Author Topic: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?  (Read 5417 times)

Offline Perrine

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #45 on: October 12, 2010, 02:15:09 PM »
If I were forced to fly in the late war cesspool I would bid this game it's final adieu!

you'll comeback

This game is the ONLY one in the block.  There's no competetion


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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #46 on: October 12, 2010, 04:31:03 PM »
you'll comeback

This game is the ONLY one in the block.  There's no competetion


Fighter Ace is dead
Warbirds is on life support like Terri Schiavo
IL2 is full of hacks

That is also why you will never see TT run all week. HTC will run the game as a money making enterprise. TT looses money, split arenas make money.

Offline dedalos

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #47 on: October 12, 2010, 04:57:35 PM »
That is also why you will never see TT run all week. HTC will run the game as a money making enterprise. TT looses money, split arenas make money.

How?   I very rarely see more than 400 people on if I add both arena populations.  The few times it is over that it happens for a small amount of time.  Do you think I will stay because I cant find a fight in huge map with 150 people in it or with 400?  I ll take the 400 any time

 
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

Offline Lusche

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #48 on: October 12, 2010, 06:03:53 PM »
That is also why you will never see TT run all week. HTC will run the game as a money making enterprise. TT looses money, split arenas make money.

4 years ago? Probably. Right now?

Not so sure, because the number of players online is considerably lower, but the caps are still the same. During the week, we hardly reach the "cesspool" numbers shortly before & after the split in 2006.

Particularly noticable is the drop at "European" times. There will be many different reasons contributing to that, but surely running into 130/100, 30/150 arena caps is not doing a good job in creating a "healthy" combat environment.

A typical monday:


See how both LW arenas are stuck with max 100 players for the whole euro prime time (1900-2400 hours = 1200-1700 CDT).
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Offline Letalis

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #49 on: October 12, 2010, 06:17:42 PM »
4 years ago? Probably. Right now?

Not so sure, because the number of players online is considerably lower, but the caps are still the same. During the week, we hardly reach the "cesspool" numbers shortly before & after the split in 2006.

Particularly noticable is the drop at "European" times. There will be many different reasons contributing to that, but surely running into 130/100, 30/150 arena caps is not doing a good job in creating a "healthy" combat environment.

A typical monday:
(Image removed from quote.)

See how both LW arenas are stuck with max 100 players for the whole euro prime time (1900-2400 hours = 1200-1700 CDT).

Lusche and his cold hard graphs, good stuff :aok
Numbers are "behind the power curve" IMO.
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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #50 on: October 12, 2010, 09:38:01 PM »
How?   I very rarely see more than 400 people on if I add both arena populations.  The few times it is over that it happens for a small amount of time.  Do you think I will stay because I cant find a fight in huge map with 150 people in it or with 400?  I ll take the 400 any time

 

My statement is based off of what HTC said for the reasons they split the arenas. I'm sure it still holds true to this day (or one would think things would have changed again). I agree that today's population is different than it was back then. Maybe HTC are a bunch of optimists. Maybe they figure the economy is on a positive upswing and the numbers will climb right back up to where they were before so there is no reason to make any changes. Maybe they bought out Warbirds and will be shutting them down bringing in more subscriptions  :noid

I agree that the Euro guys get the short end of the stick. I wish Hitech would comment or why they won't move the time for the cap system a bit later into the evening for the Euro guys. Maybe someone should call them, or get Pyro drunk at the CON and get a strait answer out of him. What happened to the idea Lusche and Hitech had going about a new setup for starting the cap system?

There are many questions begging for answers. I know flying on TT sucks. I try it now and then and it's just a waste of time for me, just too full of frustration.  Some like it, but then again some like running in hordes, some like good dogfights, and some like capturing bases. It doesn't really matter what YOU like. It's HTC playground, they make the rules. We just try to find our bit of fun inside those rules.

Offline Lusche

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #51 on: October 12, 2010, 09:55:54 PM »
I agree that the Euro guys get the short end of the stick. I wish Hitech would comment or why they won't move the time for the cap system a bit later into the evening for the Euro guys. Maybe someone should call them, or get Pyro drunk at the CON and get a strait answer out of him. What happened to the idea Lusche and Hitech had going about a new setup for starting the cap system?

