Reloading resources

[Modas]

Hi Guys -

I'm thinking about getting into reloading now that I have a "sport utility rifle" to try to keep the cost of feeding it down a little bit.

Does anyone here reload and could you point me in the direction for a couple of resource books that can help me get started?

If you have any recommendations for equipment, that would be helpful also.  I don't need anything really fancy.  Just a run of the mill, beginners setup would be fine.  I'd probably be loading 5.56 (.223), 30-06 and when I finally choose a pistol .40 or .45

Thankee!!

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Buy a reloading kit (Rockchucker Supreme) from RCBS. Add the RCBS die sets you require. Also, get a powder trickler. Get an extra manual, or two (I'd get a Hodgdon and a Sierra) the kit will come with an RCBS manual. The best place to buy is probably Midway. Make sure you compare prices on powder and primers, and when you do, understand they are shipped separately AND each will have a hazardous materials charge. It is often cheaper and easier to get powder and primers locally.

[lazs2]

good advice.. I have a rock chucker that is about 30 years old.. no telling how many rounds it has loaded..   I don't really have a need for a trickler.

Look at the lee stuff for dies and cheap case trimmers and primer pocket reamers and primer tools.. they are cheaper and while they look kinda mickey mouse.. they work as good or better... often better than more expensive stuff.

lazs

[Blooz]

I used to reload when I needed the accuracy for competition shooting.

My stuff was RCBS and Lee turret press/dies but I always had it in my mind to get a Dillon setup.

It's cheaper to buy and shoot surplus ammo if you're just plinking.

[FrodeMk3]

Originally posted by Blooz
I used to reload when I needed the accuracy for competition shooting.

My stuff was RCBS and Lee turret press/dies but I always had it in my mind to get a Dillon setup.

It's cheaper to buy and shoot surplus ammo if you're just plinking.

Surplus 5.56mm has been pretty hard to get-Iraq soaked up most existing stocks' of 5.56mm.

You will find that the most expensive part of shooting will be the brass, which has effected all ammo prices. China has been consuming enough to make a marked shortage, and elevation of price here.

[Maverick]

If you are going to load rifle cartridges I also recommend the RCBS Rock Chucker as it handles the force required to resize cases easily. I have a single stage RCBS with some accessories. I also use an early model Dillon progressive system. I am a fan of the Dillon equipment and their customer support.

Make sure you get a decent scale, either electronic or balance beam to measure the powder or check the powder throw of your measure / dispenser.

Look at getting a current loading manual. Do not get an older one, you want current info based on powder formulations as they are made now. Follow the manual. Do NOT assume they are low balling the loads and do not exceed them. You don't have the pressure equipment to determine safety.

[flakbait]

Starter kits aren't half bad and will usually save you a good chunk of cash. RCBS, Hornaday Lock n' Load, and Redding are the "Big Three" I know of. My personal preference is for the Redding Big Boss II. Spent primers drop through a tube in the center of the ram to a bucket or small bottle. Much less mess and easier disposal. Unfortunately they don't sell it with a starter kit; you'd have to buy it separate. MidwayUSA currently has a Big Boss single stage Pro-Pak kit for $242. It includes everything but the dies and reloading components. The Big Boss doesn't have the primer catch tube of the BBII; it uses a little plastic bucket.

I've heard the recent RCBS Rock Chucker Supreme presses have a problem with kicking spent primers all over the floor. Several customer reviews on Midway (and my neighbor) have had this happen; instead of catching the primers, they get pitched on the floor. The primer catcher is the black plastic ring around the ram in the pic. MidwayUSA has the RCBS Master Kit for $275

Hornaday's Lock n' Load is nice because you don't lose your settings when you change out dies. They snap in and out instead of screwing in, so your bullet seating and resize dies don't change depth. MidwayUSA has this one, too, but it is a tad spendy. Hornaday Lock n' Load Kit $330

Or you could go completely bonkers and pick up everything separately. Just use what comes in a large kit as a guide to buy your own choice of components. Most of the kit components aren't bad, but you'll probably find one or two little niggling things that drive you crackers. Read reviews and see what people say about prospective replacement options.

