Author Topic: Red Orchestra free trail coming 12/07/06 (Read 1111 times)

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #30 on:** December 04, 2006, 02:02:53 PM »

So basically the advantage to installing Steam is that you can download games to your computer rather than going to the store and buying them, and open up your computer to allow it to download updates and such from a company with a questionable history in the area of security.

I'll go to the store and buy the box if I want the game. I didnt see anything on their website that isnt available in retail stores.

I'm making no argument about the current state of their security, but from the reading I've been doing there is a LARGE population of folks who are wary of Steam. Even given the standard sheep reactionaries, enough to make me leery of it too. Those of you supporting it have an argument for it equats to "Games r teh fun". Not worth the risk to me.

Bruno · « **Reply #31 on:** December 04, 2006, 04:48:46 PM »

How many people do you think use Steam?

There's 200,000 players online playing a Steam game right now.

There will always be unhappy folks no what program is in question. If I had spent time reading the AH forums I never would have downloaded AH.

It is not just about just 'downloading' verses going to the store and buying the box. You can't play any 'Steam' game but through Steam. RO in the box has Steam on the disk. Boxed games come with various invasive protection schemes like Starforce and SecuROM etc... You are no safer with a boxed game then with those over Steam.

With Steam as long as you remember your login and password you can download the games as many times as you want on as many PCs as you want. However, 2 players can't be online using the same account.

Steam can be configured to 'keep this game updated' or not. It has a decent game browser (ASE was much better but Yahoo destroyed it) etc...

Vulcan · « **Reply #32 on:** December 04, 2006, 06:42:08 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Bruno
Skuzzy most gamers I know have dedicated gaming machines, run reasonably secure networks etc... They already take measures to minimize risk like Viking. However, risk is always there.

Most gamers I know run awful networks, highly unsecured. Many of them really on freeware tools for security that are sub-par

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #33 on:** December 04, 2006, 07:32:21 PM »

Bruno, thank you for the information.

Swarmed · « **Reply #34 on:** December 04, 2006, 10:05:21 PM »

I've been running Steam since it came out. I remember when it first started, I hated the thing. Ate up resources, and put a noticible drain on my computer resources anytime it was on. Even hampered game performance when it decided to download an update WHILE I was playing a game. That was several years ago.

I don't even notice Steam when it's running now, but I do make it a habit to turn it off when I'm not using it. It's a pretty neat little tool that's full of info, and games at the touch of a download button.

I haven't had any kinds of complaints about it in years since a lot of bugs were worked out of it.

Thumbs up for Steam in my book. Unless you have a straight up business computer with sensitive files, I don't really know what the problem is downloading content from the internet. If you're not DLing porn, surfing porn, or visiting strange outlandish websites, you're pretty much staying in the clear. If you have information that is that near and dear to your heart or business life, I wouldn't be using it as a game computer.

I would imaging Skuzzy has a lot of AH software and programming on his computer that he would not like to get hacked or destroyed. If my living was on a computer, it would be as far away from a video game as I could get it.

If you're a gamer, check Steam out. If you don't like it, uninstall the thing.

S!

Swarmed · « **Reply #35 on:** December 04, 2006, 10:06:13 PM »

Oh yeah, RO is a nice looking game. Haven't checked it out yet, anyone have details about gameplay?

moot · « **Reply #36 on:** December 05, 2006, 01:06:11 AM »

StarofAFrica, another good feature of Steam is that, if I remember right, it has embedded anti cheat systems for at least some of the games it channels.
HLVC is what it's called, (again IIRC), so if it were a factor in your decision to use Steam or not, you could check if the game that interests you is protected by it or not.
Don't quote me on this, but I think their anti piracy systems are quite good, if not one of the most effective in the industry.

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #37 on:** December 05, 2006, 12:00:45 PM »

I dont think its right of me to knock something I havent tried and explored fully myself. So I set up an older machine and installed the software. I did alot of "fine print" reading in the EULA, and while I firmly believe everything they have done here was done with the best of intentions, and to make things easier on both the gamers and Valve, it really scares me.

Valve's stated intentions for the Steam delivery system are not aimed at copyright protection, but at making the "platform more useful for developers and customers". This doesnt seem to be borne out by some of the other things I'm reading, but I'm trying to keep an open mind. I've had alot of bad experiences with other companies and their "anti-piracy" systems, so I'm naturally inclined to look at such things with skepticism. Still, trying to stay objective here..............

A few things really bother me. Like the fact that you cant buy and play a game offline without verifying the content ONLINE first and having it checked for updates. EVERY TIME you start the game. This would really stink if I were on dialup (and those are the people I'd think would be most likely to want to play offline). What happens if Steam gets cancelled? You stuck with a game you cant even play offline then. The thing that bothers me the most though is their ability to not only monitor and collect data from my computer's hard drive (supported by the EULA), but the fact that they have FULL ACCESS to my computer, and can even go so far as to manipulate data. This is intended mainly for tech support purposes, so they can see how the data is being stored and used on different systems, and so they can connect remotely to your computer and fix problems for you rather than trying to talk through them on the phone. Great idea. Only what happens if the tech screws something up? Or halfway through a fix, your network craps out and he moved something important? Or (heaven forbid) someone hacks their network and gets access to their system, and then can jump right into anyone's computer that is logged in and do whatever he likes.

RO did look nice. Steam worked fine on my computer (and this was my older one), overall everything went smooth and I was happy with it. If I didnt know my way around computers, this would be a great way to game. Its rather like AOL in that regard. Gaming with training wheels. I'm sorry though, the potential bad points far outweigh the good ones. I cant see having a separate computer JUST for playing RO. Nothing else they had interested me that much.

Hawco · « **Reply #38 on:** December 05, 2006, 12:15:46 PM »

I have steam on my desktop here in the office and also have it on my network back home.
I have no issues whatsover with it, not one single issue, zip, nothing.
It has never once affected anything I'm doing here or back home.

StarOfAfrica2 · « **Reply #39 on:** December 05, 2006, 02:05:35 PM »

I dont think anyone in the thread said it causes any problems with the operation of your computer, or that it doesnt work. Most of the complaints are about the POTENTIAL for problems, with a few references to previous problems thrown in. Every online game has technical issues crop up. Nauture of the beast. In actual fact, as noted in my previous post, the software performed flawlessly when I installed it last night. However, I just think that (for ME), the potential built into their system for abuse is too great to be outweighed by the content offered. Thats my personal opinion. I'm not asking anyone who uses it to stop. I also thought that the two points I made are ones that should be considered by anyone using it or thinking of it, but again I am not saying you should not or should stop. If whatever risk is there is worth it to you for what you get, then go for it.

At the beginning of this thread I knew absolutely ZERO about Valve, their products, or the problems or benefits of using Steam as a delivery vehicle. My experience with their product totals about 6 hours. That includes download and installing, so say 4.5 hours total of experience on the system. I'm certainly no expert on their stuff. I just took the time to read the EULA and what other people had to say about it.

BTW, thanks SunKing for bringing this up. RO is something I wanted to try. Because you made me aware of the free trial, I took advantage of it. Even if I decided it wasnt for me, for whatever reason, I still wanted to try it, and appreciate you letting us know about it.

Catalyst · « **Reply #40 on:** December 05, 2006, 02:53:56 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Hawco
I have steam on my desktop here in the office and also have it on my network back home.
I have no issues whatsover with it, not one single issue, zip, nothing.
It has never once affected anything

and you wouldn't see it if 'they' or 'he' decided to attack your network...

this is what StarOfAfrica is trying to say...

by letting them have access to your computer and its DATA they don't need to do anything but retrieve said data and study it at there leisure...

having a 3rd party for Downloading or Distribution purposes is fine, but letting them have CONTROL is NOT!!!

me, myself and I are the only one's to control my puter, even that gets to be difficult....lots of arguments

Hawco · « **Reply #41 on:** December 05, 2006, 03:26:22 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Catalyst
and you wouldn't see it if 'they' or 'he' decided to attack your network...

this is what StarOfAfrica is trying to say...

by letting them have access to your computer and its DATA they don't need to do anything but retrieve said data and study it at there leisure...

having a 3rd party for Downloading or Distribution purposes is fine, but letting them have CONTROL is NOT!!!

me, myself and I are the only one's to control my puter, even that gets to be difficult....lots of arguments

Hard to do for them from my end, I own a Network company and I have had some of my engineers in here check it out top to bottom and the report I got back was fine, if a guy with a masters in software engineering with 15+ years experience in intergrating operating systems and SAP into networks says it's fine then I belive him.

Skuzzy · « **Reply #42 on:** December 05, 2006, 03:55:37 PM »

No offense Hawco, but if you have software on your computer which connects to an external server, you have no control over the data which can leave your computer, or be placed on your computer, unless you have active packet sniffing running on your network looking for specific data patterns which could be recognized as data from your computer.

Just curious, do you ave ActiveX controls enabled on your Internet connection?

For the Steam users, when you run it, is there a LISTENER running on a network port (netstat -an from the command box)?

Vulcan · « **Reply #43 on:** December 05, 2006, 04:48:53 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Hawco
Hard to do for them from my end, I own a Network company and I have had some of my engineers in here check it out top to bottom and the report I got back was fine, if a guy with a masters in software engineering with 15+ years experience in intergrating operating systems and SAP into networks says it's fine then I belive him.

No disrespect, but I work in network security and most software engineers don't have a clue about security. To make it worse most *think* they know about security.

I tried to see what I could find about how steam works, I couldn't find any info on the transport method. But it sounds like it is akin to an SSL-VPN with a level of remote control at the client (enabling installation of patches, detection of cheatware etc). To me that is a massive hole in network security. You're basically opening your network up to an outside resource with no control over what goes in or out.