Sooooooo........ epic if it ever happened, but did it?

[Avanti]

So I was just thinking bout the war after watchin pacific and thought If any attacker aircraft were in a wind so strong that they could almost stop the air and lay waste to what ever maybe be below
of course this is far fetched but it is feasable with a bit of flaps
did this ever happen and has anyone heard of it happening?

Avanti

[Ghosth]

First off, even the D3a1 needs around 60mph of airspeed to stay up.

Second, when it is that windy, it is never smooth.  Lots of turbulence, gusts, up and down drafts.

Third, Yes if the plane was up in theory it could virtually hover.
However, how long can it stay there?
Ever tried landing in a 60 mph gusty wind? Even directly into the wind, its just not something that anyone who values their life would ever do.

[Golfer]

You can have a very smooth ride in 60, 80, 100 and up to 210 knot winds at altitude which was the worst headwind I've been in (though it was a great tailwind coming home!)

Your problem if the winds are howling at a low altitude is the ride between the ground and the airport because they're typically not that strong down low and you get the bumps as the speed of the wind changes and also from terrain features, structures and obstructions on the ground.

Even so wind in the real world isn't like the AH wind constant and smooth at all altitudes.  It varies, can change direction or speed significantly in just 1000 feet and the bomb you drop from your airplane which is stationary at that moment above the ground will be acted upon by the wind.  It will blow downwind and you'll miss with 100% reliability.

[Treize69]

Not to mention that if the winds are strong enough to stop an aircraft, what are they going to do the falling bombs?

[Selino631]

yea i've practicaly hoverd in a Cessna 152 before, we were in a really strong headwind and my Instructor was like okay look out the window and pick a house and watch how fast we pass it.... we didn't lol

[AAJagerX]

Eating lunch while in flight school I saw a guy try that in a 150.  Weirdest helicopter I've ever seen.

[321BAR]

yea i've practicaly hoverd in a Cessna 152 before, we were in a really strong headwind and my Instructor was like okay look out the window and pick a house and watch how fast we pass it.... we didn't lol

[Ack-Ack]

Third, Yes if the plane was up in theory it could virtually hover.
However, how long can it stay there?
Ever tried landing in a 60 mph gusty wind? Even directly into the wind, its just not something that anyone who values their life would ever do.

read an account of an artillery spotter plane with the RFC that literally hovered for a couple of hours while calling in adjustments for the artillery batteries.  The reason why the pilot was able to hover in such a way was the wind, he was told there were light winds at 5,000ft which he took to mean around 20-30mph but was surprised that the speeds were above 100mph and his two seater was barely faster than the wind speed he encountered.

ack-ack

[Grayeagle]

Flew an Aeronca Champ long ago, over the fence usually ~30knots .. that and a piper cub get very slow into any kind of headwind Friend I knew long ago told me he landed his Cub goin backwards once, wind gusted on flare faster than the plane was flying

-GE

[Cougar68]

of headwind Friend I knew long ago told me he landed his Cub goin backwards once, wind gusted on flare faster than the plane was flying

-GE

If he was actually out flying in gusts that exceeded the stall speed of his Cub he's an idiot. 

[Golfer]

Just because you wouldn't do it doesn't automatically make someone an idiot.  It's not particularly difficult as I believe you know to have those conditions when gusty.  If you're talking about a gust factor in excess of 40 knots then you're saying something but steady state winds at 30 gusting to 40isn't prohibitive.  I know quite a few folks who make their livings flying in such conditions in Super Cub variants and STOL capable or kitted airplanes.

I'm not claiming to be one of them but they're out there and they're not idiots.

The majority of Joe Weekendflyers pack it in when the winds are far less than that.  I'd dare say many if not most people who fly for recreational purposes wouldn't have business in those conditions.

[Cougar68]

  I know quite a few folks who make their livings flying in such conditions in Super Cub variants and STOL capable or kitted airplanes.

What kind of operations would put Super Cub pilots in these type of conditions routinely?  I could see it happening occasionally in bush flying, but I still couldn't call it safe.   Since we're talking about a stall speed of around 35-40 mph, a slight shift in the wind would make the crosswind component impossible.  Plus you've got a lightweight plane being tossed around in extremely turbulent conditions. 

[Golfer]

With the understanding I'm talking about steady state winds I've flown numerous times in conditions where the steady state winds exceeded the stalling speed of the airplane.  This isn't difficult to do and isn't a big deal.  Pipeline patrol, traffic survey and banner airplanes do it on a regular basis depending on a number of factors.  Flying an airplane that stalls at 30 knots in a 35 knot wind isn't dangerous specifically due to the wind speed.  That steady state wind isn't changing much and you're not at any risk of simply falling out of the sky as the wind isn't going anywhere.

I take your statement to mean you think an idiot anyone who flys their airplane in winds that may be gusty and those peak gusts being higher than the airplane.  That's not true though it is a perfectly valid guideline to adhere to if you're not comfortable with it.

That said:
When it's gusty out you typically don't see the gusts more than 5-10-15 knots higher than the steady state winds.  Whatever additive you use to your final approach speed to compensate should reflect the given conditions.  I'm not advocating that you go out and try it if you're not comfortable with simply saying that conditions exceeding whatever limitations you adhere to don't make someone else an idiot for operating them.

On occasion you might see the gust factor (Highest Gust - Steady State = Gust Factor, eg 15G25 = 10kt Gust Factor) get to 20-25 knots and I once experienced 30 knot gusts (20ish gusting to 50ish) that were not right down the chute but close enough to it so as not to exceed any limitations or venture too far out past the demonstrated component for that airplane.

The conditions of having the gust factor exceeding the stall speed of the airplane where the risk is at whatever higher than normal indicated airspeed you lose that wind dropping you to whatever the steady state is being so slow that the airplane stalls just doesn't happen often.  In that situation (gusts exceeding 35-40kts as the case may be) I'd agree it's not a good idea to go flying and your day is better spent drinking near a grill.

[Buzzard7]

Look up the German Storch Fi-156. I think it was designed for the almost hover thing. Even fly backwards if you lowered the throttle in the right wind.

[Twister2]

Why is it every thread with some technical issue turns into a self appointed know it all calling someone else an idiot?