Luddism

[mechanic]

While many biogerontologists (scientists who study aging) find SENS "worthy of discussion", some contend that de Grey's programme is too speculative given current scientific research, referring to it as "fantasy rather than science", and the product of "extreme arrogance".

Taking the importance of the self to new extremes of arrogance.

How can anyone feel that they are so important that they deserve to live indefinitely? Young men and women are out in the middle east right now having their lives blown away by warfare mostly due to the rapidly growing population of our planet. And we are only living longer nowadays and growing in population even as mortals. Those young soldiers....lost lives...so unimportant to the person who thinks they are important enough to live vastly longer than nature intended.

extreme arrogance.
 

Luddism.

new term - mootism

the act of using other people theories to describe in one word the writtings of another.

That's correct in principle, except that you're late by quite a while - there's already a couple of words coined for this, e.g. "gist".  Your argument quoted above is a form of luddism.  It's also nonsensical in arguing that some parts of nature are more natural than others.  viz. saying it's unnatural for something that nature allows, to happen.  Man is a natural thing.  What man does is therefore nothing else than natural. Nothing that happens in the universe is unnatural, or else it wouldn't happen. The insistence that we mustn't live beyond our present age is nonsensical in a number of ways, first in pretending that there's some obligation that we should die sooner than later, second that it's inherently arrogant to want to live longer and healthier.  It's an opposition to technological and general human progress, for the sake of it (or for some circular justification).  It's luddism.

Yes, what we do here is natural. I cannot argue with you there, I was waiting for lushe to use that one in counter infact. Thus i concede the point that to search for a way for humanity to 'cure age' is unatural.

Luddism has nothing to do with my first post. I do not fear these changes. Why should I? What i said is it is extreme arrogance as a life form to take the importance of the self to the level where everybody lives forever. I also imply it is extreme arrogance on the individual level to think one's self so worthy.

Life is about doing as much as you can in the unknown time you have, then stepping out and letting someone else take over. The longer us humans live the more selfish and greedy we will become. Isolated. Arrogant.

I dont fear technology, and therefore I am not a luddite. You can close down my coal mines, I wont cry. All i have done is presented my opinion that the desire to hugely increase our lifespan is arrogant.

[Lusche]

But isn't the desire to lile a longer life a natural one?

That's the path humanity is walking upon for a long time, it's just increasing in speed during the last 200 years. We are constantly increasing our lifespan. Better foods, better hygiene, better medicine, starting with simple herbalism long time ago up to the newest medical technologies.

Where exactly is the point this desire is becoming an arrogant one?

[mechanic]

 The cross over point in time. When different humans of the same generation across the world live in such contrast that one lies in a field with no legs from a landmine, wondering what the hell it's all about and another sits there in such comfort that they spend time dreaming of what they would do if they lived forever in perfect health.

 There is so much wrong with our world and how humans are living right now. How can one man sit and dream of his own life being so enjoyable that he would wish it to never end? If one's existence is so fantastic how about devoting the time to making other lives more enjoyable. There is a life time of work in that department alone. Why spend it developing such a selfish technology when human hate each other and kill each other?

On another topic that relates to humanity's savage way of treating each other and better ways of repairing and increasing our vulnerability to death. Surely with how humanty lives this technology would only serve to make war last longer and weapons do more damage. Not that the arms race needs any fuel right now..
 

When the world has changed it will no longer be so arrogant to dream this. Assuming we are a good hearted lifeform, eventually 'everyone will have the same benifits'. That does not mean that we will not become more isolated and self obscessed the longer we live.

 I do not think that arrogance is all bad. It's has acheived alot throughout history. Arrogance is a proven constant in many major changes our speceis has put itself through. Without it many of us may not be here today. That does not mean it is not arrogant.
 

[moot]

One of the problems of arguing with you, Bat, is that your arguments are almost alway really messy.  Jumbled together. That leaves the guy on the other end with no choice, if he's to make a pertinent and considerate counter- or pro-argument, but to sort it all out before ever getting to his own point. Even moreso when that other guy finds the arguments to be swarming with false notes. And since I'm moving right now and might not be online for 48h after the move, I can't say much right now.

Except a few brief things:
It's inaccurate to reduce it all to arrogance.  IMO this says more about your own POV and personality than anything else.
There will always be people who fail.  For whatever reason.  Stifling one's progress because another is failing, sometimes purposedly, is disingenuous.  Someone has to lead the way.  "Lead, Follow, or get out of the way".

"The cross over point in time. When different humans of the same generation across the world live in such contrast that one lies in a field with no legs from a landmine, wondering what the hell it's all about and another sits there in such comfort that they spend time dreaming of what they would do if they lived forever in perfect health."

This is typical of your arguments on this type of subject... An appeal to emotion.

On another topic that relates to humanity's savage way of treating each other and better ways of repairing and increasing our vulnerability to death. Surely with how humanty lives this technology would only serve to make war last longer and weapons do more damage. Not that the arms race needs any fuel right now..

There is no perfectly safe life, no perfectly safe technological innovation.  Saying that "surely" the progress of tech will mean more war, etc, is completely biased and subjective.

When I'm done moving I'll sort thru the OP.

[mechanic]

One of the problems of arguing with you, Bat, is that your arguments are almost alway really messy.  Jumbled together. That leaves the guy on the other end with no choice, if he's to make a pertinent and considerate counter- or pro-argument, but to sort it all out before ever getting to his own point. Even moreso when that other guy finds the arguments to be swarming with false notes.

Forgive me for providing you a problem that is niether mathematical or scientific, that seems to be what challenges your way of thinking the most.  Your training in how to deal with a problem does not extend beyond 2+2=4?

Except a few brief things:
It's inaccurate to reduce it all to arrogance.  IMO this says more about your own POV and personality than anything else.
There will always be people who fail.  For whatever reason.  Stifling one's progress because another is failing, sometimes purposedly, is disingenuous.  Someone has to lead the way.  "Lead, Follow, or get out of the way".

This is typical of your arguments on this type of subject... An appeal to emotion.There is no perfectly safe life, no perfectly safe technological innovation.  Saying that "surely" the progress of tech will mean more war, etc, is completely biased and subjective.

When I'm done moving I'll sort thru the OP.

nothing here has highlighted why I'm either wrong about this immortal desire being a product of arrogance or that I am a luddite. i look forward to discussing more on the subject.
Good luck in the move.

[Saxman]

Life is miserable. It's painful and it's hard, and the fact that it eventually ends is a MERCY, not a curse. Most of the time I don't want the 50/60-odd years I have left, much less have to endure it indefinitely.