Author Topic: Smash and Grab  (Read 7070 times)

Offline FiLtH

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #75 on: April 04, 2011, 10:31:02 AM »
   Its frowned upon for a few reasons.

 Some guys dont have the time to spend flying to 30k and rather spend the time they have in as much fighting as possible.

"Realism" in here is moot, nobody dies.

Numbers are a huge turnoff for many. Winning fights in a 6 on 1, or capturing a town with 30 people thats defended by 5 isnt very rewarding. If it is to you, then hey, its your 15 bucks. Just expect others to call you on it.

 The game is built around the dogfight. Everything else is to provide players who want to be part of it,but dont dogfight, have something else thats fun to do. The map is simply the stage. It means nothing really. They reset and the fight continues.

You can get more perks in a hour or so, than a map victory rewards you with.

Events and FSO provide all the "realism" I need in the game. I suggest checking them out. Im the first guy into a bad situation in the MA, but come FSO I try to fly careful since you only have 1 life. Its great, but I wouldnt want it to be that way all the time in an MA.


Dont take the game so seriously. Die alot and learn why. Get better at dogfighting and once you do, everything else pales in comparision.

~AoM~

Offline waystin2

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #76 on: April 04, 2011, 10:43:22 AM »
Fact: I know of unhappiness in the V's ranks.  Squad implosion coming soon to an arena near you.  :aok
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Offline bmwgs

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #77 on: April 04, 2011, 11:02:25 AM »
Because this is a game, NOT WAR!

You go out to the playground and they are putting together a "pick-up" game of football. They choose up sides and one time has 20 players and the other only gets 6. They ONLY want to play with their friends. Would the game be fun?

If you were on the 20 player team sure you would win, but was it really fun?

I keep seeing people state that this game is not a "war".  By Webster's definition it is.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/war

Definition of WAR
1
a (1) : a state of usually open and declared armed hostile conflict between states or nations (2) : a period of such armed conflict (3) : state of war b : the art or science of warfare c (1) obsolete : weapons and equipment for war (2) archaic : soldiers armed and equipped for war

2
a : a state of hostility, conflict, or antagonism b : a struggle or competition between opposing forces or for a particular end <a class war> <a war against disease>



Is there real blood, loss of real life, real injuries, real loss of property, real horrors, no there isn't.  It is a state of conflict within a game and it can be defined as a war between the opposing sides.

No one should try to compare this game to a real life war or conflict, but the point remains by definition this game is a war between sides.

My Opinion, based on Websters Definition.

Fred
One of the serious problems in planning the fight against American doctrine, is that the Americans do not read their manuals, nor do they feel any obligation to follow their doctrine... - From a Soviet Junior Lt's Notebook

Offline moot

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #78 on: April 04, 2011, 11:13:46 AM »
Compare with definition of a sport, or... game.

Sport
A sport is an organized, competitive, entertaining, and skillful activity requiring commitment, strategy, and fair play, in which a winner can be defined by objective means. It is governed by a set of rules or customs. Activities such as card games and board games, are classified as "mind sports" and some are recognized as Olympic sports, requiring primarily mental skills and mental physical involvement. Non-competitive activities, for example as jogging or playing catch are usually classified as forms of recreation.
[...]
Records are kept and updated for most sports at the highest levels, while failures and accomplishments are widely announced in sport news. Sports are most often played just for fun or for the simple fact that people need exercise to stay in good physical condition. However, professional sport is a major source of entertainment.
While practices may vary, sports participants are expected to display good sportsmanship, and observe standards of conduct such as being respectful of opponents and officials, and congratulating the winner when losing.

Game
# a contest with rules to determine a winner; "you need four people to play this game"
# a single play of a sport or other contest; "the game lasted two hours"
# an amusement or pastime; "they played word games"; "he thought of his painting as a game that filled his empty time"; "his life was all fun and games"
# animal hunted for food or sport
# plot: a secret scheme to do something (especially something underhand or illegal); "they concocted a plot to discredit the governor"; "I saw through his little game from the start"
# your occupation or line of work; "he's in the plumbing game"; "she's in show biz"
# bet on: place a bet on; "Which horse are you backing?"; "I'm betting on the new horse"
# frivolous or trifling behavior; "for actors, memorizing lines is no game"; "for him, life is all fun and games"
# willing to face danger
« Last Edit: April 04, 2011, 11:17:10 AM by moot »
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Offline bmwgs

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #79 on: April 04, 2011, 01:46:27 PM »
Interesting Moot.... I'll take the bait.

Most every sport I have ever participated in had a set of written playing rules with consequences if you violate them.  Most every game I have played, other than some on-line games also had rules.

As far as I know Aces High does not have any written rules concerning game play other than don't cheat and some player conduct stuff.

