Author Topic: TilDeath  (Read 1178 times)

Offline Getback

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #15 on: August 18, 2009, 09:41:17 PM »
I purchased a Tempest case from TD for 2 reasons; One, it was a good price matching an online competitors price; and two, I wanted to meet the man I have heard so many good things about. I was not disappointed. He called me to make sure that my empty case arrived. Spent some time with me telling me how to manage my cables and then e-mailed me some photos showing the work involved. Folks, small business do not make a lot of money selling hardware, especially just a case. He went far beyond what you would ever expect.


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Offline humble

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #16 on: August 18, 2009, 11:25:59 PM »
Without having spoken to Lew yet I think we have a problem rooted in the conversion of a commodity (which is what a computer is these days) to a "value added" product. Regardless of the final cost its very hard for the seller to get a fair return  for the value added component since the market has been set to a large degree by the underlying commodity price point. At the same time the overwhelming conformity in the commodity price makes the buyer acutely aware he has paid a premium (even if its a small one). Now the reality is that 98% of the time everyone is reasonably happy. The buyer gets a better product and the seller offsets profit per unit with a volume closer to the commodity level.

However when the fan hits the processor (so to speak) we arrive at a bit of a conundrum. The buyer has very high expectations due to the value added component and has an expectation of superior service in the event of a problem. The seller who has done everything possible to provide an optimum experience for a very reasonable overall cost now has a dual edged problem. He's got an unexpected work load that he can't get fair value for...that detracts from his ability to focus on current clients.

Having run a couple of 100+employee/10MM companies I have to sympathize with TilDeath, at the same time the story as presented does raise a couple of questions that I present in a neutral manner here since like many regular followers of this particular bbs segment I am a potential customer.

My 1st action was to go visit TD's website. I was looking for a customer support tab with the intent of finding out how RMA issues were handled and what warranty is provided. I was somewhat surprised to find absolutely no warranty information of any kind. That only leaves the obviously vague but very broad implied Warranty that TD tends to portray here.  This is obviously the initial point of conflict since no clearly defined service standard exists. To illustrate what the current standard is in the "customized mainstream" segment I picked a relatively new but highly regarded custom shop Digital Storm....here is there warranty policy...
http://www.digitalstormonline.com/warranty.asp      

My 2nd point of confusion is determining the condition of the computer at delivery. From TD's comment it appears that both sides agree that the computer arrived with a problem. This raises two issues, 1st poor quality control which can happen to anyone. More importantly however is a question of policy and procedure, in no way would I allow Lew or anyone else to mess with what is still in effect "my box" without signing a full release. On the flip side I wouldn't even crack the case as a customer and I've built a hundred+ systems. I'd ask for a prepaid RMA and back it goes. This goes back to standardized build, burn and test procedures, something else I don't see anywhere on the website. I have no doubt that TD builds an excellent product of high value, but the lack of standardized procedure and QC creates the potential for this type of issue. Again as a point of contrast here is a lower end clearance product from Desert Storm....
http://www.digitalstormonline.com/comploadsavedsd.asp?id=320970

Look at the specific detail not just on the system but on the "terms of the deal". A better box, unquestionably not. But in the event of a problem (that annoying 2% that all business suffers with) I'd feel much better. For $800 thats a decent system and a lot of "piece of mind".

My third area of interest is in the actual post return work and is where I do have an issue with TD's apparent perspective. From TD's post I'm drawing a few assumptions (always a bad idea:)):

1) Both sides agree the system arrived "broken"
2) Both sides agree it was returned even "more broken" (by UPS not Silat)
3) TD provided a "bill of repairs" to Lew for UPS
4) UPS eventually paid Lew and in turn Lew payed TD

So....

As far as I'm concerned Lew has a complete and reasonable expectation that the system would be repaired and returned to him in full and complete working order and customized as per the original order. Since the machine arrived in a defective state all subsequent events flow from that original "trouble ticket". I can build a system 100% equal to TDs box (including drilling etc in 2 hours or less). The real value is in the tweak and I respect the skill and effort involved. Its unfortunate that a problem occurred and on TD's margins I feel his pain....but business is business and based on TD's comments Silat is actually 100% correct based on TD's outline of events.

Lew had every expectation that the system would arrive in good order or that TD would make it right at his expense. Nothing subsequent to the initial issue changed that fact. This is not an attack on TD in anyway, I recognize that $#!^ happens. While it would be unfair to blame TD its beyond reason to somehow make any of this Silats fault, especially given TD's own above and beyond comments here. If it was me I'd be upset also.

