Author Topic: Frustration ...need some advice..  (Read 522 times)

Offline Sincraft

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Frustration ...need some advice..
« on: July 29, 2007, 12:06:56 AM »
Well, seems like everyone I go to gun after is using rudders to the level of expert anymore.  Not many 'easy' targets out there.

Recently, I picked up these rudder pedals which I'm still trying to learn, however was wondering if there is anyone willing to give me some one on one battle advice, I'll record and learn from that at the very least.

my issue I think #1 is that I have a pretty bad packet loss on the comcast side of things, that they refuse to do anything about.  Days where it's better, I get kills MUCH faster.  When I am spraying and getting nothing, I log out and run the packet logger and sure enough, 20-40% packet drops on three different hops.

So, I guess my main question:  How are people using these rudder pedals or twisty sticks to do some of these crazy manuvers.  Whenever I have someone on my 6, I seem to die instantly, while I can chase someone and never seem to get a good aim on them although I'm keeping up with the turns with my pedals UNTIL they start doing that up, kick the tail,....down in your face manuever - whatever it's called.

Any suggestions on getting better or possible help I can get that will help me out would be great.  I'm pretty good at diving attacks, deflection attacks and udnerstanding how some don't allow you to get those types of attacks and pulling the right manuever to get the 'good' shot after that.  BUT, I am lacking in other areas heavily.

Appreciate it...thanks!

S

Offline B@tfinkV

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Frustration ...need some advice..
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2007, 12:51:49 PM »
hey sincraft, feel free to look me up in the TA and give me a shout, we can do some practice.

i think, although im not 100% this is what youre talkin about, that the moanouvers you are seeing done to you are far more aided by gravity and engine control than rudders, although i would not deny that being sloppy with your rudder skills will hurt you when you really need to fly your best.
 400 yrds on my tail, right where i want you... [/size]

Offline Spatula

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Frustration ...need some advice..
« Reply #2 on: July 29, 2007, 05:49:36 PM »
I think there's more to what you perceive as people out flying you simply due to some sort of magical rudder usage. The reality of the situation is that if are performing moves you cannot, it will have more to do with speed differentials, aircraft handling characteristics, and pilot skill in using ALL his control surfaces effectively in a deliberate and co-ordinated fashion.

The rudder controls the aircrafts yaw. It doesn't make it perform magic moves that no-one else can follow. The rudder is very useful for helping aiming your guns, correcting/catching stalls, co-ordinated turns, skidding, and can help kicking the tail over in a wing-over type move when close to a stall.

Its not just the rudder input, its the pilot who uses, and knows when to use which of all the axis of control at their disposal in the right combinations of amounts to achieve the intended maneuver. Its the pilot who knows which maneuver to fly and when. Its never as simple as just the rudder.
 
My suggestion is that if you find you are being out-maneuvered, stop and think why for second. Firstly, perhaps your aircraft's physical capabilities wont allow you to match no matter how hard you try. Secondly, speed differentials probably account for most of the ive-been-out-maneuvered situations. If your speed isn't all but identical to your opponent then your turn performance is going to be very different.

Besides, if they're pulling some crazy "up, kick the tail,....down in your face manuever" (as you put it) and its something you cant follow, take comfort from the fact that they just threw away a fistful of E, while you didnt! Advantage, you!

If you have some films, i'd gladly go over them for you if you want. Also, can you describe the "up, kick the tail,....down in your face manuever" a bit more please - sounds like a high-g nose-high reversal like a chandelle or pitchback or something. Does it lead to a HO pass?
« Last Edit: July 29, 2007, 05:52:25 PM by Spatula »
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Offline Sincraft

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Frustration ...need some advice..
« Reply #3 on: July 29, 2007, 06:14:22 PM »
Spat to answer your question, yes it does result eventually in them HO or worse, on my six.  This comes from a pretty dead sequence of chases say, me in ki84 vs them in spit16 or nik more often.

I'm furballing more.  Previously.  I would have seen that maneuver and just dove down for some E, pulled straight up with a slight twist of my rudder stick to the right while I turn about 15% right, creating a slight right hand turn while I climb away from this power move.  I eventually shadow and stalk to kill.

I've changed my ways.  I was capable of scoring between 2-4kills per death until I would decide to experiment.  Then, during experimentation phase while I'm trying to learn more knock down drag out battle manuevers, I get killed like crazy and tank my ratings.  

I know ratings dont mean much of anything but for me it was a gauge on things.  Those two behaviors during each month would result in me getting around an avg of 1.5 kpd.

Now, esp since getting these rudder pedals, I just can't seem to 'get it'...
Even the aspects of things I was good at are bad or suffering.

At any rate, I will take vids when I get a chance and have you check them out if you want...appreciate it.  Anyone that can tell me what I'm seeing and how to do it or, how I ended up on the brown end of the stick - would be helpful.

Now if I could resolve my comcast issues, I know I would have MANY more kills.  Very frustrating.

Offline Spatula

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Frustration ...need some advice..
« Reply #4 on: July 29, 2007, 06:49:15 PM »
I know when people move from twisty rudders to pedals, there is always a re-learning curve. And some find it harder to re-learn than others. I think that at least in part its a function of how many hours per week you spend flying, and how long you've been flying with a twisty. The more time at the helm, the faster you'll adjust. The re-learn curve you're on now is normal, and the difficulties you have adjusting is normal. Give it some time, and you'll be over it before you know it.

You also say you've move more in to furballing. IMO, furballing will always be a more risky game than flying more selective tactics. You cant measure your success in furballing using K/D compared to K/D achieved flying a more conservative approach - as you aren't comparing apples with apples. Furballing is inherently risky.

I'm not saying don't do it, I'm just saying you need to let go of trying to gauge your success with K/D ratios you achieved using a different tactical doctrine.

IMO, K/S and K/T are probably better indicators of furballing prowess - but thats just my opinion.
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