Author Topic: What WMD? (Read 798 times)

Elfie · « **Reply #15 on:** June 17, 2007, 04:10:56 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Fulmar
Now, normally I would criticize you for googling information to make an point in an argument (because we all know the internet is 100% accurate and that aliens built the pyramids in Egypt); however, the article is by Norman Solomon, a very well recognized and awarded columnist.

Just because he is a well recognized and awarded columnist doesn't meant everything he wrote is accurate. He says America sold Saddam poison gas. Afaik, no country sold Saddam actual chemical weapons. Many countries did sell him precursors though, including the USA. America didn't sell him anything that didn't have a dual use.

Sirloin made the statement that America sold Saddam chemical weapons and then provided a list of biological agents. I went through his list and found that each agent had a legitimate civilian use, even if that use was just for research.

Well, I didn't get all the way through the list, it got real late and my eyes were starting to bug out from so much reading, but I did make it to the last 5 or 6 items.

If you can provide a list of chemicals the USA sold Saddam, I will go through it and see if any of them don't have a dual use. I will also list them individually, with sources and tell what commercial/research etc use they have.

Funny how America isn't even in the top 5 of Holden's list (I've seen that list before) yet folks continue to insist that America is the one responsible for Iraq having chemical weapons when 3 western European countries are in the top 5 and one is in a not so distant second place.

Also, iirc, Western European countries lead the way in selling production equipment.

68ZooM · « **Reply #16 on:** June 17, 2007, 06:46:09 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Yeager
why dont you research who Sold Saddam the Gas?
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He was supposed to use the gas on Iranian soldiers, Not his own people. Now who is to blame for all the murdering that saddam ordered? Oh yeah, Americans are to blame....typical liberal

What a flippin dolt.... please explain where i said America was to blame.

You wouldnt know a liberal if it slapped ya in the face... Now go back under your Bridge

68ZooM · « **Reply #17 on:** June 17, 2007, 06:52:16 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Fulmar
Now, normally I would criticize you for googling information to make an point in an argument (because we all know the internet is 100% accurate and that aliens built the pyramids in Egypt); however, the article is by Norman Solomon, a very well recognized and awarded columnist.

Thats why i posted it... i thought it was a very good read

EDIT...... Heres another link by the US Army very interesting reading. its very long but you have to read it all to understand, you just cant read a few lines.

http://www.army.mil/professionalwriting/volumes/volume1/july_2003/7_03_2v2.html

SirLoin · « **Reply #18 on:** June 17, 2007, 06:53:17 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Elfie

Sirloin made the statement that America sold Saddam chemical weapons and then provided a list of biological agents. I went through his list and found that each agent had a legitimate civilian use, even if that use was just for research.

Your "Duel Use" argument was so rediculous i didn't bother to respond..I suppose you could say enriched plutonium has more than one use as well..

I have yet to see any evidence that chemical weapons were shipped from the USA(as i incorrectly stated)..They were nasty Bio-Weapons(WMD) that Saddam did not end up using.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #19 on:** June 17, 2007, 08:24:46 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by SirLoin
Your "Duel Use" argument was so rediculous i didn't bother to respond..I suppose you could say enriched plutonium has more than one use as well..

I have yet to see any evidence that chemical weapons were shipped from the USA(as i incorrectly stated)..They were nasty Bio-Weapons(WMD) that Saddam did not end up using.

Chem and bio weapons don't kill people, people kill people.

Yeager · « **Reply #20 on:** June 17, 2007, 08:44:03 PM »

What a flippin dolt....
====
whats a dolt? and why do they flip?

please explain where i said America was to blame.
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who is to blame, in your opinion?

its very long but you have to read it all to understand, you just cant read a few lines.
====
Since you posted it, can you at least summarize it?

68ZooM · « **Reply #21 on:** June 17, 2007, 10:14:17 PM »

Originally posted by Yeager
why dont you research who Sold Saddam the Gas?
====
He was supposed to use the gas on Iranian soldiers, Not his own people. Now who is to blame for all the murdering that saddam ordered? Oh yeah, Americans are to blame ....typical liberal

Guess you didnt post that now did you.... Or is it just another Witty comment that you always seem to have when you respond to something you obviously no nothing about.

I posted a Link so people could read the entire article for themselves, in there own time, and come to their own Concusions, instead of a breif summary to an article that is very lengthy.... And would just get cut and pasted to whatever they wanted others to see.

Unless your uncapable of clicking the link and reading it for yourself, Then by all means ask your parents for help.

As far as who i think is to blame, The verdict is still out.... I'm still reading other publications on the subject.

To tell you what a Flippin Dolt is would get me banned

Elfie · « **Reply #22 on:** June 17, 2007, 10:43:32 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by SirLoin
Your "Duel Use" argument was so rediculous i didn't bother to respond..I suppose you could say enriched plutonium has more than one use as well..

I have yet to see any evidence that chemical weapons were shipped from the USA(as i incorrectly stated)..They were nasty Bio-Weapons(WMD) that Saddam did not end up using.

No, they weren't bio-weapons. They were biological agents and they weren't in a weaponized form.

Could those agents have been used for bio-weapons research? Sure they could have. They could also have just as easily been used for legitimate purposes. That was the whole point to my 3 or 4 post response, to show what other uses each item could have.

It's also important to note that the US stopped selling chemical precursors when it became known that Saddam was using chemical weapons. The US also stopped selling dual-use bio-agents when it became known he was working on biological weapons. That makes it highly unlikely that the US knowingly and willfully sold Saddam any dual-use item with the intent to help him aquire chemical or biological weapons.

Yeager · « **Reply #23 on:** June 17, 2007, 11:04:28 PM »

Or is it just another Witty comment that you always seem to have when you respond to something you obviously no nothing about.
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what are we talking about?

68ZooM · « **Reply #24 on:** June 17, 2007, 11:32:52 PM »

Maybe you need to re-read your comment remember this one?

====
He was supposed to use the gas on Iranian soldiers, Not his own people. Now who is to blame for all the murdering that saddam ordered? Oh yeah, Americans are to blame....typical liberal

Or shall i say Smartprettythanged comment, Does that work for you?

Other than that I'm done with your Replies.

Or are we just trolling now

Elfie · « **Reply #25 on:** June 17, 2007, 11:39:31 PM »

I almost forgot, enriched Uranium has 2 uses. It can either be used to make nuclear weapons or it can be used as a fuel in a nuclear reactor for generating power. Very few countries actually use nuclear powered ships, the more common use would be nuclear power plants for generating electricity.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #26 on:** June 18, 2007, 04:24:56 AM »

Yeah but civilian uranium is enriched to like 2 or 3% U238

Weapons grade is like 95% U238

Huge difference

straffo · « **Reply #27 on:** June 18, 2007, 04:35:24 AM »

I think you swapped 235 and 238, I'll check later.

Holden McGroin · « **Reply #28 on:** June 18, 2007, 04:49:40 AM »

yup... 235 is the fissile isotope...

AAolds · « **Reply #29 on:** June 18, 2007, 04:57:26 AM »

IMO, the WMDs that Iraq under Saddam was accused of having could have been moved out of the country or hidden in the vastness and deepness of the sands. We did give him early warning that we were coming--bad idea IMO. Whether or not the weapons exist now..... I dont know. I do know that Saddam's record of past action showed he had such weapons and also used them, which leads me to the conclusion that he could have still had some and would more than likely have hidden them in the hopes that he would regain access to them again. Thankfully, we did not let bugger escape this time.