B-25 Mitchell

[GtoRA2]

I hope we do NOT get the lame 75MM version,  in service almost all units yanked the gun since you couldnt hit anything with it.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by GtoRA2
I hope we do NOT get the lame 75MM version,  in service almost all units yanked the gun since you couldnt hit anything with it.

No, they were not yanked from service.  One bomb group kept the B-25Hs to replace their war weary B-25Gs and most of the others were then sent to various units serving in the CBI theater were they were used good effect.  A few were also returned to depots.


ack-ack

[tedrbr]

"War weary" may have come from the fact that firing the 75mm from the B-25 did very bad things to the airframe.  Some airframes were grounded after as little as 20 rounds being fired, due to the fact that spar and bracing were beginning to show signs to stress, and the rivet holes were starting to oval out of round.

Banks of .50's with API rounds proved better at strafing and anti-shipping operations than the 75mm anyway.

75mm was often field modified and replaced with banks of .50's, but HTC does not model field modifications.  So if it came with a 75mm from OEM, it should have a 75mm in-game.

[Saxman]

Hornet:

B-25J also frequently came in a hard-nosed version armed with 12 fixed forward .50 cal (eight in the nose, four in the side blisters). If we get the J that package should be an option as well (sacrificing formation).

Actually, pretty much EVERY modelof B-25 could be realistically given the option of flying as gunships, as a number of B-25Cs were also built with hard noses.

tedrbr:

I'm sorry the A-26 didn't make it, as we DO need another perk bomber, but quite frankly the B-25 was FAR more significant to the war, no matter how big a "POS" it was (a statement to which most credible aviation historians would object).

And what the FRELL is with this obsession from the nay-sayers with that piece of **** Bruckheimer much-up (you do realize that for the most part YOU'RE the only ones mentioning it, right)? I don't know about the kiddies, but *I* voted B-25 because it was among the most widely used and most versatile medium bombers of the war, and it really doesn't make sense that it wasn't in the game in the first place (same argument could be made for the He-111, which is ALSO needed, but the 25 was just as significant and would be far more useable in the MA).

[BBBB]

I have no idea why you guys keep trying to perk the A26 if we got it. It is/would be an easy kill. There is no need to perk it. The A-26 was a great plane..but it wasn't worthy of perks. Save your perks for the B-29 if we ever get it.


-Sp0t

[tedrbr]

Originally posted by Saxman

tedrbr:

I'm sorry the A-26 didn't make it, as we DO need another perk bomber, but quite frankly the B-25 was FAR more significant to the war, no matter how big a "POS" it was (a statement to which most credible aviation historians would object).

I'll admit the B-25 served in the war very well.  It did so in theaters where escorting fighters were the norm, not the exception.  It excelled in anti-shipping and harassment missions against the Japanese in the PTO in the island hopping campaign conducted there.  It's sheer numbers also were significant as well as it's use in the U-boat war.  It also saw widespread use around the world due to the Lend-Lease program, while other countries' war production was inadequate to meet demand.

I can also see the argument for adding the plane to the plane-set on historical terms for SEA and AvA and EW (depending which version is done).... an argument that could also have been made for the He-111 and Pe-2 based on historical significance of the battles they fought in, and the German and Russian plane-sets are very slim to the American sets now.


But it's War Record is not going to translate well into the AHII Game.
The majority of the game's players are LW, fly low-ENY planes, and buff drivers are often on their own in their Lancs and B-24's.  The B-25 carries less than the B-26 slower than the B-26.  The IL-2 is a more capable gunship in many ways to the B-25.  The A-20 might be as well.  A Lanc at altitude boasts a higher airspeed.  The B-25 climb rate is among the worse.

If we get the B-25, it might see SEA, AvA, and EW use by the few players that frequent those arenas, but it will be as rare in the LW arenas as a Val, Kate, or Boston are now once players learn what it's performance parameters are.


So, how does the majority voters in the LW keep the B-25 in the running?  Certainly not by actually knowing anything about the plane's performance abilities.  Why would they keep voting for a plane that won't be used where they spent most of their time playing?

