General Climate Discussion

[lazs2]

angus.. the ice is growing in the south.  

http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070815/EDITORIAL/108150004

there are hundreds of articles like the above on the 1934 heat.    simply do a search.

All charts that go to present tho show that we are in a cooling trend... that is why the alarmists are so desperate.   just as global warming closed the ozone hole... that they took credit for... they want to take credit for the cooling that is inevitable.

Angus.. the ocean is warming... more than air temps would allow.  it is something else.. the ice in the water is melting but the ice on land is growing (globally)

your whole take on global warming is focused on some little patch of land... what you can see.

lazs

[moot]

http://www.virginia.edu/topnews/releases2003/climate-dec-9-2003.html

[JB73]

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,303525,00.html


though it is an opinion piece, if there is truth to the judges ruling about the film thats kind of cool

[Airscrew]

Maybe Gore can redistribute the film as science fiction and then it can run on the SciFi channel double feature with "MegaVolcano"

and someone here said someting like "no one is here to make money from Global Warming/End of the World....

"An Inconvenient Truth" grossed about $50 million at the box office and millions more in DVD and book sales. Gore charges as much as $175,000 for an in-person presentation of his slide show that forms the basis for the film.

[Angus]

Ahh Lazs:
"Angus.. the ocean is warming... more than air temps would allow. it is something else.. the ice in the water is melting but the ice on land is growing (globally)"

That energy is vastly more than some degree in the atmosphere.
As for the Ice on land growing globally, - ehh, - no.
The S-Pole is tougher to measure, but since SL is rising, the outcome is rather simple. More melts from land than gets bound. After all, the N-Pole can melt without raising SL, since it's in the sea after all.
Melting ice should actually cool the sea, but it doesn't. It still keeps warming.
Maybe you will try to comprehend the vicious circle, and I am sure you will quote (correctly) that such occured before mankind.

[Jackal1]

Originally posted by Airscrew
Maybe Gore can redistribute the film as science fiction and then it can run on the SciFi channel double feature with "MegaVolcano"  

They could add Mega-Iceage, Imminent Nuclear Disaster, Mega-Asteroid and few others to have one of those weekend marathons.
It could closed with a grand showing of Chicken Little in HD.

[Louis XVII]

Quotable quotes from Lazs - all in this thread in this order

no measurable rise in global temperature in 8 years now...

The global temp will trend downward in the next few years...

We are in a warming trend...

[/b]

Well, which is it?  Is the earth warming, cooling, or staying the same? You've said all three in this thread.  

[Angus]

Lazs:
"angus.. the ice is growing in the south.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/apps...ORIAL/108150004"

Why is SL rising if atmosphere is cooling and the main earth's Icecap is growing?

Now think...













Since the N-polar area which is melting fast is already in the water it doesn't add. So either  th SL rising is due to

a) increased heat in the water which will cause it to expand
b) more melting of ice than binding
c) both

[DREDIOCK]

Originally posted by Angus
The globe has a way with stabilizing itself from a catastrophy into somewhat friendlier environment. I think that's what he means.
Nice text Drediock.

"The question. and real argument.
Should be Not whats causing it.
But how to adapt to it."

Here's the twist IMHO. Because what is causing it will eventually influence how to adapt to it.

Anyway, we can't carry on like we do for a long time, so there is already something to adapt to. Will it be fast or will it be slow?

Exactly. and thank you.

I agree. we cant keep on the way we are.
Even if it isnt the cause of GW.
The world is just a much nicer place to live without all the man made pollutants griming things up.

[Angus]

Originally posted by DREDIOCK
Exactly. and thank you.

I agree. we cant keep on the way we are.
Even if it isnt the cause of GW.
The world is just a much nicer place to live without all the man made pollutants griming things up.

High Five

[lazs2]

louie... nothing contradictory in any of those statements.    The earth goes through warm and cool trends.. if you take a median and anything above that is "warming trend" and anything below it "cooling trend" then you will see that we are (fortunately) in a warming rather than a cooling trend.

Now.. within those trends.. the temp may rise and fall... if it falls too much for instance.. it becomes an ice age... the current temp is a warming trend.. within that trend... it has not risen in the last 8 years.   the high from 34 and 98 is the high.

angus.. sooooo... we can't even measure the ice in the south and you are telling me that we are losing ice?   which is it?  I am surprised old lefty louie isn't taking you to task...

I say it is thicker...  you say it is impossible to measure but you know it isn't.

The list of scientists that jumped ship on MMGW is growing.. the list was used by our congress to defeat draconian global warming legeslation lately

http://epw.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=Minority.Blogs&ContentRecord_id=927b9303-802a-23ad-494b-dccb00b51a12

lazs

[Angus]

Lazs:
"angus.. sooooo... we can't even measure the ice in the south and you are telling me that we are losing ice? which is it? I am surprised old lefty louie isn't taking you to task..."

Why is the SL rising?

[lazs2]

so, how much has it risen?  the 20 feet that was predicted?  the sea rises and falls without any aid of melting ice all the time... the sea floor changes.. land masses sink.

Why does it have to be co2 that is making the oceans rise?  when ever has co2 made the oceans rise?   Like you I will play at this.. I say that it is very difficult to measure the global sea rise within a margin of error of an inch or so... which is what you are claiming.  

Why do all the alarmists back off from the 30' rise predicted for 2050?  cause it aint gonna happen.. not from any change in temp that is.   Where is the "worst hurricane season on record"?   where is the continued rising of global temp?  show me the data.

Where is the rise in temp?  we are 85% of the doubling of c02 this century that was supposed to make for a 5 degree increase in temp yet... it is like 1.5  plus or minus... at this rate a doubling will mean nothing and... no one says that a further doubling will cause much more greenhouse effect.. co2 can only stop certain waves and only so much... at some point more and more does less and less.

lazs

[Angus]

Sea rises and fall with the aid of the moon. You know that.
BTW, the fallbback of glaciers make landmasses RISE. Yet the SL at coasts like Greenland (who has the fastest fallout of creeping glaciers of any landmass in the world) is ....rising.
It's basically rising,,,globally.

As for the global alarmists in the 30's, well, they didn't have much data to build on. The same goes for the temperature records from the era....

As for the rise in temp, - it is both in air and water, - globally. It's manifesting itself with decreasing ice and a raise in SL while the ocean still gets warmer.

If your whisky still heats up even if you have dumped an icecube into it, just check if it's not standing on the stove....

[JB73]

I like George Carlin's comedy most of the time, but almost never agree with his politics....


in one of his bits he mentioned how he can't believe we as humans have the arrogance to think we are that significant in the grand scheme of the planet to harm it, especially to the degree some "scientists" claim.


I have to agree with that completely, especially the word "arrogance".