I feel safe to say that Aces High is not a sport, but does fall into the category of a game.

If you are comparing the definition of a sport or game to the definition of a war.  I feel pretty good in saying that you can have a war or conflict, in either, by opposing forces.  In other words there can be a war between players in a sport or game.

Again Just My Opinion.

Fred
« Last Edit: April 04, 2011, 01:52:39 PM by bmwgs »
One of the serious problems in planning the fight against American doctrine, is that the Americans do not read their manuals, nor do they feel any obligation to follow their doctrine... - From a Soviet Junior Lt's Notebook

Offline Reaper90

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #80 on: April 04, 2011, 02:11:51 PM »
winng is better then getting kills.

Meh.

Killing = Winning. Duh.

Two guys meet in the air. One dies. The other WINS.

The "base capture" aspect of this game only serves as a means for the herd of prey (hordlings) to move around on the map so that the predators do not become lazy. "Win" the war? Irrelevant and meaningless. It just starts over. And we're back to Winners killing the losers. You think you're "winning" by rolling a field.... you're really LOSING because you just accomplished nothing except to take you one step closer to being back to the beginning..... and still Losing.

Duh.




WINNING
« Last Edit: April 04, 2011, 02:21:59 PM by Reaper90 »
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Offline ROX

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #81 on: April 04, 2011, 02:27:00 PM »
Meh.

Killing = Winning. Duh.

Two guys meet in the air. One dies. The other WINS.

The "base capture" aspect of this game only serves as a means for the herd of prey (hordlings) to move around on the map so that the predators do not become lazy. "Win" the war? Irrelevant and meaningless. It just starts over. And we're back to Winners killing the losers. You think you're "winning" by rolling a field.... you're really LOSING because you just accomplished nothing except to take you one step closer to being back to the beginning..... and still Losing.

Duh.


(Image removed from quote.)

WINNING

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


ENTIRE above post = "If you don't play YOUR $15 bucks just like I play MY $15 bucks you are sad and lame"

Offline AAJagerX

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #82 on: April 04, 2011, 02:30:54 PM »
Gotta love the BBS...  Two of these threads going on at the same time, at the very top of the page, with the same points being argued.   :rofl :rofl :rofl 
AAJagerX - XO - AArchAAngelz

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Offline 1Boner

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #83 on: April 04, 2011, 02:49:42 PM »
Gotta love the talk about "skills" :rofl

Just a guess, but I'll bet that alot of guys who talk about "skills" and attacking "undefended" buildings and bases are the same ones who think vulching is cool.
"Life is just as deadly as it looks"  Richard Thompson

"So umm.... just to make sure I have this right.  What you are asking is for the bombers carrying bombs, to stop dropping bombs on the bombs, so the bombers can carry bombs to bomb things with?"  AKP

Offline moot

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #84 on: April 04, 2011, 04:46:02 PM »
Interesting Moot.... I'll take the bait.

Most every sport I have ever participated in had a set of written playing rules with consequences if you violate them.  Most every game I have played, other than some on-line games also had rules.

As far as I know Aces High does not have any written rules concerning game play other than don't cheat and some player conduct stuff.

I feel safe to say that Aces High is not a sport, but does fall into the category of a game.

If you are comparing the definition of a sport or game to the definition of a war.  I feel pretty good in saying that you can have a war or conflict, in either, by opposing forces.  In other words there can be a war between players in a sport or game.

Again Just My Opinion.

Fred
Fall into the category of a game?  It is a game.   

You don't really have war in sports.  War isn't fair.  Sports are built on rules.  Break the rules and you're disqualified. In sports you're expected to play fair and have ... sportsmanship. No such thing in war. There are no rules in war.  There are rules in AH, the only special thing about them is that they are set by the game makers IE HTC because players can't be trusted with self-policing.  EG friendly fire.  Spying is one rule you'll get punished for.  Double accounting, same.  So why aren't these and any other "exploits" allowed?  Because this is a game.

Whereas successful war making depends, hinges on finding a better "exploit" than the other guy.  It isn't about fun. These things are borderline hair splitting nuances but.. They're the difference between the reality of war and reality of games.  Rules of war apply to games, and sometimes vice versa, but it's playing on words to choose the word "war" like it was a better description of AH than "game".
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Offline redwing7

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #85 on: April 04, 2011, 06:26:52 PM »
Meh.

Killing = Winning. Duh.

Two guys meet in the air. One dies. The other WINS.

The "base capture" aspect of this game only serves as a means for the herd of prey (hordlings) to move around on the map so that the predators do not become lazy. "Win" the war? Irrelevant and meaningless. It just starts over. And we're back to Winners killing the losers. You think you're "winning" by rolling a field.... you're really LOSING because you just accomplished nothing except to take you one step closer to being back to the beginning..... and still Losing.