[Stoney74]

Originally posted by tedrbr
So, how does the majority voters in the LW keep the B-25 in the running?  Certainly not by actually knowing anything about the plane's performance abilities.  Why would they keep voting for a plane that won't be used where they spent most of their time playing?

Maybe just because of its historical significance.  That's why I voted for it after the Ki-43 got buried in a pile of other, (historically) insignificant Japanese planes.  There are a lot of "dog" aircraft in the game.  Each contributes a little more to providing a lot of us the ability to "fly" the WWII aircraft we always read about growing up in the shadow of the WWII generation.  There were a lot of planes on that list that were individually more important to some of us, than others.  The Finns want the Brewster--by most thoughts, its a "dog".  Some wanted the He-111--another "dog".  The list goes on.  IMO, most of the significant aircraft during the War are already in the game, save a couple.  At this point, I believe HTC is always going to dissappoint some players with the planes that get added.  But, they'll all show up at some point in the future, so its really just a matter of time.  I'd like to see all of the aircraft originally listed in the vote, but if I have to prioritize them, personally I'm going to vote according to my personal belief in their significance--which could differ substantially from someone else's.  I'd never even heard of the G.55 before this vote, so if nothing else, I've learned something.

[Bronk]

Originally posted by tedrbr



So, how does the majority voters in the LW keep the B-25 in the running?  Certainly not by actually knowing anything about the plane's performance abilities.  Why would they keep voting for a plane that won't be used where they spent most of their time playing?

Because unlike you, not all of us are stuck on performance stats and how it relates to LWAs.
If you consider the holes it fills the. Its easy to see how it beat out the A-26.


Bronk

[Widewing]

A point, if I may....

For snapshots, the CM team can enable B-25s on CVs. You can enable them offline (default is everything enabled from CVs).

So, should the CM team decide to do a Doolittle raid snapshot, they have the ability to enable the B-25 from a carrier. However, you will never see this in the MA.

If we get the B-25, I will wring it out the day it is released and we will have hard performance data from day one.

My regards,

Widewing

[Jonny boy 8]

Originally posted by Bolo6
If the B-25 is the new plane that we get, will it be able to take off from CV like the Doolittle Raid?
Just wanna know, any guidance will be appreciated.

Bolo6 Actual out.

amen... ill host maps just to do the doolittle raid.

p51srule:aok

[Muskie6]

Everyone will have the chance to take a B25 off of a carrier in the MA, if they so choose.

They just have to land it, on the carrier to begin with.

Good Luck  

[GtoRA2]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
No, they were not yanked from service.  One bomb group kept the B-25Hs to replace their war weary B-25Gs and most of the others were then sent to various units serving in the CBI theater were they were used good effect.  A few were also returned to depots.


ack-ack

Ack
 I am no expert but I do have several books, and I wasnt talking about the plane but the 75MM gun, almost all the combat zone pics I have of the H, have the 75MM port faired over and more .50 MGs added. Also the books said the gun was not popular because you had a hard time hitting anything with it.

[*UH*]

dont we have enough B-whatever bombers?

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by GtoRA2
Ack
 I am no expert but I do have several books, and I wasnt talking about the plane but the 75MM gun, almost all the combat zone pics I have of the H, have the 75MM port faired over and more .50 MGs added. Also the books said the gun was not popular because you had a hard time hitting anything with it.

You sure those weren't G models?  From what I've been able to gather, those units that retained the H model kept the 75mm cannon but then it could be that those Hs that were returned to the depots could have been retrofitted with the .50 cal super strafer nose package.


ack-ack

[tedrbr]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
You sure those weren't G models?  From what I've been able to gather, those units that retained the H model kept the 75mm cannon but then it could be that those Hs that were returned to the depots could have been retrofitted with the .50 cal super strafer nose package.

I can't think of any planes in AHII that are field refits, so if you are looking at models, you probably should look at how they came from the factory.