Author Topic: The P51D frontal area  (Read 2338 times)

Offline boomerlu

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #15 on: September 15, 2009, 02:06:06 PM »
You guys make me wish I had been playing this game about 8 months ago when I was actually taking a fluids class. Would have made it a lot easier to understand. :salute
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Offline Ex-jazz

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #16 on: September 15, 2009, 02:27:40 PM »

The frustration... Oh mine.

I just assumed, I could guesstimate total drag at least in some level with projected frontal area data, but this aerodynamics... It's a bottomless swamp of mind pending equations & formulas...  :rolleyes:

I put that darn drag thang now aside...
Anyhow, I still would like to know, if my calculator is working so, any idea about that P51D projected frontal area?


Thank you for your informative comments.

Hitech, sure I will :D


Offline Stoney

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #17 on: September 15, 2009, 03:17:32 PM »
I assume your 3D modelling program will compute surface area of the model?  If so, the first thing you could check is the total area of the model versus the wetted area numbers that Charge posted? 
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech

Offline dtango

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #18 on: September 15, 2009, 03:39:02 PM »
An then you do simple little things like put 1/2 a wing tip in your cowl out let to remove the turbulence that has been vibrating your feet for the last 8 years, and pick up 3 Knots.

HiTech

 :lol

Your version of removing radiator duct rumble eh??  Very cool.

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Offline Ex-jazz

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #19 on: September 15, 2009, 03:49:05 PM »
I assume your 3D modelling program will compute surface area of the model?  If so, the first thing you could check is the total area of the model versus the wetted area numbers that Charge posted? 

The given P51D 3D model wetted area is 82.6m2 (889.1ft2). I guess, it's ok then :)

Offline Stoney

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #20 on: September 15, 2009, 04:25:54 PM »
Good!  That means the model is configured pretty well.  Knowing the wetted area of the aircraft allows you to do the most accurate drag approximations.  Just remember that they're approximations only.  Even CFD software is only "predicting" drag.
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech

Offline boomerlu

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #21 on: September 15, 2009, 10:23:13 PM »
Ahh physics and applied physics. Everything's an approximation. Taylor series anyone?
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Offline bozon

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #22 on: September 16, 2009, 02:33:21 AM »
Ahh physics and applied physics. Everything's an approximation. Taylor series anyone?
Everything is an approximation. Roughly speaking.
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Offline hitech

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #23 on: September 16, 2009, 10:35:25 AM »
Everything is an approximation. Roughly speaking.
Monitor spew.

In theory there is no difference between theory and practice. But, in practice, there is.


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« Last Edit: September 16, 2009, 01:01:20 PM by hitech »

Offline streakeagle

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #24 on: September 16, 2009, 06:51:54 PM »
This is why I laugh at X-Plane's claims about the realism/accuracy of its "blade-element" flight modeling.
Even with the most powerful computers in the world using the best modeling techniques available, the computed results can be radically different from the predicted results.
It is a science where a 20% error between a predicted coefficient and the actual value is considered pretty close despite the fact that a 5% error can mean the difference between flyable and fatally unflyable.
Using simplified approximations is an absolute necessity and X-Plane's editor that estimates flight performance based on the geometry of the 3-d model is pretty cool, but I prefer empirically derived data from the actual aircraft any day, with scaled down wind tunnel results taking a close second.
None of the calculated models available to the public on PCs can model the XB-70 to any useful level, but NASA has tons of charts available on the web depicting nearly all of the parameters (stability co-efficients as well as basic lift, drag, etc.) that permit detailed models based on tables of emprical data to capture a reasonable approximation of the XB-70 from stall speed to Mach 3.
Of course, when insufficent empirical data is unavailable, what choice do you have besides mathematical approximations?
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Offline Stoney

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Re: The P51D frontal area
« Reply #25 on: September 16, 2009, 09:51:29 PM »
Of course, when insufficent empirical data is unavailable, what choice do you have besides mathematical approximations?

Tell this to the guy in the flap deployment thread...  :)
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech