Author Topic: Islamophobia and Salman Rushdie (Read 2671 times)

crockett · « **Reply #90 on:** June 23, 2007, 12:34:32 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by AKIron
What have I done? Towards what end? That tobacco kills people is not arguable. Less quantifiable is the detriment of pornography. Perhaps nothing more than create a gulf between you and your spouse or you and your God.

You said the porn industry was only interested in free speech for profit.

"Comeon, the "adult industry" has no interest in freedom of speech beyond profitability"

I simply told you generally no one cares about anything unless they themselves are directly affected. I just asked what have you done to champion free speech ?

A quote I think holds a bit of merit.

Nature knows no indecencies; man invents them. ~Mark Twain, Notebook, 1935

AKIron · « **Reply #91 on:** June 23, 2007, 12:40:07 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by crockett
You said the porn industry was only interested in free speech for profit.

"Comeon, the "adult industry" has no interest in freedom of speech beyond profitability"

I simply told you generally no one cares about anything unless they themselves are directly affected. I just asked what have you done to champion free speech ?

A quote I think holds a bit of merit.

Nature knows no indecencies; man invents them. ~Mark Twain, Notebook, 1935

I have spoken to others my mind in regards to freedom of speech both here and in real life.

What else might I do? I did also serve a number of years in the USAF which might be considered support of our liberties. Surely this is worth as much as a quote? Some conjoining self-interests are more mutually beneficial than others.

crockett · « **Reply #92 on:** June 23, 2007, 12:45:22 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by AKIron
I have spoken to others my mind in regards to freedom of speech both here and in real life. What else might I do? I did also serve a number of years in the USAF which might be considered support of our liberties. Surely this is worth as much as a quote? Some conjoining self-interests are more mutually beneficial than others.

Thank you for your service to our country. While it's important that our country has people like your self to protect it's liberties. IMO it's also just as important that there are people whom are willing to push back the boundaries and test the limits of free speech.

bustr · « **Reply #93 on:** June 23, 2007, 02:44:38 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by crockett
Thank you for your service to our country. While it's important that our country has people like your self to protect it's liberties. IMO it's also just as important that there are people whom are willing to push back the boundaries and test the limits of free speech.

crockett,

You might wanna quit while your ahead. I don't think you could get yourself elected to dog catcher on the platform of equaling yourself to our military personel and their service based on pornography as a patriotic duty in defence of the first amendmant. I don't think mom and pop america would get past the letter "P" let alone take you seriously.

Pornography is not an essential element to the security and freedom of the United States of America. But then, we did fight a war with Germany, kill millions of its citizens and occupy the place for over 20 years just so we could capture Goering's mansion with it's world class pornography library. Rumor has it most of the National Socialist leadership dropped in from time to time to enjoy his library between rounds of being good Liberal members of the Riche. Yes good healthy adult entertainment................ ....

crockett · « **Reply #94 on:** June 23, 2007, 03:20:17 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by bustr
crockett,

You might wanna quit while your ahead. I don't think you could get yourself elected to dog catcher on the platform of equaling yourself to our military personel and their service based on pornography as a patriotic duty in defence of the first amendmant. I don't think mom and pop america would get past the letter "P" let alone take you seriously.[/i]]

Oh, I dunno I always thought all people were equal, no matter they be the very best or the very worst society has to offer. Also who said I was equaling my self to anyone? I try not to judge unless I know they are judging me.

I said each has it's place.. That's very much diffrent from saying one is better than the other or equal too the other. It's all a matter of perspective.

Quote

Originally posted by bustr [/B]
Pornography is not an essential element to the security and freedom of the United States of America. But then, we did fight a war with Germany, kill millions of its citizens and occupy the place for over 20 years just so we could capture Goering's mansion with it's world class pornography library. Rumor has it most of the National Socialist leadership dropped in from time to time to enjoy his library between rounds of being good Liberal members of the Riche. Yes good healthy adult entertainment................ .... [/B]

Pornography my not be essential element to the security of this country, but it is a very important part of it's freedoms. Thanks to that right of freedom of speech, people can print all the bibles they want or all the porn they want assuming it doesn't violate any laws.

