Still like the changes?

[WMLute]

The squad I fly with is very good at looking at the map and planning routes, tactics, strategies that are needed to achieve the ultimate goal. Taking the map and winning the war!!!

I also enjoyed going on long range bombing mission between radar rings and playing cat and mouse with the con in the Dar Bar that is hunting me. The mindless furball does not appeal to me..

Two points.

1) How is that planning, tactics and strategy working out now that y'all have realized that w/o the NOE you suck at base taking.  I get a kick when I read players from "certain" squads talk about tactics and strategy.  If you HAD tactics and strategy you wouldn't NEED to go NOE to have success.  (duh)

2) the mindless furball doesn't appeal to you because you have surrounded yourself with players that can't fight (and as such can't teach you to fight) and are the prey not the predators.  Log a few tours with some players who know what they are doing and could possibly train you.

You will be amazed at how much your perspective changes on these matters when you are able to kill more than you die.

if all the people in here  cant find a venue to learn the game IE: noe bomber, fighter without being killed by the guys who have been here forever...this game will wither and die.....seems extreme? grant me this friend...why would a new guy want to engage in a furball where he dies at a moments notice? why would a new guy up a bomber when he knew he was going to get shot down? why would a new guy up a gv with spawn campers?...

There are so many ways to learn and improve in this game.  Countless websites.  Trainers that donate their time.  Films, pictures, charts, graphs, etc, etc (I could go on)

If I was a new guy (and I was once) and I kept dying over and over in a fight (which happened), I would log the hours/days/weeks/months/years to learn and improve.  (which I did)

What you are finding is (as I stated above) is that you have surrounded yourself with sub-par players that can't help you to improve.  Take away their one trick and they are all but helpless.

There is SO much more to this game than you realize and you have but scratched the surface of the games potential.

Hopefully these changes will cause you and yours to work on learning to be successful in the games current environment as opposed to looking for another easy way to achieve faux success.  

[groundfeeder]

Two points.

1) How is that planning, tactics and strategy working out now that y'all have realized that w/o the NOE you suck at base taking.  I get a kick when I read players from "certain" squads talk about tactics and strategy.  If you HAD tactics and strategy you wouldn't NEED to go NOE to have success.  (duh)

2) the mindless furball doesn't appeal to you because you have surrounded yourself with players that can't fight (and as such can't teach you to fight) and are the prey not the predators.  Log a few tours with some players who know what they are doing and could possibly train you.

You will be amazed at how much your perspective changes on these matters when you are able to kill more than you die.
[/quote

You just proved my point...

1 Strategy is limited to the "horde"....ya know the thing you all hate!   unless you have an overwhelming group to come in and cap a base ...well no base take....oh ...why would we want to take a base....win the war...i understand that may be a novel concept in this day and age....but, yeah i wanna win!...NOE, no that isnt all this is about!!!!!!.......read ...... if all you want is to know where we are ...just show red dots ALL the time...heck why not ...it will "promote" combat, and we can all fight in our cartoon aircraft , with cartoon bullets...and play the "game" to the best of our abilities!

2 your first sentence.....mindless furball.........

[groundfeeder]

dont know what happened in previous post bu read it............some how it quoted me on a reply starts with...You just proved my point

[WMLute]

Let me clue you into something.

It doesn't take a hoard to take a field.

It does take some skill.

I can take a base with 1/2 the people (or less) than it takes for you and yours do do the same.

I don't drop hangers to do it and I don't have to sneak in.

I, unlike your bunch, actually use tactics, strategy and skill.

It isn't easy to get to that point, and it takes time, practice and effort, but in the end it is well worth it.

(fyi "mindless hoard" was what you said, not me.  I was poking fun at it)

[Buzzard7]

I remember an evening very recently flying with some of the Widowmakers. I think we flew across two and a half sectors at altitude and still managed to take a base from the Bish. They knew we were coming for a long ways off. I wonder why we were able to take that defended base?  Can someone please explain it to me? Maybe it was being able to keep the defenders busy while others in the mission took care of strategic targets?

