Eric Hartmann was a HO'er...

[BlauK]

Nicely summed up, Agent 

But as a general rule, the HO is something that shows poor game play, no respect for your enemy, and generally results in your status being referred to in very nasty terms. Hoing gets you nothing but contempt by your piers and colleges. It gains you absolutely nothing.

Still I disagree in some tiny bits. I still argue that in some desperate or otherwise suitable situations, there is nothing wrong with a HO shot. If the underdog can deliver one more shot with it, instead of laying low to die, it is perfect. If one has all the advantages and fails utilize them.. getting a shot to his face from the underdog, it is completely his own fault.

Thus, instead of gaining you nothin, HO can gain you the last kill, even a salvation and escape from a desperate situation
However, when one has all the other options available, HO is simply foolhardy, regardless of pilot's skill level or experience.

[Westy]

"But as a general rule, the HO is something that shows poor game play, no respect for your enemy, and generally
results in your status being referred to in very nasty terms. Hoing gets you nothing but contempt by your piers
and colleges. It gains you absolutely nothing."

 True.

However IMO the same goes for those who whine on web boards and on game channels about
being the victim of one. As well as anyone who feels the need to try and get the system changed
because they cannot adapt and master the very simple skills needed to avoid the HO as well as
the collision.
 

[Hap]

"But as a general rule, the HO is something that shows poor game play, no respect for your enemy, and generally
results in your status being referred to in very nasty terms. Hoing gets you nothing but contempt by your piers
and colleges. It gains you absolutely nothing."

 True.

However IMO the same goes for those who whine on web boards and on game channels about
being the victim of one. As well as anyone who feels the need to try and get the system changed
because they cannot adapt and master the very simple skills needed to avoid the HO as well as
the collision.
 

[BlauK]

Also true, Westy

But it is also quite a natural reaction to get angry, to victimize oneself and to accuse the enemy as unfair when one loses a winning match because of own impatience or lack of experience, is it not. Many would accuse themselves, but some perfect ones can rarely see anything wrong in their own actions ... "I got HOed... poor helpless me" 

[dhyran]

hi steve,

definition of HO:

a HO is only a HO if BOTH have the ability of a firering solution at the same time.

most people didnt understand it, if you are in a turn fight, and you turn into the con, lets say you are able to make a deflection schot from 30deg from high 2 oclock, and the opponent have no chance to get a fireing solution, it isn't a HO

i say HO are a life lottery

Lets say RL pilots cant avoid all time

[Wreked]

Well thank you for your kind and respectful words of wisdom steve - I'd feel insulted by them until I consider the source - go figure <shrug>

My position is that there are many sides to this HO question and all have validity depending on your view of history and the game. I've put up with this and many similar arguements for over 20+ years in the air sim game and the fact is it will never be resolved - live with it.

...ya can lead donkeys to a fact...getting em to understand it is another matter!! (...and if the donkey ears fit then....)

...cheers eh! 

[Steve]

Well thank you for your kind and respectful words of wisdom steve - I'd feel insulted by them until I consider the source - go figure <shrug>

My position is that there are many sides to this HO question and all have validity depending on your view of history and the game. I've put up with this and many similar arguements for over 20+ years in the air sim game and the fact is it will never be resolved - live with it.

...ya can lead donkeys to a fact...getting em to understand it is another matter!! (...and if the donkey ears fit then....)

...cheers eh!  

Blah blah blah. Ho question?  Dhyran gave the basic definition of the HO.  There's no question about the definition. A HO is a merge where both parties have the opportunity for a gun solution.  That's the definition, there isn't another.

Return to your sophomoric insults, it won't change the definition though.

[Wreked]

Blah blah blah. Ho question?  Dhyran gave the basic definition of the HO.  There's no question about the definition. A HO is a merge where both parties have the opportunity for a gun solution.  That's the definition, there isn't another.

Return to your sophomoric insults, it won't change the definition though.

I"M going to quote back to YOU my very words that YOU actually quoted back to me :

"Two that fly face to face at each other when merging is a "HO merge" in my books."

There are just a multitude of different opinion regarding this - except for those who say "I"M right and the rest of you are wrong!"

...like I said : "...ya kin lead a donk....." <sigh eh!>

[Shuffler]

I"M going to quote back to YOU my very words that YOU actually quoted back to me :

"Two that fly face to face at each other when merging is a "HO merge" in my books."

There are just a multitude of different opinion regarding this - except for those who say "I"M right and the rest of you are wrong!"

...like I said : "...ya kin lead a donk....." <sigh eh!>

Only my opinion counts..... most know this already.... get on the band wagon 

[Steve]

I"M going to quote back to YOU my very words that YOU actually quoted back to me :

"Two that fly face to face at each other when merging is a "HO merge" in my books."

There are just a multitude of different opinion regarding this - except for those who say "I"M right and the rest of you are wrong!"

...like I said : "...ya kin lead a donk....." <sigh eh!>

You keep trying to change the subject... fail.  Time to grow up, tinkerbell.

.  It's not that I'm right.  I'm just repeating the definition that has been long standing. It's not my definition. You are trying to say it's something else. You are such a child that you are incapable of acknowledging that you made a mistake. I run into people like this in the business world now and then.  They are always abject failures; insulting other people in an effort to try to argue an untenable position. Keep at it if you like, it may actually work in the 8th grade social circles.

[Wreked]

You keep trying to change the subject... fail.  Time to grow up, tinkerbell.

.  It's not that I'm right.  I'm just repeating the definition that has been long standing. It's not my definition. You are trying to say it's something else. You are such a child that you are incapable of acknowledging that you made a mistake. I run into people like this in the business world now and then.  They are always abject failures; insulting other people in an effort to try to argue an untenable position. Keep at it if you like, it may actually work in the 8th grade social circles.

Well if you think your childish insults are a benifit to your position....knock yourself out.

Yours is usually the reply from those who are unable to accept that people may not agree with them - attack the messanger. Fortunatley in my business world the likes of that soon disappear.

...like I said - "...if the donkey ears fit..."  - keep it up...I'm not the one looking progressively desperate.

...and for you others...cheers eh!

[Wreked]

..and GYRENE you offspring from a *&*X#@!* mongrel - SEE what you've started??   LOL

KEEP IT UP EH!

[Steve]

Well if you think your childish insults are a benifit to your position....knock yourself out.

Yours is usually the reply from those who are unable to accept that people may not agree with them - attack the messanger. Fortunatley in my business world the likes of that soon disappear.

...like I said - "...if the donkey ears fit..."  - keep it up...I'm not the one looking progressively desperate.

...and for you others...cheers eh!

Obviously you don't know how you look. Your poor education aside, let's stay on topic. Here's the definition of a Head On shot:   A merge where both aircraft have the opportunity for a gun solution.

Now, this isn't my definition, the head on was around before I was. You can argue that there's several definitions but there simply isn't.    

[Wreked]

Obviously you don't know how you look. Your poor education aside, let's stay on topic.

<sigh> and I give up with the likes of you sir!   LOL

....to the rest of ya  eh!!

[Steve]

<sigh> and I give up with the likes of you sir!   LOL

....to the rest of ya  eh!!

I'm thankful.