Author Topic: Repeal online gambling laws--a petition (Read 723 times)

Gunthr · « **Reply #15 on:** January 16, 2007, 09:38:42 PM »

i think you are correct, Toad. but any state laws that directly outlaw internet gambling are ineffectual. i dont' think there is a single person successfully prosecuted for it due to the jurisdictional problem of defining "where" the "internet" is.

most laws against it are tangental, like the fed law that makes it illegal to be a US citizen and operate an off shore internet-based wagering site where people in those US states where gambling is illegal, can access it.

There has been only one arrest pursuant to that law that i've heard of - a guy running an operation in Costa Rica - and then only because he visited the states and got busted walking off the plane. there are other laws that target the use of pay pal and credit cards used for internet gambling purposes... i think these are the ones that Neubob refers to... those laws, if widely implemented, could have a real effect on internet gambling.

Toad · « **Reply #16 on:** January 16, 2007, 10:18:07 PM »

Nonetheless, it would seem the correct way to attack this is simply to legalize gambling at the state level.

At least, it seems that way to me. I hate to see the Feds getting into anything more; we've way more laws than we need or use but every year Congress meets to dream up a few more.

So, you can cut the Feds right out of the pattern simply by passing a gambling law in your state. Then the Feds are SOL.

Rolex · « **Reply #17 on:** January 17, 2007, 01:22:27 AM »

I don't think that's correct, Toad. My understanding is this, but I haven't put a lot of energy into it:

It is now a federal crime to offer non-sports betting to US citizens.

If any state ever did issue a license for on-line gambling (no state has ever issued one) to a company, they could only offer it to people within that state. The problem would be that the internet connection may traverse outside the state enroute, which would make it a federal crime.

The laws prohibiting credit card and other forms of electronic payment (paypal) for gambling are federal laws, not state laws.

Search engines cannot even provide links to gambing sites, as it is considered to be abetting a federal crime.

Neubob · « **Reply #18 on:** January 17, 2007, 05:20:05 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by Rolex
Search engines cannot even provide links to gambing sites, as it is considered to be abetting a federal crime.

Not so sure about that.

google search "online betting"

The whole issue of having the laws but not enforcing them seems very suspicious and inefficient to me.

eagl · « **Reply #19 on:** January 17, 2007, 06:07:55 AM »

The problem is that this is a clear issue of states rights vs. federal control. In the past, gambling has been one of those things left up to the states for the most part. The only time the feds get involved is when problems cross state lines and to collect taxes on gambling winnings. Now however, we have the federal government taking the questionable step of trying to regulate and enforce not only state laws, but international laws simply because the internet makes this particular form of interstate commerce very easy to do from home.

Why does the internet force the federal government to interfere with something that has been left to the states for so long? Not only that, what does it do to the relationship the federal and state govts have had with gambling on protected indian reservations?

As an example, let's say a guy from a state where gambling is not legal, to another state where gambling is not legal, goes to a reservation, logs onto the hotel internet connection and gambles online? And then what happens when they take their winnings home and file state/fed taxes on gambling winnings, since those winnings were not actually earned through licensed gambling activities on the reservation?

Basically it's a fool's errand the fed govt has embarked on, interfering in an activity that has been, and should remain, a matter for the states to decide. Short of dismantling the entire internet, there isn't really a good way for the feds to regulate this and their attempt not only is one more intrusion on daily life, it's not going to be particularly effective except to irritate otherwise law-abiding citizens.

I'm convinced that there are so many intruding federal laws that everyone in the US is either a felon, or will be shortly. I accidentally took a multi-tool on an airline flight in my carry-on bag a year or two ago... Now I know what it feels like to be a felon and knowing that my govt has labeled my everyday, non-violent and not "anti-social" behavior as criminal has immeasurably decreased my respect for the laws of the United States. I'm not the only one.