Duh.

Then by your own infinite wisdom the fight itself is irrelevant and meaningless. Because once someone dies it just starts over...... :lol



THUNDER MOB

"and when they bury me, may it be face down...so all my critics can kiss my ass!"  Bobby Knight

Offline Reaper90

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #86 on: April 04, 2011, 08:34:54 PM »
ROX......

Apparently your cranial rectal insertion syndrom doesn't allow you to understand I was merely providing a counterpoint to vWild949's position that only "the war" matters, and that fuballing/"getting kills" is a waste of time.

I've never said anything about not spending your $15 worth however you want to, doing whatever you want to. My point was don't come here and thump your chest about how you and 30 of your buddies are uber because you roll dozens of bases, and that you are the only ones who have it all figured out....

I personally think the game needs all types. I wasn't the one who threw it out there that only the "win the war / land grabbers" composed the real core of AH is "supposed" to be about...

That all being said....  Yes, you are sad and lame.  :lol
« Last Edit: April 04, 2011, 09:08:46 PM by Reaper90 »
Floyd
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Offline moot

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #87 on: April 04, 2011, 08:43:42 PM »
Then by your own infinite wisdom
winning or losin's what's irrelevant.  How good the fight was is the only difference.
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Offline Reaper90

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #88 on: April 04, 2011, 09:09:07 PM »
winning or losin's what's irrelevant.  How good the fight was is the only difference.

Truth.
Floyd
'Murican dude in a Brit Squad flying Russian birds, drinking Canadian whiskey

Offline bmwgs

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Re: Smash and Grab
« Reply #89 on: April 04, 2011, 09:37:06 PM »
Fall into the category of a game?  It is a game.  

You don't really have war in sports.  War isn't fair.  Sports are built on rules.  Break the rules and you're disqualified. In sports you're expected to play fair and have ... sportsmanship. No such thing in war. There are no rules in war.  There are rules in AH, the only special thing about them is that they are set by the game makers IE HTC because players can't be trusted with self-policing.  EG friendly fire.  Spying is one rule you'll get punished for.  Double accounting, same.  So why aren't these and any other "exploits" allowed?  Because this is a game.

Whereas successful war making depends, hinges on finding a better "exploit" than the other guy.  It isn't about fun. These things are borderline hair splitting nuances but.. They're the difference between the reality of war and reality of games.  Rules of war apply to games, and sometimes vice versa, but it's playing on words to choose the word "war" like it was a better description of AH than "game".

I said I would take the bait and I did, but I guess I am missing your point.

You state that "you don't really have war in sports"  
Websters definition 2b is "a struggle or competition between opposing forces or for a particular end"

Not sure what sport you are talking about, but all the team sports I have played were competition between opposing forces.  Nothing in the definition of war says it has to be fair.

Why you are trying to make me believe that Aces High is not a sport, I'm not sure.  I never said it was.  I stated in an earlier post Aces High does not fall into the "sports" category, but I did say by definition you can have a war between sides in sports.

As for the written rules for Aces High.  Please post the link to them, I would love to read them.  I know of the forum rules and I know how HiTech feels about cheating and spying, which I agree with, but all this came from posts in the forum.  I have never seen any written rules concerning game play.  So if we have rules as they have in sports, I would like to see them so I can make sure not to violate them.

You then try to explain to me the difference war and reality of games.  In an earlier post I stated;

"No one should try to compare this game to a real life war or conflict".  Don't know how I could state that clearer.

Then you state  "Rules of war apply to games" but in the same post you stated "There are no rules in war."  I think I know what you are trying to say here, but it is rather foggy since I have never seen the actual documented rules of this game.  I do know by some of HiTech posts what actions he considers not acceptable, but I still have not seen any book or document of rules concerning game play.  

The word war can be used to describe the game dynamics of Aces High.  On the front page of the website it states "A war rages on the ground and at sea".

Let me see if I can get across what I was trying to say a little differently.  

In my first post, if it did not come through clear, is I believe people get all worked up when someone says this game is or is about war.  By the definition it is about war and is clearly backed up by Websters definition, and even by the creator on the Aces High web page.  I have never and will never state except by definition that this game in any way reflects the real life horrors of war.  I am just simply saying there is a  cartoon war going on in this cartoon game.

 :salute

Getting my post count up with my OPINIONs

Fred  

"
« Last Edit: April 04, 2011, 09:39:22 PM by bmwgs »
One of the serious problems in planning the fight against American doctrine, is that the Americans do not read their manuals, nor do they feel any obligation to follow their doctrine... - From a Soviet Junior Lt's Notebook