As far as reloading manuals, go one step beyond what Maverick said. Go bag a copy of ABC's of Reloading 7th Ed., then buy at least three (yes, three) different reloading manuals. ABC's will tell you everything you need to reload, and so will the manuals. Study each step carefully, then study them again. Compare the steps listed in each manual to ABC's to see if any tid-bits or tips are in one, but not the other. Also compare each manual to other manuals when looking for a good starting load. You might find one in, say, a Barnes manual that isn't listed in Nosler's. Speer, Sierra, Hornaday, Nosler, A-Square, Barnes; they all write reloading manuals, and they all have good info.

Above all be careful!



------------------------
Flakbait [Delta6]

[Leslie]

I would recommend IMR 3031 as a basic, trouble-free rifle powder, and Unique as an all purpose pistol powder.  Though it has been years since I reloaded, it is something every shooter should do so they are familiar with the process.  It is also a lot more fun if you have a solid workbench set up for it with all your equipment at hand.  Some shooters reload not only to save money, but to increase accuracy over that of factory loads.

I start out with minimum loads and load one box.  I keep a record book describing powder type, primers, bullet weight in grains, powder weight in grains, case manufacturer.  Then I go to the range and try them out.  I record the results on my targets and save them.  Then I try increasing the powder to a medium load and go to the range again.  Eventually I will have a reload that works for me.  Often, that load will be somewhere between medium and maximum loads.

Here's a list of reloading equipment which I acquired over time.

1.  Lee press
2.  RCBS dies
3.  Lyman scales
4.  Lyman case trimmer
5.  Midway loading blocks
6.  Midway calipers
7.  RCBS case lube pad
8.  Neck and case resizing gauge (not a necessity but good to have)
9.  Assorted small funnels
10.  Powder trickler for more accurate reloading
11.  Pre-measured assorted scoops for faster and not-as-accurate reloading
12.  Thumler's tumbler for polishing brass cases (I have used regular white rice as a polishing medium)
 

For black powder:

1.  Lee lead smelter (good for making fishing weights too)
2.  Lee dipper
3.  Lee bullet molds for the 50 - 70 Sharps and the .58 Enfield
4.  Liquid Alox bullet lube
5.  Wheel weights for smokeless lead bullets - plumber's lead for black powder REAL bullets

For reloading, I buy factory ammo and save the cases after I use them.  It is good practice to store the fired cases in the original box, and then write the date you reload them on the box.  I try to keep the original cases with their original box, i.e. I do not mix them up with brass cases from other boxes. Rifle cases are usually good for about 3 to 4  reloadings before they should be discarded.  The way to tell they are ready to discard is a shiney band will appear about a quarter inch up from the case head indicating a thin area in the case.  When I see this on one case from a particular box, all the cases belonging to that box are discarded.  

Pistol cases may last longer due to lower pressures.  I ruined a nice Walther P38 one time by hot loading Blue Dot powder.  This blew the extractor off, and though I had it repaired, it just never felt the same again.  Unique is a more forgiving powder than Blue Dot for pistol case reloading.  Blue Dot is hot powder requiring careful measurement, so be advised.  Do not use large grainy powder in revolvers.  It doesn't burn completely and the unburnt grains will tend to cause jams.

Loading blocks are useful both as a stable location for your upright cases, and as a precaution against double loading a case.  Never reload if you are feeling tired or distracted.

One thing I never understood or learned how to do was the use of gas checks, and so I never used them.  I believe they are used for reloading lead high-powered rifle bullets.

Have fun and be safe!



Les

[lazs2]

you can buy MTM plastic ammo boxes in 50 and 100 round and they last for decades and cost about a buck.. no more paper boxes opening up in the shooting bag.   label em on the outside.. I even date the reloads.

My rock chucker is the old one with the plastic bike grip.. it has a tray that is junk that catches spent primers and it mostly does but they are all over.   I have a whole bedroom that is a reload room.   I prime seperately and use either the lee primer tool or a new rcbs one that has a universal head and uses primer strips (you have to load the strips with a tool)

I buy powder in 8 lb cans and primers by the 5000 to save on the haz fee.

use mostly federal primers..  use 4895 powder for rifle and for handgun... WW296 and AA#5 and some blue dot and a little 2400.

Brass is the most expensive component.   I use starline now for my 44 mag..  bout 2500 cases.. 44 mag brass lasts almost forever.. 45..  I have 14,000 once fired cases but 45 brass is fragile.  still..  I have a lifetime supply.

rock chucker works great.. 44 brass is a bear to resize and after about 300 cases you feel like you worked out.   all the other operations take little effort.

