New Mossi thoughts - the interception problem

[Lusche]

i saw on military channel or history channel that p47m were only used to chase low alt V1 rockets.

That's not correct. And yes, TV is about the worst source for any knowledge about military history, military technology or any kind of knowledge at all

I thought p47m would be faster only at low alt, like tempest

It was still a high performance and superb high altitude fighter (once the bugs were ironed out)

[Karnak]

i saw on military channel or history channel that p47m were only used to chase low alt V1 rockets.
I thought p47m would be faster only at low alt, like tempest

Why?  It didn't chase V1s and it has the same engine as the P-47N.

[Baumer]

If you read the Report of Joint Fighter Conference from 16-23 October 1944, NAS Pax River, at the end of the conference it was voted the best fighter over 25,000 feet.

[Charge]

Looking at the form of the "cookie" it was hardly a pinpoint weapon having any kind of stabilizing surfaces, so dropped from 30k the bomb likely had a considerable dispersion from sighting point. But of course we do not have that problem in AH and we can put an eye out of a CV gunner if we desire. 

-C+

[Boozeman]

Only once (in 8 hours flying time!) a Ta 152H was able to catch me @ 28k - after chasing me for 7 sectors in dot vis range! I was dragging him to my own factories, did a high speed dive & some evasives, and got home with a proxy kill.

Please give us more details. Did the 152 run ito you at alt or did he he climb up from lower alt? How far could he close the gap? Did you bomb target in the meantime? Did you use WEP often?

Thanks!

[Zygote404]

109 K4 climbs much faster and its much faster till 40k.  I had no problem killing a mossie I found co-alt yesterday even in a dive.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/planeperf.php?gtype=2&pw=2&p1=110&p2=1&submitButtonName=Generate+Chart

[Lusche]

Did the 152 run ito you at alt or did he he climb up from lower alt?
He was initally lower than me, can't tell how much exactly. I was quite far in enemy airspace, almost close to Bish/Rook border (I was Knight).
I think he was taking off from a nearby 4k base while I was making my way from Rook town to town. I had botched one target approach, so I ventured further inland towards his darbar. I think if I had been more attentive/cautious I could have totally avoided him, but my concentration was a bit slipping after a full day of Mosquito flying.

How far could he close the gap?
He did catch me, after a 7 sector chase

Did you bomb target in the meantime?
Yes, I bombed my last target while I was being hunted. No reason to waste those bombs

Did you use WEP often?
I used up my 5 mins of WEP towards the end of the chase.

[Lusche]

109 K4 climbs much faster and its much faster till 40k.  I had no problem killing a mossie I found co-alt yesterday even in a dive.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/newscores/planeperf.php?gtype=2&pw=2&p1=110&p2=1&submitButtonName=Generate+Chart

That's the trick - finding one co-alt

But few people are patrolling at that altitude. And if you are taking off for a 28k mossie already on dar, you will have a hard time to catch up, especially if the Mossie driver is keeping attention to the darbars and changing course.

[Zygote404]

Oh I see the problem now then.  One I found was around 18k from memory. Didn't realize they could bomb properly from that height.

[Lusche]

Oh I see the problem now then.  One I found was around 18k from memory. Didn't realize they could bomb properly from that height.

18k is quite low. The optimum altitude for the Mossie is 28k. If keeping WEP for the chase, a 109K needs about 11 minutes to reach 28K, during which a loaded Mossie will cover about 60 miles - more than 2 sectors. The 109K will have to plan ahead, and if the Mossie pilot isn't going for the factories (why should he? Predictable, ack infested, less yield in points) he can quite easily change course & target.

[Martyn]

The Mossie XVI is beautiful isn't it? I'm in love again ...

It looks like a bit of a game changer though - a flight will make a CV's day not-so-happy so quickly, and a lot more towns will find themselves with no town centre much more often.

The 4K cookie couldn't have been that accurate when dropped from high alt, so to mitigate the Mossie's awesome performance a little I think the cookie should be made to be a bit more erratic when dropped. Having said that - we'd need some evidence to that effect and I can't find any reliable sources.

[Lusche]

It looks like a bit of a game changer though - a flight will make a CV's day not-so-happy so quickly,

I don't think it will see that much usage in the anti-CV role in the long run. The Mossie have to come down for that, being easy prey for patrolling fighters then.

[kvuo75]

Oh I see the problem now then.  One I found was around 18k from memory. Didn't realize they could bomb properly from that height.

oh, they can.. yesterday I took up a single with 6x500 and took out 6 radars from 30K..

[Martyn]

I don't think it will see that much usage in the anti-CV role in the long run. The Mossie have to come down for that, being easy prey for patrolling fighters then.

Why do they have to come down? 3 x 4k cookies from 30k ...
Although the CV will have a lot more time to turn, they often don't - especially if they don't realise they're Mossies.

[Lusche]

Why do they have to come down? 3 x 4k cookies from 30k ...

Will rarely have success, unless the CV his running in a straight line long enough to line up & drop (a cookie takes about 50 seconds from drop to impact at 30k)
It's almost a freak occurrence. Also take into account that it would take a Mossie about 30 minutes to get in such an attack position.

It's very rare in the MA to see a CV being sunk by bombers considerable higher than 12k.