Author Topic: Change Ta152 fuel drain wish  (Read 749 times)

Offline moot

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Re: Change Ta152 fuel drain wish
« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2008, 01:10:19 AM »
So an extra 106 lbs (6% of the max internal fuel load) added to the starboard wing is going to change the handling, improve roll, and keep me from ripping the wings off?

I'm not at all opposed to the ability to pick and choose tanks and fuel loads in each, but it's hard to believe this is going to have a noticeable impact on the 152's performance. If it would, couldn't a few simple tests (leaving ~3/8ths in the starboard tank, then emptying the tank) prove this? Controlled sort of test like Widewing or Mosq or whomever used to- check roll rate, climb, turning radius, all that?
Yeah, it's what.. 10,000 lbs on fumes? :) 100lbs is 1% of the plane's mass.  I've never had any trouble with it, but I guess it might be noticeable in very slow acm, like at the top of a straight vertical rope.  
My only objection is to having anything preceding the AFT tank in the burn order, and the AFT tank not being last in the fill order.  The fuel tank opposite the MW50 tank could be last in the fuel burn order, or made to burn down to 18gal and then switch to fwd, if FWD is second-last to that tank in the burn order. But other than that there's no improvements to be made.  

I just made a rough test of the fuel weight in the 152, and it's ~17gal for 100lbs, or ~3.88 lbs/gal.  So that'd be 100 lbs ~2.75m from the centerline to counter-balance the MW50 tank.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2008, 01:25:32 AM by moot »
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Offline moot

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Re: Change Ta152 fuel drain wish
« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2008, 01:24:54 AM »
Moot, you're making a lot of absolute statements about YOUR OPINION and not overall fact. At least I understand that others might not fly the way I do.
None of the things I said aren't very easily measurable.. It's not subjective at all to say that no one needs to pull 8G's (or whatever the wet wings' limit is) in the 152, routinely..  It's not hard to show that you have a lot more to lose from having less fuel in the wings so that you can pull some crazy Gs without braking the wings, at the expense of fuel in the aft tank which thoroughly destabilizes the plane, than it is to just take it easy (and I don't mean fly like a granny either) with the Gs and drain the aft tank.
It's not subjective to say that in most situations, the 152 has more to gain from one than the other.

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Oh, and the "prove it" is a BS argument. On one hand you have a 70L tank that never drains, and no counter balance on the other wing. On the other hand you have a 70L tank that never drains, and an equal but opposite aux tank in the other wing. Common logic says the one that is balanced brings more benefit.
It's not a BS argument.  It's a valid question.  Prove your case...  I didn't say you were wrong to suggest that particular point, I said "prove it".  Let's see some numbers, not just argument by principle.  One's a quality, the other's quantity.
+-100lbs 2.75m from the centerline of a 10klbs airplane.  Show us the magnitude of the flaw you're asking to be fixed.

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No matter what your OPINION of the effects, there is an effect modeled. One is balanced. One unbalanced. Simple physics. The balanced one is going to stall more evenly (in my opinion) because the left wing, which stalls first, isn't going to be significantly heavier than the right wing, which stalls last. [EDIT: Note that even if a minor change in handling, you cannot deny that a balanced plane will stall better than an unbalanced one. Try stall fighting a f4u1 with a full left tank and empty right tank, and you tell me if the stall is better or worse)
Yeah and the part of your proposal that's unbalanced is the one that says we'd have a net benefit from not emptying the AFT tank first (etc, it's the fourth or fifth time I write it).  The only valid point you have wrt fill/drain order is that small 18gal volume on the right side.  Everything else is just fine as is.
And like I said via PM, the F4U is not a 152.   Why don't you, yourself, go flog the 152 with no fuel in the wings and come back here to write it's unstable.  That's one thing I can post film of, if needed.

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P.P.S. You want the H-0 so HTC removes the weight of the GM1 in the tail. Rather hypocritical for you to go on and on about me wanting to balance out the MW50 in the wing, eh?
Umm No... One is a pretty sizable difference, the other is very minor and won't be noticed by more than a handful of players.  Don't call me a hypocrit again.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2008, 01:35:55 AM by moot »
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