I tumble all the brass after it has been fired.   use a "turbo tumbler" and then a seperrator.     I do one opperation at a time mostly... say...  size 300 cases.. then come back and expand and deprime the same 300 and then prime em.. I like to have a lot of primed brass on hand in case I get the urge to try some load or another.

Beware.. the worst part is that everyone wants you to reload for them.

I don't mind much tho.   I get them to buy components and then load for myself too out of the batch.   It is nice to be able to go to the range or out in the country and have a couple hundred rounds in a couple 3 calibers to shoot and be generous to others and let them shoot as much of your ammo as they like.

I like lead slugs for most handgun stuff.  Used to cast but it was not worth my time..  Might have to go back to it.    

Figure a box of 44 mags cost about $25 these days.. it costs me about $5 or less.   I load for 223 and ought six these days and 8mm too  surplus stuff is drying up and getting expensive and is mostly corrosive and non reloadable.

lazs

[Captain Virgil Hilts]

Cabela's has the RockChucker Supreme kit for $269.99, but it does not have a powder trickler, nor a dial caliper. Honestly, I'm happier with the RCBS dies and shell holders, but that may just be my personal preference.

If you have a semi auto rifle (or a lever action), you'll have to have small base dies and you'll have to full length resize the brass, or you'll have all sorts of function problems. Bolt guns are a little different, if you reload for just one bolt gun, you can save the brass from being over worked by just neck sizing.

I have a Lyman case trimmer, it's sort of like a miniature lathe. You'll find as you continually work the cases, they'll grow in length slightly. Especially if they have cannelures.

[Leslie]

"If you have a semi auto rifle (or a lever action), you'll have to have small base dies and you'll have to full length resize the brass, or you'll have all sorts of function problems. Bolt guns are a little different, if you reload for just one bolt gun, you can save the brass from being over worked by just neck sizing."



............................. ............................. ............................. ....

That's a good point.  I had that happen with the .243 BLR.   I loaded up 40 rounds (without testing them to see if they would chamber) and none of them would chamber all the way.  They worked fine in a bolt action rifle.  I think I used small base dies, but I probably didn't trim the cases enough, if at all.  Either that, or the dies weren't reshaping the case properly.  Seems like I set them far as they would go without crumpling the case.  Can't remember.  But they were problematical for the lever action.  Would very likely be the same for a semi-auto.




Les

[lazs2]

dies..   get carbide size dies for all your handgun and straight walled stuff...  don't even mess with lubing the cases.

A digital dial caliper costs a whole 20 bucks these days and works great..  the

I have trimmers that cost up to 300 bucks and none of em work as good as the $20 lee zip trim..  not faster or better.   The lee primer tools are cheap and work good till they wear out.. buy three of four of em and set em up for both large and small primers..  you can even have one set up for each caliber they are so cheap.   like $9 each or something.

I full length resize all my brass.. rifle and handgun.  I don't benchrest shoot rifles in competition or anything like that..  I want every rifle round I load to fit into any rifle chambered for it that I run across.

Hard cast slugs in 44 and 45 I buy by the thousand or more..  the break on shipping is 63 lbs.  

If you can try some loads from friends or use some of their powder to find a load you like.. do it..  then.. buy 8 lbs of that powder and 5000 primers.

you will need a case tumbler sooner or later... just get it now..  get the seperator thing too.

lazs

[Modas]

Wow, thanks for all the help guys -

I spent several hours on Midway yesterday looking at components and I'm not familiar with the "small base dies"

I spec'd out this die set from Midway...

 440502 RCBS 2-Die Set 223 Reminton

If I'm understanding, this set would be used to resize the brass and seat the bullet.  Am I correct?

I am firing a semi-auto, so, looking at Midway, I found this...

Small base Die

So, it sounds like I would use the small base die for resizing, then would need another die to place the bullet into the case.  Is this correct?

Again, thanks for the help.  It looks like I've got more research to do...

Joe

[lazs2]

The two die set shown is what you need to reload and is complete except for the shellholder.

I have never used small base dies and I reload for my garand and my mini 14.   My dies are old tho and things may have changed.   I find that my standard die sets size ammo down to a smidge less than factory... if my ammo won't fit into a chamber then factory ammo won't either.

I realize that ruger and military arms often have fairly loose chambers.   Maybe your m16 clone has a tight one.

I would buy the standard set and see how it goes.   You can always buy the small base thingie later.  

lazs