Visual sighting system needed for fleet guns

[flakbait]

I can whack a hangar at 30,000 yards, yet I can't get any RBI (range-bearing info) for a visual target? Accurate range-finders, simple calculators for gun elevation, or even gun-laying radar were available during the war. To me, this makes no sense. I can (and have) hit something the size of an ack gun at a distance of 18 miles, but I need a spotter plane for visual shooting? Some sort of visual aid should be available. Sorta like the Panzer's sight inplace of that black "+".


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Flakbait
Delta 6's Flight School
"For yay did the sky darken, and split open and spew forth fire, and
through the smoke rode the Four Wurgers of the Apocalypse.
And on their canopies was tattooed the number of the Beast, and the
number was 190." Jedi, Verse Five, Capter Two, The Book of Dweeb
 

[TheWobble]

i thinke we need a way to select a spot on the map and it shows bearing and range, them guns will shoot around 35k+ ya need something more than sight to hit from that distance.

[Fatty]

Um there is that already Wobble.

[54Ed]

We don't need some kind of magic map sighting system.  But I agree with flak, we need an improved optical gunsight system for the ships.  We also need some kind of radar readout that gives an approximate range-to-target readout for fleet engagements.  Not accurate enough for first-round hits, but accurate enough to get you in the neighborhood for bracketing.

Another thing we really need are friendly icons for the ships.  I watched two friendly fleets pass by each other today ... Gunners from both fleets were pounding away at each other, ignoring radio messages to stop firing.  Eventually killshooter sunk one of the fleets.  That's pretty silly and unrealistic.

[TheWobble]

the map sighting isnt really worth a toejam because even when ya zoom in you cant see where the target really is all ya can do is aim at its icon. but thats a big icon to aim at, it covers more than just the field area. firing past 17k is still almost worthless.  plus fleets have no icons and the grid system is to big for a spotter to tell ya where to aim. even if you know grid they are in you could shoot forever and never hit them because the grids are so big.

[Mickey1992]

I agree that the 8" guns are about useless.  Flakbait's picture of the lack of dispersion proves this point.

And why is it that a missed round that hits water will product a plume 10 stories high, but a missed round that hits land produces a puff of smoke?

   

And notice the level of the shore line?  If my round was anywhere near the target, I would not be able to see this puff of dirt at all because of the angle.

[This message has been edited by Mickey1992 (edited 01-03-2001).]

[Eagler]

what about a shell view? Like the missle view they have on the jet sims. You can ride the shell all the way in til it hits...

jj  

Eagler

[funked]

The map sighting is great for stationary targets, but we need something else for ship-to-ship fighting.

Don't underestimate the map sighting though.  The other night Beefcake and I decided to bombard a field from about 35k.  We killed an ammo dump, a fuel tank, a bomber hangar, and the RADAR in a few minutes.

[SKurj]

I shelled 2 fields for about 45 mins and a city last night... errmm I tried to anyways, not one hit!  I clicked on map matched the numbers ... Was firing from 25-30k
Should be a little easier I would think... (not much tho)

AKskurj

[bowser]

funked,

How are you guys determining what damage your shelling is doing?

bowser

[TheWobble]

I fired from 12k  with the 5's for about 15 min, thats alot of shells what i got for my effot was 2 dead gun emplacements and a dead ammo,  BTW under 12k and the 5's are better than the 8"s for shooting fileds.  but keep the 8"s for shooting ships.

[flakbait]

Photo taken at max zoom from a Typhoon's cockpit. Shell craters are from 8" guns, 17,800 yards away. Two salvoes fired. Me thinks a tad of dispersion would help here. As a reference, 16" guns have a dispersion average of 450 yards at 26,000 yards. These craters are about 10 feet apart, with the two groups of craters about 40 yards apart.

     


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Flakbait
Delta 6's Flight School
"With all due respect Chaplian, I don't think God wants to hear from me right now.
I'm gonna go out there and remove one of His creations from this universe.
And when I get back I'm gonna drink a bottle of Scotch like it was Chiggy von Richthofen's blood and celebrate his death."
Col. McQueen, Space: Above and Beyond
     

[CavemanJ]

I tried shelling a base from about 26k, complete with a spotter, and he couldna see the shells landing anywhere.  All I could assume was 1) I was way off with the initial map ranging; or 2) the shells weren't making it to the target at 26k, because 12 is miles is about 20.9k (and the 8" gun only has a range of about 12miles correct?  (if not, direguard #2))  I fired on this base for about 45minutes.

Mickey I've fired on a base in a situation similar to that.  It was below a ridgeline between me and the base, and I couldna tell where I was hitting.

So far as I'm concerned the 8" guns are a bust and ain't no fun to play with.  The 5" would be as bad except for the AA shells, which are a helluva lot of fun when you've got waves of TBMs and PT boats streaming into the fleet.

[TheWobble]

Here is a little tip/secret for the 5"

when firing at a surface vessle or base (under 15k) switch between the AA and HE after each shot, they both do damage to ground objects and it will double your rate of fire.

[Regurge]

Funny, I have exactly the opposite experience as funked. I have lobbed dozens of shells at nme fields from 15-25k and got nadda. Very rarely i would hit a fuel tank or ammo bunker, but it was hardly worth the time spent (10-20 min). The only way i can hit anything reliably is to close to 10k or less and spot my own rounds. And if the field is elevated, I cant hit a dam thing even from 5k, cuz i cant see where my shots fall.

But just the other night, me and a couple squaddies on RW started shelling a nme cv at about 20k. By 16k we had it bracketed pretty tight and i dealt the killing blow at 15.8k (and blew up the poor guy trying to take-off   ) But most of the time dont start getting hits till about 12k or less

I can get a pretty good initial range estimate to a cv by clicking on the point on the map where the nme fighters seem to be spawning.

CJ, the 8" guns are definitely not a bust IMO. I have sunk at least 3 cvs (where I got the kill message) with them and helped sink several others (was getting hits but didnt get the kill msg). I'm much more effective with those guns than with a TBM or jabo. Having alot of panzer experience helps though.

I dont see a problem with the naval gun sight. Its basically a digital verion of the panzer sight. The panzer sight does has better visual reference (i.e. hash marks left and right of the range lines) for holding a constant lead though.

bowser, a host message tells you when you've destroyed a structure or ship

[This message has been edited by Regurge (edited 12-30-2000).]