Author Topic: split s (Read 712 times)

df54 · « **on:** November 26, 2006, 04:27:59 PM »

A typical situation for me. i'M saddled up on a spit(im ina yak9u) the spit will usually do a split-s. How do i counter

Schatzi · « **Reply #1 on:** November 26, 2006, 04:43:02 PM »

Depends on your speed/closure/relative E states and whos driving the Spit.

You have two options:

- going down with him. Follow him in the SplitS, chopping throttle and dropping flaps to help you make the loop as tight as possible. This is only recommended if your closure isnt too fast (that means youre not much faster then he is) and when you are sure youll be able to follow him. The danger in doing this is that you gain too much speed on the way down and due to that and your lower maneuverability your loop would be much wider then his. This can result in a flight path overshoot and get you killed quickly (depending on if the Spit driver knows what hes doing)

- the second option is not to follow him down (duh!) and to go vertical instead. reposition above him, reevaluate the situation and then renew your attack. This is the "not staying in the saddle for an immediate kill but playing it safer" option. Since hes doing a SplitS and you stay above him (immelman/climbing turn - depending on speed) he will loose more Energy compared to you. Also, you keep the positional advantage on top of him.

bozon · « **Reply #2 on:** November 27, 2006, 04:10:56 AM »

When someone is doing a split-S he's basically giving up trying to equalize E or any counter move and goes for an "all out" evasion. This is good for a faster plane since he can get his speed up and run away. A spit would normally have to follow a 190 or the 190 escapes.

If the split-S-ing plane is slower but more manuverable (typically the spit) trying to follow it in a fast heavy wingloaded plane will mean loosing a lot of E to stay with it. When a spit does this it begs to be BnZ repeatedly. Next pass you'll learn to anticipate his move then you can either:

1. With lateral seperation, dive before you reach it and attack with a slight upward attitude and pointing a little below till he starts his split-S. When it does you'll get a nice snapshot as it exposes his largest area and a good chance at a pilot kill. Proceed doing a lazy E conserving zoom. Repeat forever.

2. Suprise the spit and go agressive - Gamble on him being predictable and pull up just when he's about to start his split S. Then chop throttle roll, pull hard and dive after it. Time it right and judge the seperation right and you'll drop right on his 6 giving him a heart attack. The early pull is meant to give you enough seperation and slow you down so you can reverse without droping below it. Remember that you are giving up on much of your E advantage so make it count.

BaldEagl · « **Reply #3 on:** November 27, 2006, 09:43:04 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Schatzi
- going down with him.

You're assuming that it's a diving Split S, not climbing. I fly a Spit a lot and most of the times I use a Split S are it's in a climb.

Schatzi · « **Reply #4 on:** November 27, 2006, 10:01:27 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by BaldEagl
You're assuming that it's a diving Split S, not climbing. I fly a Spit a lot and most of the times I use a Split S are it's in a climb.

A SplitS is always diving. A "climbing SplitS" (half loop upwards) is called Immelman.

68Dougal · « **Reply #5 on:** November 27, 2006, 10:04:39 AM »

A split-s is by definition a diving maneuver. It's a roll to inverted and a half loop. You will always go down in a split s.

I think what you're talking about is an Immelman, which is a climbing half loop and a roll to level at the top. I guess it could be described as the opposite of a split s.

In both maneuvers you end up flipping around 180 degrees.

EDIT: Schatzi beat me

Schatzi · « **Reply #6 on:** November 27, 2006, 10:28:06 AM »

Here are some links:

http://trainers.hitechcreations.com (under Learning to Fly > Basic Maneuvers)

Check this thread for more info about Flat Turn vs SplitS vs Immelman (all three turn you around 180°):
http://www.hitechcreations.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=186602

http://www.musketeers.org/Splitesse.htm
http://www.geistware.com/rcmodeling/aerobatics/maneuvers/index.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_combat_manoeuvering

BaldEagl · « **Reply #7 on:** November 27, 2006, 11:50:14 AM »

Oops. Sorry. You all are correct.

Schatzi · « **Reply #8 on:** November 27, 2006, 02:02:02 PM »

No need to apologize. I hope the links cleared it up.

RumbleB · « **Reply #9 on:** November 27, 2006, 10:25:13 PM »

I would shoot him with every guns in my airoplane so that his airolon will falls off and make his spit s crash into five trees and also a farm on the hill.

whiteman · « **Reply #10 on:** November 28, 2006, 06:44:06 PM »

Thanks guy's, been very helpful here.

vizwhiz · « **Reply #11 on:** December 01, 2006, 02:20:25 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by bozon
When someone is doing a split-S he's basically giving up trying to equalize E or any counter move and goes for an "all out" evasion. This is good for a faster plane since he can get his speed up and run away. A spit would normally have to follow a 190 or the 190 escapes.

If the split-S-ing plane is slower but more manuverable (typically the spit) trying to follow it in a fast heavy wingloaded plane will mean loosing a lot of E to stay with it. When a spit does this it begs to be BnZ repeatedly. Next pass you'll learn to anticipate his move then you can either:

1. With lateral seperation, dive before you reach it and attack with a slight upward attitude and pointing a little below till he starts his split-S. When it does you'll get a nice snapshot as it exposes his largest area and a good chance at a pilot kill. Proceed doing a lazy E conserving zoom. Repeat forever.

2. Suprise the spit and go agressive - Gamble on him being predictable and pull up just when he's about to start his split S. Then chop throttle roll, pull hard and dive after it. Time it right and judge the seperation right and you'll drop right on his 6 giving him a heart attack. The early pull is meant to give you enough seperation and slow you down so you can reverse without droping below it. Remember that you are giving up on much of your E advantage so make it count.

===========
The split-s is one of the few manuv's I can usually perform (when I remember to chop throttle!), and the first pull up to me has become almost second-nature. What I usually do when I see them starting to go is to pull up and do a snap-roll, flying upside down just long enough to not pull down in front of them. That accomplishes both the first pull up to drop a little speed and get inverted, and it allows me to choose when and how fast to pull into the dive. I'd appreciate any feedback on this also, as I still sometimes forget to pull back that silly throttle and end up in the trees.