A day in the life

[Rollins]

Schatzi-
Thanks, you not only answered my first question, but the next one as well...so how do you make those films?  Appreciate the assistance.

Any help on my last post about shipborne guns?
Thx

[Simaril]

And since this has turned into a general tip thread, I have to thank Murdr for something he brought up a while ago with me. I didnt quite get it at the time, and only partly got it after working with him....but it crystallised yesterday when I got to use it. Unfortunately, I didnt film it.


Here's the idea:

Whenever an enemy has to cut a curved path (whether a turn, an upward half loop, a downward half loop, whatever) there will be a safe zone INSIDE the half circle, where the enemy just can't get to you.

This is most often a help when the enemy is above you, either diving in with energy or reaching the top of a zoom climb. (For example, if he's trying to rope you. Just say nope to the rope -- don't follow!)

And that's what happened yesterday. I was in about 4-5K in a SpitXVI (I'm not good enough to kill at will in hard planes, and I was tired of dying last night -- so be quiet! ) An ever so deadly F4u-1C came at us with speed and a 3-5K alt adavantage.

The guys with me went down after some low cons, and I decided to go for the C-Hog. Enemy pilot's advantages were altitude and energy, speed, and excellent low speed control with flaps out. My advantges were simpler -- better acceleration/climb, and turn/roll rate at moderate speed.


I climbed gently up to him, and did a gentle climbing turn to prevent a shot as he dove on me. In essense, I moved into the dead zone of his dive curve. He zoomed up to his higher alt to reset for another attack, and I turned toward him while continuing to climb.

He zoomed as best he could, probably hoping I'd follow and get roped. Instead, I climbed gently so I maintained 200-240mph maneuver speed. That way I had speed enough to react to his moves. He came over the top, or rudder reversed, and tried again....

...and I imagined the dive curve Murdr talked about. From the C-Hogs low speed top, he had to drop with a certain angle or curve. I used the speed I'd saved up to climb up into his dead zone. He would turn towards me, but couldnt get the shot...then he'd zoom up again to keep me from getting a qucik solution on him.

We did that 3 more times. and each time I got closer and closer to nailiing him. My WEPed XVI would gain energy steadily, while his maneuvering (and probably flap use while he tried to rope/reverse) bled his energy down.

At the peak of his 4th zoom, he dove out. I got some pings on him, but he ended up landiing.

Even so, it felt like a victory to me.

Thanks, Murdr!

[Damionte]

Alt-R turns your film recorder oon and off. You'll know when it's on as there will be a little red in the upper left hand side of the screen.

To get to the films you can find them in the movies folder in your HTC directory.

[Hajo]

Have flown with Lazer and against him...very good 38 stick.  Also have had a few tiffs with Murdr but not very many in years of AW and Aces High...he also is one of the premier 38 sticks in the game.  Delerium also another premium 38 jock.  There are a few.  Citabria owned in the 38 also (fester).
Saw Citabria (Fester) land a 111 kill sortie in the P38.  That's the longest streak I've seen in any game.  If you saw a 38....and you knew it was citabria.....you hoped your affairs were in order

[Damionte]

Ok I have a question. I've bene trying to set up that overshoot reversal. when it works it works great. when it doesn't I die frustrated.

when it doesn't work is usually because i've miss read thier E-state relative to mine. I'll give them the profile I think will cause the overshoot just to find they're either going to slow or I'm going to fast. But once I realise this it's too late to get away. I either try to turn into them and get shot or try and tuck and run and get run down.

[Murdr]

Umm, where was the question part in that?

[Murdr]

Sim, for some reason I didnt catch your post until just now.  Glad that concept has clicked for you.  Now that you've got an eye for it, keep a lookout for it, and you'll likely start to spot that zone in other situations also.


I saved this related PM reply from awhile ago that might help illustrate what you're talking about.

I do understand the situation you're talking about.  Before I say what I try to do with that situation, I need to back up and lay some ground work for it.

Often times in a dogfight, you are either conciously, or unconciously trying to predict where the arc of the other guys turn will take them a few seconds ahead of time.  One of the easiest 'best turn arc' to predict is comming down out of the vertical.  By that I mean predicting either a stall 'over the top' to recovering level flight, or converting from a vertical dive to level flight.  Either way, the bottom apex of the turn is going to be the altitude that the other plane will achieve level flight.

So any time I am fighting in the vertical, and I am either lower to begin with, or happen to be starting the upsweep of my loop while the other guy is in his downsweep, I am trying to judge what altitude they can recover level flight in relation to me.  The reason is that anywhere above that arc is a safe zone from their guns.

I made these visual aids for defending rope situations, but the basic premiss is true in any vertical fight.

In this picture I just made it inside the 'safe zone'.  Where our trails intercect, I was just above his arc as he passed behind me.  His dive speed carried him on by as my own speed neared stall.  Hence what we are talking about is an overshoot maneuver.


The same idea can be employed in a looping fight.  If the opponent has the advantage in angles, and trys to push the issue, and 'cut the corner' as you put it, to get a shot comming through the bottom part of the loop.  What you can do is forget maneuvering your nose to them for a moment, and concentrate on maneuvering to, and hanging out in the 'safe zone' until they are crossing under you.  What you are doing is initating a vertical scissors.  Since you are going up, and they are going down, they will have more speed, and overshoot underneath you.  All you have to do is reverse to shoot them on their upsweep.

Even though I employ this often in loop fights, I can't think of a film off hand with a slow speed fight (would probably have to comb through films to find it).  Here is a film with 2 bnz examples though. evarev3a   I don't know if you can easlily picture this in a slow speed loop fight, but as I mentioned, I am always looking to create the positioning for this any time I am lower that the other guy.  If you look at chknoris I still have this concept in my decisions on the fly.  I get the P51 to overshoot, take a half hearted shot at it.  Then I manuever under the spit16 just inside his downward arc believing the bottom apex of his turn will be in the trees if not below ground level.

Anyway, give it a try.  If you see a 'safe zone' in a vertical fight, try to get there, and have them overshoot below you for a vertical scissors.