Fighter escort for your bombers will take you deep into enemy territory. Your escorts better be good at chasing the bad guys off though. Strict ROE is another thing they need to have. Chasing the red guys to far and you leave your bombers without help. The new settings dont spoil my fun. I don't mind flying at 20k or in the weeds to get the job done. I did manage to make HongKong blow his cookies in the rear gun of a Lanc at tree top level. Maybe twice when we started dogfighting with the big birds.

[kvuo75]

The one thing about the new settings I can't see any good side to for anybody is the confusing mass of overlapping white and red circles all over the map. Trying to tell which parts of the map are and are not covered by each side's dar gives me a headache now. Turning off dar circles takes away the headache but also any chance of determining the coverage.

I wonder if it might be possible to make a slight change to the way dar is indicated on the map to deal with the new circumstances - maybe a very slight white tint over all areas covered by any friendly dar and a very light red (or whatever) tint to all areas covered by any enemy dar.

are you serious?

If you are, well the little airfield icons don't actually indicate the runway directions.  

our vehicle spawns overlap!    -- or better "where are the vehicle spawns?"  

I can't tell where the CV course is against the purple pt spawns  

etc. etc. etc.

btw.. you mention confusion.. that is fog of war is it not? You cant figure out the dar circles... was it easier without them at the current range? Don't say you want it harder when you say it was easier before.

[groundfeeder]

I remember an evening very recently flying with some of the Widowmakers. I think we flew across two and a half sectors at altitude and still managed to take a base from the Bish. They knew we were coming for a long ways off. I wonder why we were able to take that defended base?  Can someone please explain it to me? Maybe it was being able to keep the defenders busy while others in the mission took care of strategic targets?

Fighter escort for your bombers will take you deep into enemy territory. Your escorts better be good at chasing the bad guys off though. Strict ROE is another thing they need to have. Chasing the red guys to far and you leave your bombers without help. The new settings dont spoil my fun. I don't mind flying at 20k or in the weeds to get the job done. I did manage to make HongKong blow his cookies in the rear gun of a Lanc at tree top level. Maybe twice when we started dogfighting with the big birds.

Well good point.....but not everyone in here is in a squad..........and the biggest thing it will lead to is mega-squads.....simply for the fact that that is the only way things will get done. Yes we have mega squads, gut they will get bigger and bigger...and again the lone bomber is left out.....not everone can coax up an escort.

[groundfeeder]

are you serious?

If you are, well the little airfield icons don't actually indicate the runway directions.  

our vehicle spawns overlap!    -- or better "where are the vehicle spawns?"  

I can't tell where the CV course is against the purple pt spawns  

etc. etc. etc.

btw.. you mention confusion.. that is fog of war is it not? You cant figure out the dar circles... was it easier without them at the current range? Don't say you want it harder when you say it was easier before.

FOG???????????? heck i wish we had IMC conditions and fog in here....right now its sunny and clear..........ooooooo look there they are

[Buzzard7]

Ask for an escort. Find a squad and see if they need your services for the evening. As many players as there are in this game I find it hard to believe that no one will wing with you.

Our squad is kind of large but I think the only time you find a ton of us on at one time is during TT. Other nights we work with smaller numbers and still have a good time doing what we want.

Hey kvuo75 try flying Facon4.0 allied forces with some of the settings the 16th uses for weather. NOE in heavy snow and fog at 50 feet. Run in to the target from four directions all coming together at the same altitude just seconds apart over the target. I am amazed that I came through that without hitting anything. TFR worked but it was more fun watching the radar and doing the flying yourself.

[bustr]

Groundfeeder,

I've been playing AW through AH since I was using my roomates 4800 Baud Genie dialup under his CPID slidr(DAMND Slider). That was 88-89ish<---Old age memory fuzzy loss. AW was all about paying constant dues to keep up with the predators. AH is exactly the same. If you are lagging behind in the dues department, like I said contact the Trainers or go to the DA and ask. Personaly Grizz is currently one of the top predators and he is a good teacher. Ask two of my squadies Ardy123 or Kripunski.