The bottom line here is simple, any business is built one customer at a time and in the end the 90%+ you do right is irrelevant. A business grows via well defined policies and procedures and attention to detail. It's the "other 2%" that will reach out and bite you. The trick to getting from where TD is to where he wants to go lies in how he deals with these issues. The truth is anybody can build a computer (even a tricked out one) but few people can build a successful profitable business that lasts. To me this is just a typical bump on the road from where you were to where you want to go and I'm sure after proper contemplation TD will do right by Lew. In the end its just good business...

As a final point here is the marketing "ain't we great" video from the other guys. One thing very familiar to me is the QC checklist. I've purchased a number of high end boxes during my career and I've never got a custom build without a ton of QC paperwork attached. What do you normally get with one of his builds?
http://www.digitalstormonline.com/videodsdifference.asp   
« Last Edit: August 18, 2009, 11:38:47 PM by humble »

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Offline guncrasher

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #17 on: August 18, 2009, 11:40:37 PM »
I have gotten a case and ps from td. He has always been professional and courteous, and more than willing to help a noob like me. I will always recommend him to my friends and family.

Semp
you dont want me to ho, dont point your plane at me.

Offline Delirium

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #18 on: August 19, 2009, 12:57:28 AM »
(please read entire post)

Back in January/February I knew Tildeath was building machines but I was very hesitant from buying a machine from someone I never looked in the eye. I talked to many of people (some on the phone as well) that vouched for Tildeath's character and I took a chance (even though I had a new wife and daughter the previous year) and purchased a system from TilDeath, fortunately my experience with him was absolutely the best. There was a delay in the machine being shipped only because TilDeath's suppliers didn't have the things in stock and rushed shipped them to him. Rich also didn't charge me for the build because he had initially misquoted me and repeatedly refused to take the money for the build itself.

I repaid his service by sending him countless customers, from ground war tank drivers, base taking horde squadron members, and dueling fighter jocks. I had to make sure I didn't 'advertise' for TilDeath when acting as a Trainer in the TA but I did so as a 'word of mouth' when I wasn't online in some official capacity. I checked in with all the people I know that bought from TilDeath to not only make sure they were happy but it allowed me to keep up on the new hardware changes. I feel that when I recommend someone I feel my own credability is on the line and I like to follow up afterwards.

Everyone had been satisfied to date, except for my very old and dear friend Silat, there was so many issues and with shipping back and forth I feel it would of soured any possibility of any feeling of a positive sale.  I feel a lot of the bad feeling could be smoothed over by sending Silat the overclocking parameters for his machine. If my monetary situation was different I'd purchase them from Tildeath, not only to smooth things over but also to keep an unblemished friendship.
Delirium
80th "Headhunters"
Retired AH Trainer (but still teach the P38 selectively)

I found an air leak in my inflatable sheep and plugged the hole! Honest!

Offline BaldEagl

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #19 on: August 19, 2009, 01:36:39 AM »
Very well anylised and stated humble.  Silat should have gotten what he paid for and without paying any more except maybe some shipping charges.  TilDeath should have never let him open that box and just taken it on the chin for the repairs (or let his vendors take it on the chin like a real business would).  This thread was inevitable.

Regardless, I've always thought it was a bad idea that HTC let Tildeath use the Hardware and Software forums as his personal business marketing tool.  I sometimes wonder how much HT is getting under the table and if he is, why play in such a small pond?  HT... the real money's not with TilDeath, but I'm sure you know that.  Also, Skuzzy has stated in the past that hardware can't be listed or sold on this forum but has totally turned a blind eye to TilDeath's overt marketing to the AH community.  Maybe the kick-backs aren't making it to HT at all.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2009, 01:38:14 AM by BaldEagl »
I edit a lot of my posts.  Get used to it.

Offline TilDeath

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #20 on: August 19, 2009, 02:11:43 AM »
See Rule #2
« Last Edit: August 20, 2009, 08:25:14 AM by Skuzzy »

Offline Strip

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #21 on: August 19, 2009, 02:52:10 AM »
I think a little "advertising" (if you could really call it that) is a small price to pay for the help and knowledge TilDeath provides.

Whether it be advising setup, troubleshooting, upgrades, new builds, store bought or custom computers he brings a lot to the table.


Offline bmwgs

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #22 on: August 19, 2009, 03:02:26 AM »
The Aces High Forums never ceases to amaze me.  Reading these forums I hear things such as integrity and honor which many of the older players believe should be the foundation for this game.  I read how one should give back to the community to support the game and in whole make the community stronger.  Then I read some of the crap in this thread.

