make this revolution the way to develop the player base?

I think the obvious answer is YES ... else they would not have made the change.

We are a little mid war aircraft squad, we fly mainly C.205, 109 and 190. We are almost all discussing about cancelling our accounts becouse we have no fun entering these new arenas with low numbers and finding these ENY things. With the old MA and all her problems I've never thought about cancelling my account, nor inviting others to do it. Never. I've been supporting this team for 6-7 years no matter how slow was the development in some years and even if the TOD was-is 3 years late.

If that what you and yours want to do ... then so be it ... I doubt that all those who are threatening to quit will make HT change his mind. He is betting that this change will increase his customer base, and don't think for one second that they haven't considered the fallout and people cancelling their accounts because they are unhappy with the change.

I believe that we will see further changes/tweaks in the near future, for the better, but only once the dust/ripples settle down a little bit.

Obviously only HT knows how many long timers have cancelled their accounts, but I know of more than 'a few'.
On another thread Kak has announced he is leaving, that's a 6 year vet gone.

I'm sure your right, 'he's betting', big chance to take considering the amount of people who are just downright very unhappy.
Wonder how many 3,4,5,6 year paying guys he is willing to lose?
On the chance of a 2 week newb joining up.

He has also said numbers have risen since the changes, sorry don't see it.
Sat night used to average 600-700 players in the MA, last night across all arenas was around 450-475.
A squaddie who still has a WB account conversely says the their arenas HAVE grown in numbers since this.

Time will tell I guess, lose enough long timers, not only does it affect the game overall, wonder what it would do to C.T. release date?

I'm personally gonna hang on for the time being, but am also downloading targetware as I have been asked to do some skins for it.

[Toad]

Longtimer?

I was here when Beta opened. This has given me a reason to stay. I'd about had it with the old MA.

[hitech]

I dont say the old MA had not problems, just the opposite. But they could be solved maybe with a good RPS (if we had the right a/c),

Nope: Been there done that.
The cost of aircraft devlopement is non trivial.
And it still dosn't address the basic issue.

 maybe with more well managed scenarios,

Wouldn't effect the MA at all

 maybe with the TOD,

Wouldn't effect the MA at all

maybe introducing something against kamikaze toolshedders.

Fixing symptom not the problem.

What about a "localized" RPS: Battle of France, then Battle of Britain, then North Africa, then Pacific .... think about the marketing power of such solutions ... THERE you could introduce restrictions, caps and ENY, as in good scenarios.

If you have unlimited funds to produce those things please give them to me and ill implement them. Plus some of what you describe is what Combat Tour is aimed at, but once again it realy has nothing to do with the MA.

Yes, we'd need real maps (not pizzas) and aircraft, and manpower ... those are perhaps the real problems.

Adds to game play, realy dosn't effect community issues.
And once again, manpower is a fact, not a problem.


HiTech