Some might not like it, but thanks to our Constitution others have the right to make thats decision for themselves and not have some "mom and pop " tell them what they can and can not do or see.

Maybe if people weren't so uptight and scared into thinking something is bad then their perspective might change a bit. I've always thought it was funny, that it's no big deal to have shows on TV where people are killed constantly yet a bare breast will cause a riot.

Personally I think our country has it's perspectives a bit twisted in the wrong direction.

bustr · « **Reply #95 on:** June 23, 2007, 06:23:08 AM »

Quote

Originally posted by crockett

Pornography my not be essential element to the security of this country, but it is a very important part of it's freedoms. Thanks to that right of freedom of speech, people can print all the bibles they want or all the porn they want assuming it doesn't violate any laws.

Pornography is garbage and a simple but lucrative vehical to making money by showing people tushies gone wild. There is nothing noble or brave in the venture. We are biologicly prone to react which makes male humans escpecially good marks for tushie pictures. Printing bibles is protected by the first amendmant via the free exercise of religion statement.

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances."

Pronography had to be found between the lines (( in the punctuation secret code marks along with abortion)) only after contentious review by the SCOTUS. Depending on the 9 human beings sitting at any time on the SCOTUS, the future of pornography is always in danger of being returned to the gutter as smut.

If pornography were as essential to the foundation of free speech in this country as you have conviced yourself, politicians at all levels would have no fear of welding pornography in bold letters into their election campains as a primary plank. Even Billery Clinton couldn't elevate smut to the level you delude us with by getting Lewinskied in the oval office.

It's comendable you make a living doing something you are a professional at. Smut is smut and will always be smut. Don't do our military past and present the disservice of equating defending smut under the auspicies of the constitution with their real sacrifice to our Nation.

Originally posted by crockett
Thank you for your service to our country. While it's important that our country has people like your self to protect it's liberties. IMO it's also just as important that there are people whom are willing to push back the boundaries and test the limits of free speech

Maverick · « **Reply #96 on:** June 23, 2007, 12:12:26 PM »

I apologise if you were offended by the second question. It was not intended in the manner you took it. It was intended to frame up a position that it is a commercial decision to have adult content. Obviously you charge a fee for someone to use your web services.

I'm not responsible for what you believe, nor are you responsible to determine what I do.

Based on the fact that the content of your web sites are based on a commercial decision, what do you feel is a proper means of determining what is permissible content? Should the content be limited and if so, by whom? How about access control and again who should be responsible for monitoring that aspect of the situation? I'm not referring to parental monitoring of their kids web visits, a responsible parent should be doing that as a matter of course to avoid predatory contact.

FWIW I have no idea what asacp is or does.

Quote

Originally posted by crockett
You are going to try and sit there and act holier than thou after you ask this:

"So what is your feeling regarding pedophiles and child pornography? If they pay the bill is it ok to have their particular kind of "stuff" on your web sites? "

You somehow expect me to believe that you aren't trying to insinuate that I think it's ok to push CP just because I'm in the Adult industry?

If you weren't trying to give that impression why did you just stop the question with the first part?

So what is your feeling regarding pedophiles and child pornography?

If you asked that question I wouldn't have a single problem in the world answering it. However you most defiantly added the second part of your question to imply that because I'm in the Adult industry that I must also push CP.

For the first question of course I despise CP and those whom produce it, or watch it. I fully support the asacp.com and have donated to them several times and also been part of fund raisers within the adult community to support the asacp.

I think you can figure out my stance on your second question yourself.

In regards to this topic I think we have strayed far enough off topic. I may have led it there a bit but I felt my first responce was in line with the scope of the topic.

As far as the topic of adult and how I choose to make my living, I personally don't think it has a place on this forum. I only posted what I do, because I was asked and Im' not going to lie about what I do as I feel no need too. [/B]

crockett · « **Reply #97 on:** June 23, 2007, 12:48:37 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Maverick
I apologise if you were offended by the second question. It was not intended in the manner you took it. It was intended to frame up a position that it is a commercial decision to have adult content. Obviously you charge a fee for someone to use your web services.

