New And Can't Decide: P38L or Me109k-4

[Ack-Ack]

People are gonna bittch and moan but the best advice you can get is to fly a Spitfire Mk IX or VIII until you get used to the flight model and get a firm grasp of ACM.

I recommend that you work your way into Bf 109K-4 or P-38s before jumping into them.  The reason why I recommend flying those two Spitfires I mentioned is that they are both very forgiving aircraft, which is a plus for the new player.  Both planes are good all-around fighters, meaning they can either Energy or Angles fight and are good at both.  Take this time to learn both fighting styles and practice until you have them both down.  Also, this is a good time to experiment and lay down the foundation for your own fighting style.  

Once you are confident enough that you can either Energy or Angles fight in either of those two planes, then move on to the Bf 109K-4 or any of the three P-38 models.  This way might take a couple of months but it's far more rewarding and it also makes the transition to different plane easier.  

ack-ack

[Benny Moore]

I didn't learn on a Spitfire.  I stuck with my beautiful P-38 and flew her until I stopped being lunch for the masses.  My recommendation is to choose the one that you have more respect for (whether because you've seen it at an air show, or your grandfather flew it, or whatever), and fly it nearly exclusively.  The other you can fly every so often just to have fun, but you'll probably never be that great in it.  That's what I do with the P-38 and the P-47.  Again,  I do not recommend taking a granny ride like the Spitfire.  It'll just stunt your progress.

[DoNKeY]

Oh and PS, right now I'm just flying in offline mode, I have Norton installed...

Do the planes keep on flying without both winds and the tail just so you can get more gunnery practice?

[clerick]

The 38 has a secret society.  'Nuff said

[Soulyss]

shhhhh.......

[DoNKeY]

Originally posted by clerick
The 38 has a secret society.  'Nuff said

Exactly what I was thinking...

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Benny Moore
I do not recommend taking a granny ride like the Spitfire.  It'll just stunt your progress.

A statement made out of complete ignorance.  Too bad Lev no longer plays, he'd probably enjoy showing you what a "granny" ride the Spitfire is.


ack-ack

[DaddyAck]

I have 2 favorite rides and they are the 109(any model) and the P38G or J not too crazy for the L.

I learned to fly in as my starter ride the 109 and believe me the learning curve is going to be high in this game reguarless of what you fly (ok not so much in lalas nikies and spits but we will leave that one alone).  The 109k4 is a great ride, but untill you learn shot controll and actually can hit consistantly I would say learn in either the 109F4 or the 109G2 leave the gondies alone in my opinion, but 150 rounds of 20mm in the spinner should be adaquate.  On the p38, people often discount this plane as a non threat and relegate it to toteing bombs.  This is WRONG the 38 while being a large target is still a verry potent fighter as long as it is used to its strengths.  I actually prefer the G or the J models rarely do I use a L but to each their own. The G turns better it lacks WEP while retaining the same great guns package.  In my opinion the 38 in some respects was harder to learn to fight in than the 109 was in the aspect of ACM and evasion, however the generous ammount of ammo afforded the 38 pilot makes gunnery a little easier.

(By the way how does someone get into SAPP?)

[Xasthur]

Spits are entirely over-rated.

I started in 109s and still fly them mostly. Once you learn the ins and outs of the aircraft, it is a potent weapon.

The 109K4 provides excellent 'survivability' in the MA.

Learning to hit with the 30mm cannon will throw off your aim with other guns, though.

It takes me a while to get back into the 20mm cannons after I've become used to the 30mm

Then you have to get back into the 30mm again once used to the 20mm.... Not good when you have only 65 rounds.

When you do get good with the 30mm though, you'll be landing hits at 400 and laughing all the way home.

[Nilsen]

I fly 109s for fightersweeps, and alot of others if im "in attack mode" Choosing one plane "for good" sounds abit silly.

[Benny Moore]

Originally posted by Ack-Ack
A statement made out of complete ignorance.  Too bad Lev no longer plays, he'd probably enjoy showing you what a "granny" ride the Spitfire is.

"Granny ride" as in "even my granny can fly it" ... If you don't think that flying the Spitfire's easier than flying the other ships, then it's you who don't know your stuff.   Just because you dislike me doesn't mean that you must feel compelled to contradict me no matter what I say.  If I inform the masses that water is indeed wet, will you deny that also?

Donkey, the reason I do not recommend flying a Spitfire as all of these fellows are telling you to is that the Spitfire is so easy to fly relative to the other fighters that it will not help you learn.  The airplane does most of the work for you, thus you do not have to try different things.  When you do not exert yourself, you won't get better.  Hard training, easy war ...

[DaddyAck]

Benny,

 I don't think that people are contradicting you to be spiteful, though I could be wrong.  The way I see it with the exception of a few great sticks that just take spits and niks and la7s to a higher level, the majority of new pilots use them for the ease of use and survivability because the plane does the work for you, as you have stated.  Thus the spit is a great first ride, along with any of the "easier" planes.  That being said I have seen some of my friends both on knits and on oposing sides do amazing things with spitties, it is those that fly straight at you itching for the HO/ram (8ball did this every sortee last night in mid war) that misuse what are otherwise great aircraft.  So I would have to agree that spits are great for learning ACM, but they do have a potential of breeding bweebery as well.

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by Benny Moore
"Granny ride" as in "even my granny can fly it" ... If you don't think that flying the Spitfire's easier than flying the other ships, then it's you who don't know your stuff.   Just because you dislike me doesn't mean that you must feel compelled to contradict me no matter what I say.  If I inform the masses that water is indeed wet, will you deny that also?

I don't know where you get this "hate" thing, as you're just an anonymous person to me behind another computer screen.  

Yes, the Spitfire Mk IX and the VIII are easy to fly, that's the whole point of them being ideal for someone that is new to this game.  Donky doesn't have your vast experience in IL2 or Combat Flight Sim to lean back on.  If he wants to make the learning curve just a tad less steep and increase the enjoyment level while keeping the frustration down, the Spitfire is the best learning plane.


The point of using the Spitfire is to get used to the flight model, which is one of the main causes for new players to quit.  2nd, because the Spitfire is so forgiving, it is also ideal for the new player to learn both BFM and ACM.  Once the new player is comfortable with flying and fighting, then he should think about moving on to a more challenging plane.

You might enjoy the sink or swim method but there are far more less frustrating way to learn things.  YMMV.


ack-ack

[Ack-Ack]

Originally posted by DoNKeY
Here's my predicament, I've been flying AH2 for about two weeks now, and I have fallen in love with my new addiction.  

You should also think about getting the following books:

Figher Combat by Robert Shaw

Every Man A Tiger: Mock-Combat Flying Techniques for Light Aircraft By Frank J. O'Brien

In Pursuit: A Pilot's Guide to Online Air Combat by Johan Kylander


And if you haven't already, go to the AH Trainer's site and NetAces.org.


ack-ack

[bj229r]

What Ack-Ack said--if ya are new, and don't have much success with a harder plane, chances are ya will get a negative attitude toward the game and quit. (And without a steady supply of new guys, I will go kill-less)