Of course I don't know what HT is thinking, but I still see some problems with my own proposal myself:
It certainly would lead to the 2nd aren filling up much more quickly. But when looking at the numbers above, I wonder: At what time should the switch from daytime operation (one arena) to nighttime operation (2 arenas) happen? Does it make sense to shut down the non-prime arena and bring up the two prime time arenas just for like 4 hours or so? Because if you keep it to 12 hours daytime (1 arena) and 12 hours night/primetime (2 arenas), we would basically have the same problem again: 200 players split into 2 arenas.

Currently the only way I can keep the fun level up is flying as much as I can during US times... which isn't really good for my health  :uhoh
Seeing the action slowly fade away in LWO at 7pm local time is quite depressing ...

Maybe they figure the economy is on a positive upswing and the numbers will climb right back up to where they were before

I think it's less economy related than to a number of other factors, but here I'm really more guessing than knowing ;)


« Last Edit: October 12, 2010, 09:58:12 PM by Lusche »
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Offline BaldEagl

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #52 on: October 13, 2010, 12:20:25 AM »
All I know is that before the split I could find any type of fight I wanted.  There were furballs, hoards, lone buffs, buff hunters, lone fighters, etc., etc.  I could go sit in a GV at any base even if it wasn't under attack and in time it would be.  Why?  The maps were full.  At that time I seem to remember the single MA consistantly running about 750 players during prime time (about the same as Titanic Tuesday now).

Now I log on and find one hoard against another hoard or else split hoards fighting lone players.  The most people I seem to ever see in both LWA's combined is about 400.  I haven't seen any improvement in gameplay and in fact, I think it's worse.

I know that RL is doing a lot to keep me from playing.  So far this camp I've put in 20 minutes.  But before I went back to work I spent ovet a year unemployed and my game time continued to decline to where it is today.  Many nights, even though I have the time and inclination to play, I log on, look at the map and log back off and most nights I can think of 10 other things I'd rather do.

A have to agree that the glory days of AH and most likely WWII flight sims in general is behind us.  I try to hold out hope but it becomes more fleeting each year/month/week.

Now we see the advent of smaller, player driven arenas coming once again and I can only surmise that the recent trend toward more, smaller, less populated arenas will continue.  It will be a sad day when this entire community is splintered into pairs.  I don't expect I'll be here for that day.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2010, 12:22:25 AM by BaldEagl »
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Offline Little Dragon

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #53 on: October 13, 2010, 07:38:33 AM »
Gameplay has never been the same since the LWA was split in two.
Agreed.  +1  :aok
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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #54 on: October 13, 2010, 08:10:38 AM »
Maybe that is what they are counting on. Get the mini arenas system up and running which could thin out the numbers in the mains. Then once the numbers stabilize they can switch it to a single main arena again. Again without any kind of announcement it's just speculation.

Offline dedalos

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #55 on: October 13, 2010, 09:42:53 AM »
My statement is based off of what HTC said for the reasons they split the arenas.

Yes, to limit the cesspool.  Personally, I find this insulting as a paying customer for 10 years.

Quote
I agree that the Euro guys get the short end of the stick. I wish Hitech would comment or why they won't move the time for the cap system a bit later into the evening for the Euro guys. Maybe someone should call them, or get Pyro drunk at the CON and get a strait answer out of him. What happened to the idea Lusche and Hitech had going about a new setup for starting the cap system?

There are many questions begging for answers. I know flying on TT sucks. I try it now and then and it's just a waste of time for me, just too full of frustration.  Some like it, but then again some like running in hordes, some like good dogfights, and some like capturing bases. It doesn't really matter what YOU like. It's HTC playground, they make the rules. We just try to find our bit of fun inside those rules.

Just because HT does something, it does not automatically make it right.  For one thing, it is also our playground.  With out us, (the cesspool of paying customers) there is no play ground, and with out HT there is no play ground.  There has to be a balance on what gets done.  Treating it as only his play ground will lead to the playground being closed.  There is already a decline in the number of people on line, no?  Lets stop blaming the economy and try to find the real reasons and then fix them.  I like the game, but not so match with 150 people on.  Will like it a lot less with 100.

As far as TT goes, that is not my experience with it.  With a lot of people on I can find small fights here and there.  With 150 people on, all that is available is a hoarding attempt at a base and nothing else.  Maybe if they played the game they would have a better idea fo what is and is not going on in it.