I'm not responsible for what you believe, nor are you responsible to determine what I do.

Based on the fact that the content of your web sites are based on a commercial decision, what do you feel is a proper means of determining what is permissible content? Should the content be limited and if so, by whom? How about access control and again who should be responsible for monitoring that aspect of the situation? I'm not referring to parental monitoring of their kids web visits, a responsible parent should be doing that as a matter of course to avoid predatory contact.

FWIW I have no idea what asacp is or does.

Well as far as whats available today.. I think too much is out there for free. It might surprise you, but most in the industry would rather you have to pay to see the goods.

Back in 1998 - 2000 guys used to get rich quick just putting up banners on crappy pages. Wasn't easy to see the free stuff, so people had to pay for what they want to see.

Problem is, the genie is out of the bottle and it's pretty much impossible to stuff back in. If it was a perfect world I'd say hell yea make laws that force the good stuff to be hidden behind members areas.

However it's the internet or the "world" wide web. The US might think it can control stuff, but in reality there is little that they can do short of going after the billing like they have done with Gambling.

(difference in Gambling and Porn.. gambling has always been illegal in the US so it was easy to attack)

Reason I say that, is because say it's all made illegal in the US (will never happen). Well that doesn't stop anyone in Europe, Russia or where ever else from doing exactly what they want. So where do you think the business would move?

I think what the US govt is doing is going to greatly backfire on them. By trying to make regulations tougher and for the most part harassing legit business they are forcing guys to move offshore. Once they move off shore they are no longer under US regulation and don't have to play by US laws.

So tell what do you think is better?

1) The govt accept the fact that people are going to produce this content and work with the industry to make reasonable regulations.

or

2) The govt continues as normal trying to over regulate and make life hard for the companies whom are trying to run legit businesses.

Is it..

A) Better that the govt act reasonable so they can actually regulate the industry?

or

B) Harasses the industry until it's moves offshore where it can no longer be regulated?

I think common sense should dictate the answer, too bad so few in our govt seem to react with common sense.

As a side note, my servers are already located in Amsterdam and I will soon be setting up my company in Curacao. Simply to protect myself from a govt whom I feel is out of hand. I do nothing wrong and in reality I don't even mess with much hardcore stuff, it's mostly softcore style.

However why take a unnecessary risk if I don't need to? Why be over regulated if I don't have to be? Why pay 30%+ of my income in taxes when I can pay 3%? See the point I'm getting at? In this day and age it's far too easy to set up offshore and not have to deal with strict US regulations.

So the govt would be better served and better serve it's citizens to actually work with the industry instead of attack it. At least that's my opinion.

ASACP = Association of Sites Advocating Child Protection. ASACP is for the most part, Adult funded and is pretty much the biggest anti CP watchdog group on the net.

SirLoin · « **Reply #98 on:** June 23, 2007, 12:59:51 PM »

They publish cartoons mocking Jesus..then say u can't satarize Mohammed?

@*&% em

Maverick · « **Reply #99 on:** June 23, 2007, 01:32:02 PM »

Crocket,

Were still back to one of the questions I posed earlier. What do you, as a provider of web services, feel is a reasonable means of regulating. You mentioned Govt. cooperating with the adult industry but I am not sure how that can be accomplished especially as you say since the source can be moved off shore so easily. I'm just not seeing the means or method you have envisioned?

Short of monitoring every web feed crossing the border I just don't see what they can do. Raiding an individual for the content of their computer is rather inefficient due to the sheer number of computers they'd somehow have to be able to tap into. Does this leave the "industry" in the position of being self regulating in a de facto situation?

I agree that a pay to view site could have some limited effect on the content access, but with the number of "kids" who have their own account a simple CC isn't much of a deterent.

RedTop · « **Reply #100 on:** June 23, 2007, 04:32:41 PM »

Rushdie to porn....what a ride.

I would like to thank also , all those pornqueens and king , those internet wannabe movie stars , those people that spend their credit cards to d/l some people doing the nasty in jello pudding while wearing a snorkle and rubber tback......

