Author Topic: Killshooter: An idea that is outdated. (Read 553 times)

skernsk · « **Reply #30 on:** January 03, 2002, 08:07:00 AM »

Welll if not for killshooter lately I can think of more than one case where a friendly (NEW PLAYER) saddled up on me and proceeded to shoot me down.

It gave me a chuckle to watch the poor bastards wing come off and spin in....but if there was no killshooter I would have been the victim....and could have potentially lost 200 perk points.

Fatty · « **Reply #31 on:** January 03, 2002, 11:02:00 AM »

Not at all true Vortex, or just not what you want to hear?

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Insofar as the FE goes, you're dead wrong I'm afraid. The focal point is the server, THAT'S where the planes exist in the virtual sense. There's 1001 ways data can be lost, corrupted, delayed etc in relaying that info back to your FE.

This is simply not the case. You can continue to argue as if it were, but it's not. (I'm sure there are tons of cases of people shooting down enemies when they've merely shot bullets into clear blue sky :rolleyes

Warps are going to happen, but anecdotal and hypothetical whatifs or it happened onces are no reason to trash a very good working system and put something in that could account for every crappy connection someone can come up with.

Of course maintaining the status quo adds nothing (there's a profound observation), but more to the point it doesn't take anything away.

popeye · « **Reply #32 on:** January 03, 2002, 01:00:00 PM »

With the huge gang bangs that are now common place in the MA, I think we need a severe penalty for shooting a friendly. Otherwise, everyone in the conga line will be blasting away. I vote to keep Killshooter as it is.

Don · « **Reply #33 on:** January 04, 2002, 02:38:00 PM »

>>The shooter is always at fault. There is not a single instance of killshooter failure listed here that the shooter could not have avoided by paying attention to his surroundings.<<

Moose Cookies!!!

But in the absence of anything else then just leave KS as it is.
To make a statment such as the above is pure crap IMO, especially if you aren't the one in the situation. Even though you are unable to envision this happening to others, I assure you it can and does. Imagine if you will, being locked on at 300 to 400 feet and firing away. It is a sure kill and you are NOT going to (or shouldnt) stop shooting so you can check your 6 for friendlies diving in front of you.Then, some dweeb drops down from 5k above you, knowing the other guy is closer,with the intent of getting the kill on the guy you are saddled up on. It happens a lot, it sucks and shouldn't happen at all. I submit to those who it hasn't happened to, that it may happen one day, or it probably will.

Fatty · « **Reply #34 on:** January 04, 2002, 02:50:00 PM »

It's happened to most of us, Don. The difference being most of our reactions are, "Man, I should have been paying attention, what an idiot I am."

AKSWulfe · « **Reply #35 on:** January 04, 2002, 03:02:00 PM »

Don, using your example:

You are 300 or 400 feet or yards from a target and firing at him. There is a con 5K above you. The friendly dives down with the intent of stealing your kill.

The time it takes for him to get between you and the enemy, you should of already killed the enemy.

The speed he is going to close 5K in a few seconds means he won't have a shot anyway, and I dunno how you managed to just accidently shoot him.

Either way, killshooter is as good as it gets right now.

Fatty spelled it out perfectly.
-SW

Blue Mako · « **Reply #36 on:** January 06, 2002, 05:09:00 PM »

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Originally posted by Don:
Imagine if you will, being locked on at 300 to 400 feet and firing away. It is a sure kill and you are NOT going to (or shouldnt) stop shooting so you can check your 6 for friendlies diving in front of you.Then, some dweeb drops down from 5k above you, knowing the other guy is closer,with the intent of getting the kill on the guy you are saddled up on.

Imagine, if you will, that that dweeb 5k above you is an enemy rather than a friendly. You would still be dead. Why? Because you didn't check your six because you were target fixated. You should never be so intent on getting a kill that you lose track of what is going on around you. When you do, whose fault is it?

-ammo- · « **Reply #37 on:** January 06, 2002, 09:05:00 PM »

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Originally posted by skernsk:
Welll if not for killshooter lately I can think of more than one case where a friendly (NEW PLAYER) saddled up on me and proceeded to shoot me down.

