The cell phone tax shell game

[Sundowner]

And now for the latest from the "We're from the government..we're here to help" department.

Regards,
Sun


"The U.S. Supreme Court has declined to weigh a dispute that could affect how taxes show up on Americans' cell phone bills, dealing a setback to wireless companies.

The case at hand, which pitted Sprint Nextel and T-Mobile USA against state utility regulators, centers on whether states should be allowed to forbid wireless carriers from breaking out various state and local taxes as line-item fees on a customer's bill.

Sounds like a simple enough matter, but it has actually stirred up quite a fuss.

The wireless companies, naturally, maintain they should be able to establish a visible separation between the base prices of their services and the fees required by various regulators. States and localities have increasingly been passing laws prohibiting those line items expressly in order to "hide" arguably unpopular taxes and fees from consumers, Sprint Nextel and T-Mobile said in their brief to the high court....."

http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9855401-7.html?tag=nefd.top

[lazs2]

but but.. surely you don't mind paying a "few cents" on your bill every month to make sure that poor negro children in harlem have internet service do you?    and... without big government and all the taxes you wouldn't have the nice roads to drive on right?

Can't blame the companies.. they charge what they charge.. make people see exactly how much the nanny state is costing them..  why let em hide and make the companies the bad guys?


lazs

[acfireguy26]

Originally posted by lazs2
but but.. surely you don't mind paying a "few cents" on your bill every month to make sure that poor negro children in harlem have internet service do you?    and... without big government and all the taxes you wouldn't have the nice roads to drive on right?

Can't blame the companies.. they charge what they charge.. make people see exactly how much the nanny state is costing them..  why let em hide and make the companies the bad guys?


lazs

Dont forget the ILLEGALS healthcare.

[Mickey1992]

I think you are missing the point.  The cellphone companies are trying to fool consumers into thinking that corporate taxes are actually use taxes by itemizing them on the cellphone bill.

When you go to a restaurant you don't see....
Total Bill + Sales Tax + Corporate Tax = Final bill.  

But that is what the cellphone companies want to do.

"But state utility regulators have countered that the wireless companies are missing the point: The fees and taxes they impose are generally meant to fall on the wireless carriers themselves, not on consumers. Wireless companies should simply raise their rates to reflect that distinction, they argue.

An example of one such law, according to the court filings, is in Indiana, which imposes a tax on the "gross receipts" of corporations in the state. Indiana passed a law insisting that wireless carriers not pass on the tax to their customers as line-item fees. They are, however, allowed to raise their base rates accordingly. "

[APDrone]

Originally posted by Mickey1992
I think you are missing the point.  The cellphone companies are trying to fool consumers into thinking that corporate taxes are actually use taxes by itemizing them on the cellphone bill.

When you go to a restaurant you don't see....
Total Bill + Sales Tax + Corporate Tax = Final bill.  

But that is what the cellphone companies want to do.

"But state utility regulators have countered that the wireless companies are missing the point: The fees and taxes they impose are generally meant to fall on the wireless carriers themselves, not on consumers. Wireless companies should simply raise their rates to reflect that distinction, they argue.

An example of one such law, according to the court filings, is in Indiana, which imposes a tax on the "gross receipts" of corporations in the state. Indiana passed a law insisting that wireless carriers not pass on the tax to their customers as line-item fees. They are, however, allowed to raise their base rates accordingly. "

Ok, this is a prime example how the whole concept of taxing business is only taxing the consumer.

Plain and simple.. businesses don't pay taxes.  Businesses get their revenue from customers.  Those customers are paying the taxes.

The states and the feds don't want you to know how much you're paying in taxes, because if people started understanding how much we're paying in taxes, they'd begin to realize that we are slowing becoming the socialist state we thought we won the cold war against.

Socialism is, essentially, 100% taxation.

We keep getting closer.

[Maverick]

Got to agree with Drone there. If the company is being taxed they WILL pass it on to the customer. The company is in business to make money, period, not to save the customer from fees or cover up hidden taxes.

[Mickey1992]

I agree.  But the phone companies should not be able to advertise a product at a certain price, and then after the fact tack on a "government tax", when in fact this tax is really just a corporate tax that every company pays.

[APDrone]

Originally posted by Mickey1992
I agree.  But the phone companies should not be able to advertise a product at a certain price, and then after the fact tack on a "government tax", when in fact this tax is really just a corporate tax that every company pays.

Let me see if I understand your point.

Say.. you're shopping for a cell phone service.

After you sort through all the differences in minutes, texting charges, prime time..etc, you equate them to the following:


Company A advertises $30/month
Combany B advertises $31/month

You decide to go with company A because it is cheaper.

You get your bill and it's $37/month  because of the taxes and fees assesed on your account.. which differ from state to state..and, I would guess, even subject to additional local taxes.

Had you gone with the competitor, you would have gotten a bill for $38/month ( or more, since their base charge was higher ).

So, is the concern that you can afford $30/month but not $37/month?

[john9001]

sounds like taxation without indication.

[APDrone]

Originally posted by john9001
sounds like taxation without indication.

I dunno.. I perused some of the cell companies sites, ( Verizon and ATT ) and they do have information pertaining to taxes, fees, and other charges that may vary by location.  

Granted, they may not be as visible as they could be ( an * on the advertised rate indicating a footnote to other fee detail would be appropriate ), but they are mentioned.  

But, then, the hotel industry does the same thing with their advertised room rate and what you end up paying at checkout..

And wait until you buy a house.. OMG...

[Mr No Name]

I would love to see all taxes itemized on bills... especially at the gas pump, imagine looking at every receipt you get and seeing the gross amount of taxes you are paying every day???

[TalonX]

They should display the taxes for the product or service they are selling.   There is no need to break out some percentage as corporate tax.  This is a cost of business and is covered as overhead in the cost of the product or service.

When I go to a restaurant, I see the food bill plus the tax on the food.   That's the right thing to do.   I don't expect to, nor do I even care, what taxes the restaurant pays as overhead.

[Sundowner]

Originally posted by Mr No Name
I would love to see all taxes itemized on bills... especially at the gas pump, imagine looking at every receipt you get and seeing the gross amount of taxes you are paying every day???

In my home state federal and state taxes per gallon of gas are listed right on the pump.

Regards,
Sun

[Mr No Name]

That's an excellent idea but can you imagine if on your credit card receipt when you pay at the pump if it gave you the totals for taxes that you paid... without having to do the math - sure it isnt rocket science - but - imagine the responses you'd hear if it was in black and white on every purchase you make?

I think it is as important to list as cholesterol or saturated fats on food!