I followed the Hardware Forum for a long time before I decided to purchase a system from Rich.  I placed a couple of posts asking what kind of system I should purchase and/or have built, and made it clear that I am not a computer geek.  The answers I received were on the most part ridiculous.  The first thing I was always asked was how much do I have to spend.  That was never a question that I asked, but many seemed so fixated on it.  When I asked about what specific hardware I should purchase, the answers were so far over my head, that I just gave up.  I made it perfectly clear that I do not want to learn how to build a computer, or do the exhaustive research to find out what hardware would be needed to play this game.

I have been following Rich's posts in the section for some time, and I decided based on a couple of recommendations to speak to him.  After 5 minutes I knew this was the guy who I would have build my system.  He spoke in a language that I could understand, and answered my stupid questions.  There is no telling how much time he spent with me on the phone, matter of fact, I don't know how he gets any work done if he spends this kind of time with all his customers.

He gave me a list of hardware for my computer and the price to build the unit.  I did go to several websites to check the prices of the hardware he quoted, and I could not purchase the items for the price he was quoting me.  His labor is $150.00 plus shipping.  I hardly think HTC is getting some major kick back on this.

What I like best, it was like doing business the old fashion way with our word and a hand shake.  You don't find many businesses these days that operate like that.  Now they have to get lawyers to write their warranty disclosers.

I don't see where Rich is mass advertising on this forum.  He offers a service and either you take it or leave it.  After speaking to him I never felt pressured to purchase a system from him.  Even I know in business there is always going to be a dissatisfied customer.  I went to Digital Storm Reviews, and guess what, they have some dissatisfied customers to.

The point is, the way this thread was posted by the OP its intent was clear that he wanted this to be an issue.  He could have simply posted what problems or issues he had and Rich would have responded and the thread would have died in short order.  Those that read the thread who may or may not be thinking of purchasing a system from Rich could make their own decision.

Now we have some telling others how to run their business, and making accusations of under the table dealings.  If I was Rich, and after reading some of the crap in this thread, I would simply stop providing his services to the community.  I don't know if he will or not, but at least that's what I would do, but then again I'm just a dumb country boy who never owned or ran a 100+ employee business.  I'm just glad I have his number before this happened because he will be the one I purchase my next computer from.  

This is MY OPINION not that of any other.    :salute

Fred
One of the serious problems in planning the fight against American doctrine, is that the Americans do not read their manuals, nor do they feel any obligation to follow their doctrine... - From a Soviet Junior Lt's Notebook

Offline Skuzzy

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Re: TilDeath
« Reply #23 on: August 19, 2009, 07:05:40 AM »
Very well anylised and stated humble.  Silat should have gotten what he paid for and without paying any more except maybe some shipping charges.  TilDeath should have never let him open that box and just taken it on the chin for the repairs (or let his vendors take it on the chin like a real business would).  This thread was inevitable.

Regardless, I've always thought it was a bad idea that HTC let Tildeath use the Hardware and Software forums as his personal business marketing tool.  I sometimes wonder how much HT is getting under the table and if he is, why play in such a small pond?  HT... the real money's not with TilDeath, but I'm sure you know that.  Also, Skuzzy has stated in the past that hardware can't be listed or sold on this forum but has totally turned a blind eye to TilDeath's overt marketing to the AH community.  Maybe the kick-backs aren't making it to HT at all.

You know, I bust my butt trying to help people out here everyday.  Not because it is my job, but because I am firmly convinced offering the best in customer service is an added value for HiTech Creations.  I also take a lot of pride in my work.  While not always successful at making everyone happy, I know I do the best I can.

To come in here and read these baseless and false accusations really just makes me a bit angry.  Reading the forums is a secondary function for me.  As such, I may go a day or two between reading a few threads.  And then I may selectively read threads.  It is all based on how much time I have.

So here I come into a thread where a baseless accusation is made impugning my very character and the character of HiTech Creations.  A complaint about us turning a blind eye.  Ok, so the first thing I do is check to see how many "Report to the moderator" complaints I have.  To my surprise, there is not one complaint from the accuser.  Not one complaint from anyone.

This is akin to someone walking by a home, witnessing a person setting said home on fire, then walking off (never calling 911) and three days after the fact, complaining to the local news the fire department must have been paid off to allow that person to get away with it.  People like that cannot be bothered to report something wrong, but are quick to jump on the accusation band wagon.

I do not know about you, but I have zero respect for anyone like that.

HiTech Creations does not allow anyone to sell or advertise services or product on our bulletin board.  If you see anything like that, you are free to hit the "Report to moderator" link.  It does not cost anything and there are absolutely no detrimental effects in doing so.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2009, 07:12:40 AM by Skuzzy »
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