It gave me a chuckle to watch the poor bastards wing come off and spin in....but if there was no killshooter I would have been the victim....and could have potentially lost 200 perk points.

LOL so true. Over the time I have flown WB's and nmow AH, I have had several new players fly up behind me spraying like mad. And on the runway too. Seen GV shooting at their own teammates in AC rolling down the runway.

Killshooter is a neccessity, not a drawback or flaw'ed tool. I have died to it only 2 time in AH that I can remember. One of those times were recently when I was all over this con and to my surprise :rollseyes: our little one on one had drew the attention of many other teammates.

Tilt · « **Reply #38 on:** January 07, 2002, 04:00:00 AM »

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Originally posted by vega:
[QB]We all know the reason that HiTech put killshooter [QB]

I can see the arguements for and against the killshooter.

I dont know that kill stealing is such a problem, but certainly firing thru a freindly should be discouraged IMHO.

Alas I have also fallen foul of Kill shooter as a faster "freindly" flies thru my aircraft from some rear quarter and into my bullet stream.

I would prefer a wave file (like "check 6") linked to hits on freindlies that runs instead of your AC taking damage.

If it could be made to run when your bullet stream is even only in the locality of a freindly then it would be even more helpful.

So what would we like this file to say??

Tilt

Shane · « **Reply #39 on:** January 07, 2002, 07:52:00 AM »

FWIW, i think killshooter should affect *both* the shooter and the shootee.

K West · « **Reply #40 on:** January 07, 2002, 07:59:00 AM »

What was the real life penalty for shooting down a friendly or ally?

Model THAT first, then change or turn off kill shooter.

Westy

Shane · « **Reply #41 on:** January 07, 2002, 08:21:00 AM »

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Originally posted by Tilt:

So what would we like this file to say??

Tilt

TARD ALERT! TARD ALERT!

Tac · « **Reply #42 on:** January 07, 2002, 10:08:00 AM »

I think a better solution would be to put some kind of "hit counter" for the killshooter. Say, if X # of rounds hit a friendly, killshooter "activates" and blows up the offender. Otherwise, both planes are undamaged. This would prevent the problem of people flying in front of you to steal your kill and having YOU getting killshot!

Example:

green1 following red1 , distance is d400.

Green2 barges in to steal the kill, flies in front of green1 and starts shooting at red1.

Green1 was firing MG's when green2 dived in and hit green2. The game counts how many bullets hit green2. Count is below the X #, no killshooter happens.

Later on green2 is a bigger jerk and thinks its funny to shoot his own side, he fires a good burst at a friendly, count is above X #, he gets killshot.

It would also be very usefull if friendly collisions were ENABLED above 800ft. Below 800ft they'd have to be disabled to accomodate people landing and taxiing or large groups taking off together, but above 800 , they would collide.

This would also prevent the "fly through friendly plane" to steal the kill AND killshoot the guy he's stealing the kill from.

Tilt · « **Reply #43 on:** January 07, 2002, 10:30:00 AM »

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Originally posted by Tac:
[QB]It would also be very usefull if friendly collisions were ENABLED above 800ft. QB]

I like this idea.....

Would make gang banging a little more hazardous...... whilst most gang banging occurs on the deck the participants could not always ensure they were below 800..

Unfortunately we will then have "kill collider" arguements

Tilt

Vortex · « **Reply #44 on:** January 07, 2002, 10:49:00 AM »

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Originally posted by Tac:
It would also be very usefull if friendly collisions were ENABLED above 800ft. Below 800ft they'd have to be disabled to accomodate people landing and taxiing or large groups taking off together, but above 800 , they would collide.

This would also prevent the "fly through friendly plane" to steal the kill AND killshoot the guy he's stealing the kill from.

I would agree with this. I don't really think its a good way to go mind you, however I do think that if one supports KS in its present form one has to support collisions among countrymen other than when your wheels are on the runway. After all, as some have argued here if there are no factors whatsoever that are out of your control wrt shooting, the same must be said wrt to positioning your plane in the relative sense. As with your guns, you should be equally responsible for where your plane flies, regardless of what anyone else around you does.

It would be interesting to try this for a camp.

Vortex