How about this??

[XAKL]

AvA for years has been trying to find its own identity apart from MA.  Well how about this?  Lets make AvA as real as possible.  None of this radar maps, one has to really visualize to identify target.  Maybe putting a small window at the bottom showing a siloutte of a plane to suggest what the contact is.  Minimizing engine use.  I'm running 100% of my engine and there is no engine damage.  Get rid of the ammo counter.  Wait, I think it already exists, IL-2, but I want it in Aces High!!

MUGADAI of the MUNGADAI WARRIORS

[NoBaddy]

Just curious...

Do you realize that while realistic might be very near real, it's not necessarily near fun?

[republic]

Originally posted by XAKL
None of this radar maps, one has to really visualize to identify target.  

Mugadies has a good idea.  The rest would take game code changes but I'd be happy to fly in a radarless iconless setup.

Lets get it on.

[Larry]

Most of what he said would mean coading from HTC. I dont think they are going to spead time on the AvA.

[Easyscor]

Originally posted by republic
Mugadies has a good idea.  The rest would take game code changes but I'd be happy to fly in a radarless iconless setup.

Lets get it on.

No radar? Or no GPS clipboard map? That ok for special events, and both can be done, but that's no good for the AvA IMHO. Finding a fight quickly is what's important in the AvA arena.

As for no icons over the planes, well, I hate chasing dots only to find out they're friendly, I sure don't want to wait until I'm d300 to tell the difference between a 109 or p51. The whines about this would be far, far worse then the either of those about night or the bombsight.

[WildeSau]

why not just turn off enemy icon. ( that's something you can do yourself or maybe it could be disable so everyone would have the same playing field ) and keep friendly icon. i think that might add some more challenge to the AVA .

[republic]

Originally posted by Easyscor
No radar? Or no GPS clipboard map? That ok for special events, and both can be done, but that's no good for the AvA IMHO. Finding a fight quickly is what's important in the AvA arena.

As for no icons over the planes, well, I hate chasing dots only to find out they're friendly, I sure don't want to wait until I'm d300 to tell the difference between a 109 or p51. The whines about this would be far, far worse then the either of those about night or the bombsight.

With a very small map, as in the first week of the War, it would be fine.  I think it would be awesome, it would really increase the amount of teamwork.  You'd have real spotters and a real need to work together.  It would be handy to see the effect of the different camo skins.  I'm all for this, I think it would be great to try for a few days.

Something I noticed.  The "no enemy radar" never really had an impact on the Axis during the war, though we did notice it had a significant impact on the allied  war effort.  It's interesting to see how one side relied heavily on radar while the other was relatively unaffected.

[bkwolf]

Originally posted by WildeSau
why not just turn off enemy icon. ( that's something you can do yourself or maybe it could be disable so everyone would have the same playing field ) and keep friendly icon. i think that might add some more challenge to the AVA .

Thats what I do,with icons on(enemy)I tend to shoot at the neon sign..not the plane:D

[Gunter Van Ulm]

While the overwhelming majority of players HATE the "no icon" settings, I personally love them.  It adds so much more to the experience NOT knowing what plane type, or HOW much E they have, and it is FAR easier to bounce and be bounced!  

It took some adjusting at first, but I eventually got used to, and learned to love an iconless environment, and flew in it pretty much exclusively.  Even a limited icon environment (D300) is more fun for me.

Unlike the main arena's, it is pretty easy to ID AC in a fixed planeset without the neon.  The shape and colors start to imprint themselves and you can tell many AC apart from a surprising distance, even with ye olde 17 inch monitor.

Sadly, the demand for such an environment is too low for it ever to be implemented imo.  The AvA has a small audience as is, and reducing the "gameyness" further would create shrinkage, and reduce the likelyhood of hooking new flyers to the over all concept.  

A good compromise would be removal of the distance marker, and replace it with plane type, or just simply "enemy".

I have yet to do it, but I would like to try running some missions using NO icons, and NO onboard maps.  AH has enough land marks that it is feasible to use printed maps for navigational purposes to complete a mission, rather than a GPS.  That would be pretty tricky for both buffs and escorts, especially when the fighting starts.

Alas, we have what we have...

[heythere]

the AvA comes about as close to getting consistently good fights as you will find in the whole of AHdom.  most of the players are a cut above what you will find in the MAs.

by their own admission the current crop of allied players are all MA'rs here for a scratch and sniff. they bring to arena their country cousin ways with them.  we will need to bathe and dress them and to teach them proper manners.  it won't be a pretty or easy job but it must be done.  in time they may well stack up and give as good as they get but only time will tell.

I am glad they are here and I hope they will stay.

[dedalos]

Originally posted by Easyscor
No radar? Or no GPS clipboard map? That ok for special events, and both can be done, but that's no good for the AvA IMHO. Finding a fight quickly is what's important in the AvA arena.
 

Was important you mean.  The war is now important and the changes he is sudgesting are perfect for war.  No radar other than bases flashing and no icons (including) range for the enemy aircraft would be perfect for a war scenario and hopefully it will eliminate any wasted resources that just fly around fighting.

Who knows, maybe the place wil be empty after a few days and it will go back to what it was, or it will fill up with 100s of people that are seeking realism.  I would only make one more suggestion in order to add more realism.  Make the bases 1000 miles apart so people can enjoy the flight to and from the buildings

[Easyscor]

You had me going there for a minute.

[dedalos]

Originally posted by Easyscor

You had me going there for a minute.

Hehe, it was not all sarcasm.  The AvA is not about the fight anymore.  However, if war and realism is what people want then no icons and no dar is what would be more real (I would increase the area that causes a base to blink though).  its a small plane set anyway so it would be relatively easy to tell what plane you are dealing with.

It will either fill up with people since everyone claims they want more realism or go empty and prove that they are just full of it.  My guess is, it will attract more people.  It will make hiding and attacking undefended bases easier but it will also increase the amount of planing an organized side would have to make to successfully defend, capture, and retain territory.

I probably wont try it since I am one of those dweebs that destroy game play by looking for planes to shoot at,  but its a good idea if you are into the avoid a fight at all costs thingie.

[Stampf]

Ded,

You are wrong in your assumptions man.  You are missing some good fights, and sometimes these "objectives" are at the root and create some great fights.  True, not co-alt, small numbered, prearranged duels, like you enjoy, but your blanket assumptions are off the mark.  The arena would benefit from your experience, but whatever...

No one I see or fly with is avoiding the fight.  Sure, off hours, the toolshedding goes on like all the arena's, but peak hours have been a slugfest.

[EagleEyes]

I agree Stampf...

last week during the war, Us Tomcatters did a P-51D fighter sweep over one of your guys' bases.  We were around 22k and found nothing, so we headed east and within 5 min of taking that heading we ran into a swarm of 190/109s at about the same alt.  Was a heck of a furball 25ish P-51Ds fighting roughly the same number of 190/109s.  Was by far the most fun ive ever had in AH period.  If my memory serves me correctly, we only lost 2 or 3 guys but shot down every single 109/190.  When we RTBed, those that still had ammo and fuel left jumped a 110 mission that was attack our base.  Some of our guys, myself included landed around 5+ kills.  


If your looking for pulse pounding, historical fights, AvA is the place for you!!