All real combat generals are Warriors at heart. They love to fight. Each paid their dues on the way up through the ranks. No general trusts someone who talks strategy but doesn't chaff for the fray. What good are you to your country or your squad if you are stuck at the level of sneaking around the game in its blind spots to avoid confrontations with the predators? WoW has that built in as a feature. Thats the lowest level of this game. In the real world most males do not have the drive or constitution to place themselves in harms way as a life long profession. It's been proven and can be found in human nature studies that during the heat of confrontational game play, the same males as boys who avoid open conflict will avoid it the rest of their lives whatever they take part in. I'm betting they are the same ones who search the Net for any MOD they can find, or hack a game to make themselves an Uber Predator in most MMOG.

The Army performed a study of all American conflicts since the founding through Vietnam. They found a constant formula that in rifle squad sized groups one or two members had no problem pulling the trigger on whom ever was in front of them. Half of the remainder pulled the trigger because it was their duty. Half of what was left would reload and bring ammo for the rest but not shoot, and the last group was best hallmarked at Gettysburg. They would reload their muzzel loader up to 10 times and never pull the trigger.

This is only a game. Stop hiding in the radar holes. You have unlimited lives. 

[sky25]

Two points.

1) How is that planning, tactics and strategy working out now that y'all have realized that w/o the NOE you suck at base taking.  I get a kick when I read players from "certain" squads talk about tactics and strategy.  If you HAD tactics and strategy you wouldn't NEED to go NOE to have success.  (duh)

2) the mindless furball doesn't appeal to you because you have surrounded yourself with players that can't fight (and as such can't teach you to fight) and are the prey not the predators.  Log a few tours with some players who know what they are doing and could possibly train you.

Hopefully these changes will cause you and yours to work on learning to be successful in the games current environment as opposed to looking for another easy way to achieve faux success.  

Actually we take as many bases using GV's and fighters as we do with NOE missions so your point is baseless. And many of our fighter pilots are very good.
Your comment is the same old mindless furballing , picking mentality. If you dont play the game like WMLute wants you to than you must suck at Aces High.. As far as learning the game like you said. I certainly wouldnt want to learn it from your types. I prefer learning it from players who enjoy more than just picking planes and padding scores... I may suck at Aces High like you said, but I certainly enjoy playing it my way instead of yours...

[WMLute]

Well good point.....but not everyone in here is in a squad..........and the biggest thing it will lead to is mega-squads.....simply for the fact that that is the only way things will get done. Yes we have mega squads, gut they will get bigger and bigger...and again the lone bomber is left out.....not everone can coax up an escort.

You missed my point.

My squad, the WidowMakers, can do far more with far less.

What I am trying to point out to you is you don't need huge hoards to accomplish a goal.

And no, being in a squad doesn't lead to mega-squads.  I don't think my squad has ever been close to the limit in numbers and we usually have 2-4 squaddies deployed and far more inactive.

It is rare to have more than 6 WM's on at one time.

It all boils down to the players you have chosen to surround yourself with.

Of course you have the opinions that you do; it is all that you know.  If you fly with sub-par pilots you will find that you will take on the viewpoint of a sub-par pilots.  Of course you believe it will lead to a mega-squad, that is what your bunch would do.  Of course you believe it takes a hoard to accomplish a goal, that is what you know.

You yourself said " simply for the fact that that is the only way things will get done " and you actually believe that.

I am here to tell you that, fortunately for the game, what you believe is not true in the slightest.  A small 'effective' well trained group will accomplish far more than a hoard will time and again.  It takes time, practice, and training, but once you have put forth the effort you will be amazed at what a small group can manage.

