Originally posted by Bodhi
Fact:
148 G.55 were delivered to the ANR, 15 more were destroyed by US bombing raids and, when the factory was captured, 37 more exemplars were ready, while 73 were still on the production line, at various degree of completion.
Gee... apparently you
didn't read this entire thread. You're b****ing at me... for agreeing with you?
Fact:
To achieve surprise, the B-24s, designed for high altitude attacks at 18,000-feet and above, attacked at 200-feet, with some formations ending up at 30 to 50 feet.
I'm sorry, I'm not going to believe that B-24s plowed through 20-foot+ haystacks at 170+mph without cartwheeling into the ground. I don't care what the adrenaline-rushed crews claim. I don't care what you say on that, common sense dictates it doesn't happen without the nose compacting in and the plane shuddering into the ground. We've covered that. I'm not changing my mind for the time being.
Totally removed from this conversation, that you're b****ing at me for.Krusty's Statement:
Fact:
XP-40Q, 2 built... Never saw service.
P-40N: In service by May of 1943, not at the end of the war. Heavily used in SWPA, CBI and MTO theaters. Two of the three squadrons of the highest scoring fighter group in the Pacific (the 49th FG) flew P-40Ns right up until late summer of 1944.
I've read several books that say otherwise. Some from the library over the years, but one I've got with me. Let me quote it.
"By late 1943 and early 1944 it was clear to all, manufacturer and users alike, that unless something was done, once and for all, to boost the performance of the Warhawk, its days were numbered. This is not surprising, for by that time much improved fighters were in service with the Axis air forces, in whatever theater they were deployed. Significant design changes were not possible without causing at least temporary chaos to the production lines, leading to the decision to build a new type. Thus the P-40N came into being, the last production version and also the most extensively built, with more than 5,000 manufactured in several variants".
Late 43 and early 44. Other books I've read have also said that the P-40N was too late to help much, despite being built in large numbers.
Again,
Totally removed from this conversation, that you're b****ing at me for.
Fact:
"There is photographic evidence that production of the C-1 series was also begun by ATG in Leipzig, as well as the Siebel Factory in Halle-Schkeuditz." Focke-Wulf Ta 152 by Dietmar Harmann
First of all, almost everybody out there claims the 152C-0 wasn't a production model. No C-1s were ever finished/shipped/whatever... So.. why are you mentioning the C-1? When discussing the 152 I was talking about versions that actually flew and fought (and the relationship to their chances of getting into this game). I don't want to get into it, but dude, who cares if the C-1 went into production if nothing ever came out the end of the production line? IMO if the "production line" doesn't "produce" any finished version, it really wasn't "in production" to begin with. <-- this said after-the-fact.
Again,
Totally removed from this conversation, that you're b****ing at me for.You have been b****ing at me in this thread and another (both about the G.55) for NO REASON. You have been insulting me for NO REASON.
Under the pretense that I've been making sh** up about the G.55 in this thread and another, you have attempted to rip my head off, for....
what?
You can't provide one link from the 2 threads in question, instead scouring old threads (some from 2005 in the last attempt before this) to find and twist anything out of shape, some way to make me look like I've been "lying" as you put it. Instead, I refuse to believe that a bomber can fly through a hay bale at well over 100mph without crashing; I provided a recognized statement, posted in almost every book in the world, that the ta152c-0 wasn't a production model (and the talk never turned to a c-1 model that was never made, btw); I have read many books that state the P-40N was too little too late, and quoted one for you here.
You're stirring up old sh** and just making yourself look bad man. Nothing I've said has been wrong, misleading, a lie, or anything of the sort. You've simply latched on to every little thing you can for some unknown reason, and try to cobble them together, but it just doesn't hold water.And while you're at it, stop b****ing at me about the G.55. Any time you "counter" with something, I've already supplied that info in this very thread. You're just repeating me, saying I'm wrong, and you're right. Your whole beef was about this plane, and what I said about it. Well, read
this thread and you'll see it's all there.
I'm done with your illogical ranting.
1) You pull up an obscure fact that was neither here-nor-there for the 152c comment. Why? It didn't change the outcome. It was a minor point. None were made.
2) You may blindly believe any report a pilot tells you, if you wish. Pilots in the VVs found the Hurricane a poor turning aircraft. Do you believe them? Doesn't matter. I choose NOT to believe what, to me, is fanciful tales of 100,000lb planes flying so low they crash into things, and then miraculously DON'T crush their front end in, or DON'T kill their engines, or DON'T hit the ground, bounce, then blow up. I don't care what YOU believe. *I* believe this wasn't the case, and will do so for the immediate future.
3) You try to pull up some quote about the P-40s, let me show you the entire quote:
Not really. The N and Q models didn't show up til the end of the war, and they were still inferior to the P51s, P47s, F4us, etc that had already been fighting for years.
The aircraft was hurt from the start, like the P39. It was just behind the curve as the war started, and only fell behind from there. It got improvements, but not enough and not fast enough to be competitive.
So, even if I'm mistaken by quoting many books which all say the same thing, you can't blame me for getting a date wrong, if it's a common misconception and perpetuated ad nauseum in print. The REST of my post was still correct, and I notice you didn't give me any credit for that.
So, 1, 2, 3 attempts ... to what? You're not discrediting me.. You're just b****ing at me.
