Author Topic: For the 56th FG guys and Jug fans in general  (Read 2283 times)

Offline SkyRock

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For the 56th FG guys and Jug fans in general
« Reply #30 on: February 08, 2007, 09:47:41 PM »
An absolutely great piece of work!  <>  to the guy and all involved!  Best story I've read/viewed in quite awhile!  Astonishing!
Mark:aok

Triton28 - "...his stats suggest he has a healthy combination of suck and sissy!"

Offline Benny Moore

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« Reply #31 on: February 08, 2007, 09:54:27 PM »
How come our Thunderbolt can't take twenty three cannon rounds to the fuselage (not to mention three hundred machine gun rounds at point blank)?

Offline Guppy35

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« Reply #32 on: February 08, 2007, 11:03:31 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
How come our Thunderbolt can't take twenty three cannon rounds to the fuselage (not to mention three hundred machine gun rounds at point blank)?


Benny, just enjoy the film and don't make it part of the crusade to remake AH ok? :)
Dan/CorkyJr
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Offline Mugzeee

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« Reply #33 on: February 09, 2007, 12:00:46 AM »
OMG...that was very believable!

And bar none the best i have seen .

Thanks Corky!

Offline Hajo

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« Reply #34 on: February 09, 2007, 04:39:08 AM »
Benny

I don't think cannons were fired at Johnsons P47.  If you watched the movie...sure ya did...... only the two MGs were fired.  And since it took place in 1943 they were probably 7.9mm rds.

Besides....this Post is about a well made movie about a true event during a terrible time.  I've seen none better.

Mysticpuma has a future in the movie making venue methinks.  Anyone can see the quality of his work.
- The Flying Circus -

Offline Benny Moore

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« Reply #35 on: February 09, 2007, 10:13:48 AM »
Actually, the movie showed a lot of cannon hits (I used to play IL-2 so I know which hits were machine gun and which were cannon), but that's not what I'm going by.  In the real story, there were over twenty three twenty-millimeter cannon holes in his fuselage and over a hundred machine gun holes.

I've always said that the guns are too powerful in Aces High.  I've seen a great deal of gun camera footage, much of it showing dozens of cannon hits with no visible damage.  And I've never seen an fighter lose a wing or a tail, either, except for Japanese lightweights (and FW-190s getting hit in the ordnance).

I challenge anyone who says that the Aces High damage model is fine to reproduce this in Aces High.  Try putting twenty three cannon rounds into a P-47's fuselage without destroying it.  Never mind the three hundred machine gun rounds.

Offline Major Biggles

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« Reply #36 on: February 09, 2007, 10:19:46 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
Actually, the movie showed a lot of cannon hits (I used to play IL-2 so I know which hits were machine gun and which were cannon), but that's not what I'm going by.  In the real story, there were over twenty three twenty-millimeter cannon holes in his fuselage and over a hundred machine gun holes.

I've always said that the guns are too powerful in Aces High.  I've seen a great deal of gun camera footage, much of it showing dozens of cannon hits with no visible damage.  And I've never seen an fighter lose a wing or a tail, either, except for Japanese lightweights (and FW-190s getting hit in the ordnance).

I challenge anyone who says that the Aces High damage model is fine to reproduce this in Aces High.  Try putting twenty three cannon rounds into a P-47's fuselage without destroying it.  Never mind the three hundred machine gun rounds.



benny, this was a one off, johnson was very lucky...

if it was the norm for a 47 to soak up cannon rounds, he wouldn't have been so surprised when they counted them up!

but the thing with AH is that it has a dated damage model. all of the guns do the best amount of damage possible from data HTC have. the thing is, that the game registers hits on components, and once the damage done to that part exceeds it's limit, the part is damaged. put 5 20mm's in a wing and it falls of for example.

the damage model is dated, and i'm sure it'll be updated at some point, but right now, it does it's job fine, and HTC have bigger fish to fry...

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Offline Bronk

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« Reply #37 on: February 09, 2007, 10:33:40 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Benny Moore
Snip

OT

Benny you're doing it again.

Please, just enjoy a fine game film. Everything doesn't have to involve game flight model or damage model.
I've flown in your H2H room. While in your room you are far from the persona you  show us on the boards. I will only suggest you show us more of H2H benny than bbs benny.

Save the FM/DM discussions for the appropriate topics.


Bronk
See Rule #4

Offline Major Biggles

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« Reply #38 on: February 09, 2007, 11:21:29 AM »
agreed benny, you're far less of a grumpy guts in your room :p

47's wouldn't take that many hits and survive normally of course, that's why the story is so incredible.

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Offline Treize69

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« Reply #39 on: February 09, 2007, 12:11:01 PM »
Even in AH a Jug (or anything else) can take a LOT of hits as long as nothing important gets hit. I landed one (P-47D11) 2 nights ago with over a dozen (I think I counted 16) holes in my right wing alone, including 3 cannon hits. Plus about a half dozen more around the engine, 2 through the back of the canopy and 3 or 4 scattered around the tail. As no control surfaces, fuel tanks or engine components were hit, made it home with nothing knocked off.

Conversely I've lost an engine to a single cannon shell, or been PKed by a single bullet or shell into the cockpit. Its all in where they hit, and I think how fast the damage is accumulated makes a difference too. 5 or 6 shells hitting in a row seem to do a lot worse than the same 5 or 6 spread over a couple of bursts.
Treize (pronounced 'trays')- because 'Treisprezece' is too long and even harder to pronounce.

Moartea bolșevicilor.

Offline Platano

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« Reply #40 on: February 09, 2007, 12:17:26 PM »
amazing
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Fly Luftwaffe.

Offline SkyRock

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« Reply #41 on: February 09, 2007, 12:25:31 PM »
Someone post a 20mm cannon firing in real life for this benny guy to see!  Its not skeeter bites!  :aok

Triton28 - "...his stats suggest he has a healthy combination of suck and sissy!"

Offline Platano

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« Reply #42 on: February 09, 2007, 12:28:16 PM »
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3196656731430523693&q=WW2+20mm+cannon&hl=en
I win


While searching I found some Hispano footage...

I have new respect for typhiies and mossies :( :eek:

1 hispano cannon
« Last Edit: February 09, 2007, 12:37:52 PM by Platano »
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Fly Luftwaffe.

Offline eh

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« Reply #43 on: February 09, 2007, 01:04:23 PM »
Just a great film. I will watch it over and over again, along with some of the other IL2 films, and Tango's Mustang AH films.

The eye candy is superb. By the way... did everyone notice the functioning cockpit mirror? Did y'all? Huh? huh? Wouldn't it be nice if....

Offline Widewing

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« Reply #44 on: February 09, 2007, 01:19:44 PM »
Years ago, in a conversation with Johnson, he told me that they counted 22 holes made by 20 mm cannon. No one totaled up the number of 7.92 mm holes, but according to a mechanic who inspected the wrecked Jug, it easily exceeded 200.

Johnson had wounds from three 7.92 mm rounds, and suffered splinter wounds from one 20 mm round that detonated in the cockpit.

He suffered no physical damage from Mayer's gunnery (Mayer had previously fired all of his cannon ammo, and was limited to only his 7.92 mm cowl guns when he attacked Johnson's crippled Jug).

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.