Actually we take as many bases using GV's and fighters as we do with NOE missions so your point is baseless. And many of our fighter pilots are very good.
Your comment is the same old mindless furballing , picking mentality. If you dont play the game like WMLute wants you to than you must suck at Aces High.. As far as learning the game like you said. I certainly wouldnt want to learn it from your types. I prefer learning it from players who enjoy more than just picking planes and padding scores... I may suck at Aces High like you said, but I certainly enjoy playing it my way instead of yours...

I can't think of a single pilot in your squad that anybody would consider "good" which is too bad for you 'cause you will only learn bad habits from that bunch.  You do know that everybody on the other countries think y'all are a joke right?  (i.e. from a skill/ability sort of way)

Of course (like groundfeeder) you think that I have the success that I  do by picking and padding my score.  That is what you know and the only way you think it can be done.  You can't even conceive of doing it any other way because of the group you have surrounded yourself with and what has been taught to you by them.

You (they) are wrong, but until you get far enough along the AH learning curve to grow out of the bunch you fly with, you will never understand what I am saying here.

I can do more with 6 WidowMakers than you can with 10 from your squad.

Can you tell me why that is?

[sky25]

We will have to agree to disagree.. I guess we can agree on this point. We like playing the game..

[1Boner]

Wow Lute!

Ya know, some people take this "game" a ALOT more seriously than others.

Some people just like to come on and bang around in cartoon airplanes and have some fun.

I have been playing pool in a league for 10+ years and consider myself a fair player.

A few guys on my team are actually very very very good.

We will usually place in the top 3 almost every season.

We take our shooting fairly serious and have studied and practiced to be as good as we can be.

On the flip side, there are teams that have been playing for years that are not very good and really don't aspire to be any better than they already are.


They just enjoy playing the game and the social aspect of playing on a team.

Although alot of teams can spank these guys silly at any time, not one team would ever consider calling the other team "sub par" or anything else .

Being adults we know that alot of teams don't aspire to acheive our standard of gameplay.

Many people in this game are the same way, they just want to log on and have some fun,without being looked down upon for the way they enjoy playing it.
They don't want to train or read books on acm etc.

Alot the the so called "adults" in this game should be ashamed of the things they say to other to other players.

[groundfeeder]

Groundfeeder,

I've been playing AW through AH since I was using my roomates 4800 Baud Genie dialup under his CPID slidr(DAMND Slider). That was 88-89ish<---Old age memory fuzzy loss. AW was all about paying constant dues to keep up with the predators. AH is exactly the same. If you are lagging behind in the dues department, like I said contact the Trainers or go to the DA and ask. Personaly Grizz is currently one of the top predators and he is a good teacher. Ask two of my squadies Ardy123 or Kripunski.

All real combat generals are Warriors at heart. They love to fight. Each paid their dues on the way up through the ranks. No general trusts someone who talks strategy but doesn't chaff for the fray. What good are you to your country or your squad if you are stuck at the level of sneaking around the game in its blind spots to avoid confrontations with the predators? WoW has that built in as a feature. Thats the lowest level of this game. In the real world most males do not have the drive or constitution to place themselves in harms way as a life long profession. It's been proven and can be found in human nature studies that during the heat of confrontational game play, the same males as boys who avoid open conflict will avoid it the rest of their lives whatever they take part in. I'm betting they are the same ones who search the Net for any MOD they can find, or hack a game to make themselves an Uber Predator in most MMOG.

The Army performed a study of all American conflicts since the founding through Vietnam. They found a constant formula that in rifle squad sized groups one or two members had no problem pulling the trigger on whom ever was in front of them. Half of the remainder pulled the trigger because it was their duty. Half of what was left would reload and bring ammo for the rest but not shoot, and the last group was best hallmarked at Gettysburg. They would reload their muzzel loader up to 10 times and never pull the trigger.

This is only a game. Stop hiding in the radar holes. You have unlimited lives. 

Again I must say the same thing. Why are you afraid to look?  And no general worth his salt wants to see his troops die, if he can sieze an objective without casulties he will choose that route every single time. and no I dont AVIOD combat....just get sick of the constant furball. Every night you log on....same furball....same place