For keeping my freedom of speech possible and protecting it from those evil rightwingers.

crockett · « **Reply #101 on:** June 23, 2007, 06:13:59 PM »

Quote

Originally posted by Maverick
Crocket,

Were still back to one of the questions I posed earlier. What do you, as a provider of web services, feel is a reasonable means of regulating. You mentioned Govt. cooperating with the adult industry but I am not sure how that can be accomplished especially as you say since the source can be moved off shore so easily. I'm just not seeing the means or method you have envisioned?

Short of monitoring every web feed crossing the border I just don't see what they can do. Raiding an individual for the content of their computer is rather inefficient due to the sheer number of computers they'd somehow have to be able to tap into. Does this leave the "industry" in the position of being self regulating in a de facto situation?

I agree that a pay to view site could have some limited effect on the content access, but with the number of "kids" who have their own account a simple CC isn't much of a deterent.

Well until there is a legit way to verify age on the net.. not much can be done. CC cards will "not" allow themselves to be used as a age verification. The govt tried to push a bill with that included and the CC companies flat out told them no.

Germany is the only country that's tried to do it and it's failed pretty bad. Then we have China whom blocks sites and that sure as hell doesn't seem to work, judging by all the worthless Chinese traffic that's out there.

My solution is for the govt to support or provide a "free" software that parents or whom ever can block sites on their computers. Like cyber-nanny or something like that.

Then parents can do their job instead of the govt raising peoples kids. That or create a .kids domain extension that has sites that are safe for kids and give parents a means to block other sites. So it works something like AOL or the likes. (I've said it many times.. Would you let your kid play in the highway? Then why let them play on the Internet super highway?)

Of course the govt will never support stuff like that, because they have to deal with the Religious Right, whom thinks the "only" solution is no porn at all. In fact the key issue in getting anything done is the Religious Right because they want everything their way.

It has nothing to do with the adult industry not being willing to work with the powers that be. It's the powers that be won't work with the adult industry.

Simple reason is because they are career politicians they don't care about getting things done but only getting re-elected. You think a congressman or a senator would get re-elected if he was on record as being the guy whom worked with the porn industry?

It's always been about politics and never about whats the best way to work with eacth other. You think the Religious Right would accept a agreement between the adult industry and the govt? lol yea right.

Hell the RR even protested the .xxx domain because they thought it would make a "legal" red light district (As is porn already isn't legal). The adult industry also protested it but for other reasons. The RR couldn't even see the forest for the trees, simply because they want to be able to tell every one what to do.

Maverick · « **Reply #102 on:** June 23, 2007, 06:53:52 PM »

The wife had to deal with this situation a bit. She worked at the University library. They had a ton of computers all hooked up to the internet. There were and are no restrictions regarding content as the library is very "sensitive" about this on a freedom of speech issue. At the same time they have young kids (High school and Jr. high) in the library using the same machines. Add to this were the "street people" who also had to be allowed into the library in addition to some predatory folks who live in town and want to use a computer that doesn't belong to them to hunt for their particular "interest" so they can surf anonymously and not worry about being caught.

My suggestion was to install net nanny or it's equivalent. That was not allowed as it constituted "censorship". I then suggested they have some computers segregated so those people who had a need to research the adult sites could do so without displaying it to the general population and the visiting kids. That was also turned down. They never did come up with a solution before she retired. That was over 3 years ago and they are still trying to decide what to do. In the mean time they lose several computers a year because some one likes to access kiddie porn and store it on the machine or they use it to send it to someone else as a prank.

crockett · « **Reply #103 on:** June 23, 2007, 07:31:03 PM »

Yea it's a touchy subject all around which is why I get kind of ticked at the govt and the powers that be. The content is never going to go away, so IMO it would be best if the politicians and the Religious Right would understand that and work with the industry instead of always trying to fight it.

The FBI on the other hand seems to be open to working with the industry, however their hands are tied by the powers that be. I'm pretty sure the guys @ the FBI understand that it's easier to get things done with corporation rather than having to fight for everything.