I can't imagine what that 4 year old felony sexual predator (the one who got charged with sexual assault for hugging his teacher) is going to grow up thinking about our so-called nation of laws...

We're changing from a nation that obeys laws out of a sense of honor and duty to a nation that routinely hides daily violations of law and obeys only out of fear of consequences when they think they might get caught. That's very sad. The next step is what the UK is going through, where entire classes of people commit violent anti-social offenses simply because there are no consequences, because the govt is busy coming up with ways to harass people who are otherwise law abiding.

SunKing · « **Reply #20 on:** January 17, 2007, 08:11:48 AM »

Poker is deemed a game of skill so this pathetic ban on Americans gambling online was bypassed for we poker players. For you sports bettors that just got screwed on the 15th use one of the websites offering proxy connections and create a new account. I have some friends doing that and it works fine, business as usual for them.

It's sad that the Goverment tried to ban gambling instead of just getting a piece of the pie which is the damn reason this all came up. If they can't have a piece no one can I guess.

For anyone wanting to play poker pokerstars is still legal for Americans to play on.

Rolex · « **Reply #21 on:** January 17, 2007, 08:12:36 AM »

Well put and sadly true, eagl.

lazs2 · « **Reply #22 on:** January 17, 2007, 08:50:31 AM »

cpxx... my guess is that if you had put a third of the effort into the research you did on the horses into something else you would have made one hell of a lot more than 4k a year at it.

For me... gamblers are just sick, sad people fighting the losing battle of a lifetime addiction. Some manage to get away from it and some manage to control it for years or even over a lifetime but all are on a roller coaster that only addiction can bring.

I have no problem with them having full access to their addiction tho so long as it doesn't screw with my rights.

lazs

sluggish · « **Reply #23 on:** January 17, 2007, 09:13:05 AM »

A gambling addiction can be as strong as alcoholism or drug addiction. One thing that really bothers me is when gas station attendants are required to ask everyone if they would like an instant ticket. What they are doing is hoping to prey on someone's addiction. Is this morally better than asking everyone who walks through the door if they would like a six pack this evening in the hope that the person is a recovering alcoholic that just needs that one little nudge to tip the scale? What is the difference between that and asking everyone if they would like a pack of cigarettes hoping that they just quit last week and are teetering on the edge of insanity?

cpxxx · « **Reply #24 on:** January 17, 2007, 11:38:40 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by lazs2
cpxx... my guess is that if you had put a third of the effort into the research you did on the horses into something else you would have made one hell of a lot more than 4k a year at it.

For me... gamblers are just sick, sad people fighting the losing battle of a lifetime addiction. Some manage to get away from it and some manage to control it for years or even over a lifetime but all are on a roller coaster that only addiction can bring.

I have no problem with them having full access to their addiction tho so long as it doesn't screw with my rights.

lazs

Trouble is. I don't do that much research, less time than I spend in Aces High, more time in the O club. It's more of a hobby. I could make a living out of it if I wanted too. But to be honest it would be a bit boring. I don't get a buzz out of winning the way a compulsive gambler does. You see those guys in betting shops, betting on horses, dogs and even virtual racing. I actually hate slot machines. What on earth is the attraction?

As for my tips, well Ice melted got beat into second by the one danger in my book.

The other one was a non runner. Never mind.

lazs2 · « **Reply #25 on:** January 17, 2007, 02:09:02 PM »

Yep... all the adds for the lottery and such seem sooooooo sleazy...

especially given the fact that the state is preying on the poor dumb bastards that have their math education (if you can call it that) by the state run public schools...

like shooting ducks in a barrel.

lazs

Gunthr · « **Reply #26 on:** January 17, 2007, 10:10:56 PM »

cpxxx, if you are doing that good, hey - stick with those ponys.

all my money is scared money, according to my associate, who makes 5 calls a day to make wagers. I don't wager that much. ohh, maybe a $20 bill in the slots with the indians now and then, but i'm full of regrets if i lose.

g'luck

g