To this date, I don;t remember seeing a good reason for the split other than generalizations.  I may have missed it though.
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

Offline Wiley

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #56 on: October 13, 2010, 09:50:10 AM »
Maybe that is what they are counting on. Get the mini arenas system up and running which could thin out the numbers in the mains. Then once the numbers stabilize they can switch it to a single main arena again. Again without any kind of announcement it's just speculation.

I'm not entirely sure that is a planned strategy, but it really won't surprise me if that's what winds up happening.  A lot of people seem to want smaller more controllable situations rather than open arenas, at least on the forums.  When the player arenas get up, I am predicting a mass exodus to them.

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Offline Lusche

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #57 on: October 13, 2010, 10:00:14 AM »
I'm not entirely sure that is a planned strategy, but it really won't surprise me if that's what winds up happening.  A lot of people seem to want smaller more controllable situations rather than open arenas, at least on the forums.  When the player arenas get up, I am predicting a mass exodus to them.

At first certainly. But I don't think on the long run... unless the allowed number of players will be a surprising high one. In the long run, players are looking for big numbers and gameplay on a large scale, the numbers of LWO vs LWB testify to that.

IMHO the really large arena aspect of AH was always one of it's greatest strengths, putting the massive into MMO.
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Offline Wiley

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #58 on: October 13, 2010, 10:33:24 AM »
At first certainly. But I don't think on the long run... unless the allowed number of players will be a surprising high one. In the long run, players are looking for big numbers and gameplay on a large scale, the numbers of LWO vs LWB testify for that.

IMHO the really large arena aspect of AH was always one of it's greatest strengths, putting the massive into MMO.

Of course, when it's new, the shiny will be on it and people will go to check it out.  It's gonna be running at capacity for the first week or so for sure.

I agree with your points, Lusche.  However, I'm going to present a slightly different interpretation.  Your interpretation is the one I hope for, the one I'm about to present is the one I fear.  You've been around a lot longer than me, maybe you know a bit better what motivates the general playerbase based on what's gone before.  I'm making some assumptions on how it's going to work here, but nothing too outlandish I think.

People head for the arena with numbers.  The reason they fill up an arena is they're looking to get into a fight quickly, it's easier to do when there's numbers.  Based on a lot of the board reading I've done the last little while, there's a decent number of people who want small, controllable fights.  1v1, 3v3, 5v5 type stuff.

If I'm a duelist, am I going to want to log into a populated arena, or am I going to want to log into a player arena where <insert big name player name here> is looking for a 1v1?  Or if I'm into small scale squad fights, am I going to grab a squaddie or two and head over to fight where <insert big name squad here> is looking for some 3v3 action?

Or am I going to want to log into a 16v16 or 32v32 server that's using that new supercool map inside the caves with stalactites and stalagmites everywhere to get in the way that some guy made for small scale fights?  (c'mon map builders, you know it's a good idea)

etc etc.

I've seen some of the racing maps people have set up.  I'm really, really looking forward to that now and again, it looks like a blast and a nice change of pace from time to time.

I'm just afraid that people will go looking for their 'bite sized fights' in the player arenas and if there are enough that have that mentality instead of the desire to seek unpredictability in an open arena, the open arenas will become a ghost town.

Really depends how they set it up.  A lot of people are used to the idea of 16v16 or 32v32 being the norm due to a lot of other online games like Halo, Counterstrike, and stuff in that vein.  It might be a more familiar, more palatable thing for them to use.  I'm worried the mentality that 'the only place to find a good clean (no HOs, no picking, yadda yadda yadda) fight is in the player arenas' will become the norm, regardless of whether it's true or not.

Now, the utopian vision is for the people who want fair fights to go to the player arenas and still leave enough people in the open arenas that are actually looking for unpredictable fights that the whining will stop completely.   :pray  ...I have my doubts this will come to pass.

Wiley.
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Offline Lusche

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Re: What if we have titanic tuesdays everyday?
« Reply #59 on: October 13, 2010, 10:43:10 AM »
I think it's more the DA than the MA'S that will take a hit.
We had player hosted arenas for years, and it always seemed to me most of those players that did not simply go away (H2H arenas were for free), went to the DA, particularly Lake Furball.
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