Author Topic: Using joystick for views, jittery  (Read 622 times)

Offline pembquist

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Using joystick for views, jittery
« on: April 23, 2011, 05:58:23 PM »
I was trying a second joystick instead of a mouse for views.  Its a saitek with throttle but without the twisty.  The views are very jittery and damping or dead band don't make any difference.  I assume its that the joystick keep sending different values while in the same position.  Any advice on how to fix this, are there joysticks that wouldn't do this? My main joystick is an ms sidewinder FF and the numbers on the setup page don't stay still either.
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Offline ebfd11

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2011, 08:52:16 PM »
One thing you can do is try to calibrate the joystick in the game and see where that goes. If you still have the problem you might be drawing too much from the usb port and the best thing is to get a powered USB port. That might be the problem right there. Try that and see what happens.

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Offline The Fugitive

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2011, 08:56:38 PM »
why would you want to use another joystick for your views? Thats what your doing right, a second stick, you pull it left and your view looks left and so on right? Using a hat switch on the second stick would switch the views faster, and you would lose the "jittery" problem using an analog axis is giving you.

Offline guncrasher

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2011, 09:05:09 PM »
also check your settings you may have 2 joysticks mapped to do views.  found out i had that in my x-52, i only use the throttle but had the stick itself still mapped.  I removed the mapping and things got better.

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Offline pembquist

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2011, 01:52:26 AM »
Ill try the suggestions ty.  To answer the question of why I would want to use a second joystick:  To see what its like to pan around instead of being locked into views. 
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Offline Warmongo

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2011, 07:20:23 AM »
Ill try the suggestions ty.  To answer the question of why I would want to use a second joystick:  To see what its like to pan around instead of being locked into views. 

My two cents. Use hat for views with another button for up view modifier. F8 will let you pan with the hat if you have to. No jitters. :D

Offline Tigger29

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2011, 11:50:04 AM »
Wow!  Just thinking about that kind of setup (one joystick for views) just seems so... complicated!  Really!  To me, it would be like typing on a keyboard with one hand, and playing a piano at the same time with the other  :O

If you really want to immerse yourself, go buy a trackIR setup... or you can build a Freetrack setup, or if you have a webcam you can play with "FaceTrackNoIR" software.  It's free and the camera will 'watch' your face and move your views accordingly.

Offline pembquist

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2011, 03:58:29 PM »
I know how to use the hat switch with an up button.  Why is it that when people cant answer a question about how to fix something so that it works as intended they feel that it is perfectly ok to go off on a tangent about how one shouldn't be trying to do it anyway. 

Since we are headed there anyway I'll explain a little more.  I use the traditional hat switch + up modifier that probably everybody does.  Thats fine.  I tried the mouse for views a couple times and while intriguing its not very muscle memoryish, the joystick is actually kind of neat especially if you remove the centering spring, the thing is I can't really evaluate it yet as its too jittery.  I'd like to experiment with a leetle joystick you could use with one finger.  The trak IR thing sounds fine but involves buying more stuff.  As to piano playing and typing, I don't think thats really accurate.  Think playing a drumkit, or cyclic-collective-pedals in a helicopter.  You already use two hands  with fingers doing different things, hat switch, throttle, check six, transmit, primary secondary guns, wep, zoom, map view.  And you pick it up pretty fast.  I don't understand why people have to be so dismissive of other ways of doing things, especially if they haven't tried them for themselves.

Thank you for your input.
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Offline Tigger29

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2011, 04:20:54 PM »
Why is it that people come on here asking for help and then end up throwing a fit because they don't like what they are told?

The reason that we are dismissive of your idea is the same reason why no one is using a joystick for what you describe... because it is IMPRACTICAL and does not help in the game.  Simply put, it's a really bad idea.  It makes immersion much worse, and it actually slows down your response time, which is CRITICAL for being successful in this game.  This isn't Microsoft flight simulator where you have plenty of time to look around and enjoy the view.. no this is much different.  I would imagine that while it is possible to get used to using one hand for looking around and another for flying, but how are you going to control your throttle?  You'll have to take your hand off of either stick to do so which means you'll lose control of your flight surfaces, OR your view will be stuck in one position during that critical half of a second.  Either way, it's detrimental to your Aces High success.

This is why HAT switches (or head tracking) work so well.. it allows you to adjust your views without neglecting anything else.

So you ask why it acts so wonky?  It's because the pots in the joystick are either shot, or just not very good quality.  You can easily verify for yourself in Aces High if the values are truly fluctuating like you suspect.  There is no need to ask our advice to figure that one out.

Yes, trackIR costs money, which is why I also recommend FACETRACKNOIR why is FREE and will use a webcam instead if you already have one.

Next time you come on asking for advice, try listening to what we are telling you instead of just urinating on us.  If we are 'dismissing' your ideas, then there is probably a really good reason for it.

Offline Vulcan

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2011, 04:29:28 AM »
Wow!  Just thinking about that kind of setup (one joystick for views) just seems so... complicated!  Really!  To me, it would be like typing on a keyboard with one hand, and playing a piano at the same time with the other  :O

If you really want to immerse yourself, go buy a trackIR setup... or you can build a Freetrack setup, or if you have a webcam you can play with "FaceTrackNoIR" software.  It's free and the camera will 'watch' your face and move your views accordingly.

If you really REALLY want to immerse yourself watch this space: http://www.vuzix.com/consumer/products_wrap_1200vr.html

The resolution, modern 3D driver support, and 6dof has me thinking it's time to hang up my old headset for one of these :D

Offline Warmongo

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #10 on: April 27, 2011, 09:02:16 AM »
Why is it that people come on here asking for help and then end up throwing a fit because they don't like what they are told?

The reason that we are dismissive of your idea is the same reason why no one is using a joystick for what you describe... because it is IMPRACTICAL and does not help in the game.  Simply put, it's a really bad idea.  It makes immersion much worse, and it actually slows down your response time, which is CRITICAL for being successful in this game.  This isn't Microsoft flight simulator where you have plenty of time to look around and enjoy the view.. no this is much different.  I would imagine that while it is possible to get used to using one hand for looking around and another for flying, but how are you going to control your throttle?  You'll have to take your hand off of either stick to do so which means you'll lose control of your flight surfaces, OR your view will be stuck in one position during that critical half of a second.  Either way, it's detrimental to your Aces High success.

This is why HAT switches (or head tracking) work so well.. it allows you to adjust your views without neglecting anything else.


So you ask why it acts so wonky?  It's because the pots in the joystick are either shot, or just not very good quality.  You can easily verify for yourself in Aces High if the values are truly fluctuating like you suspect.  There is no need to ask our advice to figure that one out.

Yes, trackIR costs money, which is why I also recommend FACETRACKNOIR why is FREE and will use a webcam instead if you already have one.

Next time you come on asking for advice, try listening to what we are telling you instead of just urinating on us.  If we are 'dismissing' your ideas, then there is probably a really good reason for it.

I could not have said it any better. Thank you! :bhead :bhead :bhead

Offline pembquist

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Re: Using joystick for views, jittery
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2011, 03:49:05 PM »
Not Flame Bait:

No urination was intended.  I was only asking a rhetorical question about a phenomena that has been around since the first BBS.  There were 2 replies that were attempts to help solve the jitters and 3 that said I shouldn't use a joystick to pan views anyway.  If anybody is offended all I can say is that that was not my intent.  I think we have all seen how innocuous remarks lead to a silly tit for tat thing no one really enjoys.

Thanks for all your answers and opinions.

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